[Ringodoggie]

Well, I must say, I am not only disappointed, I am shocked and amazed.

Both CBD and THC went up dramatically with both time and temperature.

I really have to wonder if these results are strain specific. I am going to run these exact same tests on Landrace Afghan and see if the THC responds the same way.

I expected the CBD to increase with time and temp based on what I've been reading. However, the results show it increases A LOT.

What surprised me was to see THC doing the same thing. There is considerable more THC on the 290F 120 minute samples than there is on the 240F for 40 minutes.

Both THC and CBD continued to increase with each sample.

I'll post a couple pictures but it's really hard for you to see the dramatic difference that I can see with my naked eye. The camera and lighting just don't capture the true color and gradient.

Pic 1 is the setup showing the time and temp of each dry sample.

Pic 2 is the extract. Amazing color change with time and temp change, Green to brown

Pic 3. Immediate results already show shocking results

Pic 4 and 5 just time passing.

[Ringodoggie]

Only 5 pics per post.. LOL Continued...

First 2 pics are CBD in order of the samples.

Second 2 pics are THC

I tried to get the pics to show the dramatic difference but it's so hard with the camera.

[Ringodoggie]

So, I sure am hoping that this is strain specific because if it's not, I have been decarbing my pot wrong for 50 years....... LMAO And, so have most of you. LOL

290F for 2 HOURS!!!!!! Showing an increase in THC the entire way????

This has to be strain specific.

I am going to run the TLC tests tomorrow. We'll see if they concur.

[brown_thumb]

Watching with keen interest.

[Gray Wolf]

Originally Posted by Ringodoggie

I was reading something about decarbing CBD the other day and it mentioned that, in order to convert CBDa to CBD, you need to heat it to 280F for 60 to 90 minutes.

Now, correct me if I'm wrong but at that temperature and for that duration, you are going to have converted just about all your THC to CBN.

So, if I want to make capsules that maximize the CBD and the THC, I can't.

I am either going to maximize the THC at 240F for 40 minutes and never even activate the CBD. Or, I am going to go higher and longer and activate the CBD but kill all my THC.

I would really like the effects of both in my pills but it's really more about the CBD. I have to wonder how much THC I'm going to lose.

I do have 2 more plates for my TLC kit so I could run some comparisons on 40 minutes and 90 minutes.

Any comments on this? Anyone else trying to maximize both THC and CBD in your edibles?

Thanks

That sounds excessive. We decarboxylate at 121C/250F, and it takes only around 30 minutes for everything.

[Maple_Flail]

Originally Posted by Ringodoggie

Well, I must say, I am not only disappointed, I am shocked and amazed.

Both CBD and THC went up dramatically with both time and temperature.

I really have to wonder if these results are strain specific. I am going to run these exact same tests on Landrace Afghan and see if the THC responds the same way.

I expected the CBD to increase with time and temp based on what I've been reading. However, the results show it increases A LOT.

What surprised me was to see THC doing the same thing. There is considerable more THC on the 290F 120 minute samples than there is on the 240F for 40 minutes.

Both THC and CBD continued to increase with each sample.

I'll post a couple pictures but it's really hard for you to see the dramatic difference that I can see with my naked eye. The camera and lighting just don't capture the true color and gradient.

Pic 1 is the setup showing the time and temp of each dry sample.

Pic 2 is the extract. Amazing color change with time and temp change, Green to brown

Pic 3. Immediate results already show shocking results

Pic 4 and 5 just time passing.

You sir are a gentleman and a scholar.

Thank you for vindicating my method can't wait for TLC test.

The strain specificness would likely come down to the average trichome size, so afghani's with their large trichomes would likely be those kinda out lyers

[Ringodoggie]

Originally Posted by Gray Wolf

That sounds excessive. We decarboxylate at 121C/250F, and it takes only around 30 minutes for everything.

2 questions....

1. Are you including a 1:1 CBD/THC strain in that statement or always high THC, low CBD?

2. Have you ever tested for potency after decarbing to determine if your time and temp were actually optimal?

It would be great if someone with a 1:1 strain and the ability to run these tests would duplicate my tests to confirm or deny the results.

[Ringodoggie]

Here is another patent showing CBD decarbing done at times and temperatures that we currently feel are excessive.

(CBDA) in Hemp Oil, which can start with virgin C02 extracted hemp oil that has been extracted from the whole plant. The virgin C02 extracted hemp oil generally has large amounts of cannabidiolic acid (CBDA), the precursor to cannabidiol (CBD). The virgin hemp oil can be decarboxylated by heating to about 150° C, e.g., to a temperature in the range of 140° C to 160° C between 10 - 18 hours, to convert the CBDA to CBD. This procedure can be carried out in a feed tank equipped with a heat transfer oil filled jacket and a venting port to prevent pressure from building up in the vessel.


https://patents.google.com/patent/WO2016004410A1/en

I believe it may be time to re-evaluate the way we have been decarbing for our entire lives. LOL

EDIT:

Originally Posted by Maple_Flail

Phase change has an effect on decarb properties. if it had been Decarb prior to extraction it would have taken less time as there would be more solid making space for the heated air to penetrate everything.

OK, that makes sense. We'll see if we can find a patent where they use flowers vs oil. Still, my tests were done with fowers and show the same pattern of results.

[Maple_Flail]

Originally Posted by Ringodoggie

2 questions....

1. Are you including a 1:1 CBD/THC strain in that statement or always high THC, low CBD?

2. Have you ever tested for potency after decarbing to determine if your time and temp were actually optimal?

It would be great if someone with a 1:1 strain and the ability to run these tests would duplicate my tests to confirm or deny the results.

I have a couple thoughts to add to this.

How many people monitor the actual temperature near the bud? anecdotally, it appears only the minority of people decarbing seem to be looking at that, again i could be wrong its all perception on this one.

I see light bulbs go off in many patients when i make the comparison to cooking meats like chicken, If you are not super comfortable in the kitchen are you about to take the look of the meat for granted when it could get your sick?

again it comes back to the same reasoning, everyone's oven of method of decarb slightlys atleast varys by noticeable amounts when you take a large sample size.

as to the ~1:~1 stuff(hard to find a dead on 1:1), in my area(it may be different in other provinces), for the most part Lp's are the only ones actually testing for levels. and getting from them adds a few things to the balance. Docter gateway, "dose" gateway, and "stock" gateway.

there are other environmental aspects so to speak that come into IMHO very slight effect, Elevation so to speak.

we know water is affected by a certain point. we don't know exactly how the acids and oils react under similar situations if the effect is less or greater who really knows. it also has an effect on how that person is processing as a whole IE sealed vessel Vs open sheet.

also, would like to state, even before this thread. The want to prove these things isn't the hindering factor right now, atleast for me. The costs and requirements are too large right now for the average person to do this (in canada, again caveat canada #derp) 57% of the cost of these tests is licensing fees going to the government for testing a "restricted" substance. So basic Thc/CBD.. 250+taxes, you want extended cannabinoid testing, another 250+tax on top, Oh you want to know your terps, again another 250+tax, oh you want the sequestered terps? sorry that will be another 250+tax on and BTW we have to put your organically grown medicine that you grew yourself? (its forbidden to test something you didn't grow without a grow license) we have to do this bs test you cannot opt out of and base fee is 178$+taxes... prices will drop atleast 50% when it is rescheduled in this country

not even getting into the amount of the sample these so called labs ask for to actually testing your crap and triple checking it because they are not very careful when they do it.

[Maple_Flail]

Originally Posted by Ringodoggie

Here is another patent showing CBD decarbing done at times and temperatures that we currently feel are excessive.

(CBDA) in Hemp Oil, which can start with virgin C02 extracted hemp oil that has been extracted from the whole plant. The virgin C02 extracted hemp oil generally has large amounts of cannabidiolic acid (CBDA), the precursor to cannabidiol (CBD). The virgin hemp oil can be decarboxylated by heating to about 150° C, e.g., to a temperature in the range of 140° C to 160° C between 10 - 18 hours, to convert the CBDA to CBD. This procedure can be carried out in a feed tank equipped with a heat transfer oil filled jacket and a venting port to prevent pressure from building up in the vessel.


https://patents.google.com/patent/WO2016004410A1/en

I believe it may be time to re-evaluate the way we have been decarbing for our entire lives. LOL

Phase change has an effect on decarb properties. if it had been Decarb prior to extraction it would have taken less time as there would be more solid making space for the heated air to penetrate everything.