ELECTRIC HELP: Advice on 4k Light Timer & Outlet.....

johnnyla · Dec 27, 2009

Ok, so i had my electirician rig me a 4 outlet metal box with two 30 amp 120 lines per outlet. i do not have 220 going to the spot so that's why it's 120.

Now the problem is, i realized a little too late that i will need to control these lights on 12/12 and i don't think i can fit 4 timers into that 4 outlet box. So now what?

I could ghetto rig it 4 power strips and plug the timers into that and then the lights into those but that seems a little too much like Clark Griswald in Christmas Vacation with the spaghetti wires everywhere.

My other though was to get the ILS4 light controller. Sooooo my question is this, how do i hook up the ILS4 light controller if i have two 30 amp 120 lines (total of 60 AMPS)currently running into a 4 outlet box?

Here are pics of the controller i am talking about, and the box i currently have. Any help would be appreciated and i am open to other suggestions. Just FYI i do not have 240 power and can't really afford to have the guy come back out.

***so i have one 30 AMP 120 line powering the left 2 outlets and one 30 AMP 120 line powering the second two outlets. how do i hook up this light controller and is this the best solution?

madpenguin · Dec 27, 2009

Dude... Crop that picture man. No faces please. Compliant or not.

Read up top on the sticky.

I'd have a short nipple (EMT conduit) coming out the side of that 4 square and get a 6x6x4 enclosure. Mount a 30A DPDT relay. Buy just a little bit of #10awg, reroute the incoming feed for that 4 square to the line side relay, conductors coming off the load side relay to feed the receptacles. Punch in a simplex receptacle off the relay box to plug a digital timer into. SJO cord plugged into the timer and then routed back into the relay box for the center contacts.

That's just one way you could do it fairly inexpensive.

johnnyla · Dec 27, 2009

lol i took that photo off google.

what is a sticky and where do i find them?

Hey man thanks for the help and your affordable alternative but that was greek to me

do you know how to hook up that controller with two 30 amp 120 lines?

sparkjumper · Dec 27, 2009

If you have room in the panel,I'd change one or both of the circuits to 220V by using a 2 pole 30A breaker and landing both black and white wires on the breaker,ground remains untouched.Now you can put a wh40 before your 4 sq box and be good to go.You can run 4 1K fixtures on a single 240V 30A circuit

madpenguin · Dec 27, 2009

Yep. That would be another good way to do it. A tad more expensive than the relay and enclosure but probably not by much.

As far as a sticky.... Look all the way up top of this forum. A sticky is a post that never moves and is "stuck" at the top of the forum board. The name of the thread is "Growroom electricity and wiring", or something along those lines.

I know it's tempting to just have people tell you exactly what to do without reading but pretty much all alternatives have been covered in that sticky already so I and/or sparkjumper would just be repeating ourselves.

That's why it's a sticky. The idea is to read it before you post. icmag uses alot of bandwidth so if we can help cut down on that by finding existing information, then all the better.

PharmaCan · Dec 27, 2009

You may already have 240v in that box and not even know it. It depends on if your two hot legs are run off one bus or both. Either way, getting 240 to that box is a piece of cake, you just have to decide what you want to with it. Do you need any 120v coming from that outlet, or are you okay with straight 240v?

I'm with Sparkjumper on this one. What MP suggests is copesthetic, and a relay is a good idea for switching 4k, it just seems a little more complicated for a neophyte to wire. The 240v timer has a good set of relays inside and it's pretty straightforward to wire.

If this is going over your head, carefully pull the receptacles from the box and take a couple pics that clearly show the wires; someone will keep you going in the right direction.

PC

johnnyla · Dec 27, 2009

guys thank you but i said i only have 120. i do not have 240 capabilities.

there are two 30 amp wires going to the room hooked up to double pole reakers.

i'll look for the stickies. thank you.

oh and i def do not have 240. i had the electrician run a 240 cable and he was going to hook up a 30amp breaker and then he found out after he ran the wire there is only 120 coming to the main panel so he hooked up two 30 amp breakers to each of the hot wires for two 120 lines instead of 1 240. make sense?

and i can't find those stickies. i'm not the only one. i appreciate the advice but you could have gave me the info i was looking for using less bandwidth then telling me about stickies.

johnnyla · Dec 27, 2009

i was just wondering if can hook up that controller with two 30 amp 120 lines instead of one 240 line or one 120 line. thanks.

mexilandrace · Dec 27, 2009

dude, if you have 110 you have 220 capabilities.

Think of it this way:

110+110=220, that is basically what you end up doing.

wait, you have 110 going to the main panel? are you in like a duplex or a multiplex or something?

johnnyla · Dec 27, 2009

right. only 120 coming to the panel.

i found the stickies but not what i was looking for. as far as bandwidth is concerned, as madpenguin mentioned, i appreciate those who posted but by not reading that i only have 120 wasted way more bandwidth than answering "yes" or "no" as to wether or not i can wire that controller with TWO 30 amp 120 lines, or wether i can find 4 timers to hook up into that 4 outlet box, or my ghetto rig idea. in fact non has answered any of the original questions and is offering way more complicated scenarios and solutions so far.

i do appreciate it though. i'm sure someone is close to helping me figure it out.

Thanks!!!!!!!

PharmaCan · Dec 27, 2009

johnnyla said:
right. only 120 coming to the panel.

i found the stickies but not what i was looking for. as far as bandwidth is concerned, as madpenguin mentioned, i appreciate those who posted but by not reading that i only have 120 wasted way more bandwidth than answering "yes" or "no" as to wether or not i can wire that controller with TWO 30 amp 120 lines, or wether i can find 4 timers to hook up into that 4 outlet box, or my ghetto rig idea. in fact non has answered any of the original questions and is offering way more complicated scenarios and solutions so far.

i do appreciate it though. i'm sure someone is close to helping me figure it out.

Thanks!!!!!!!

ROFL - I thought I read you had 240v back at the panel. :smokeit:

Oh well, wtf do you expect when you ask questions of a bunch of stoners?

I'm not familiar with the type of contoller you want to hook up. 240v circuitry doesn't require a neutral wire, so maybe 120v would work with that, maybe it won't. Regardless, what MP suggested makes the best sense with a 120v line. That way, you could use only one of any old timer because all it will switch is the relay and then you can plug the lights directly into the receptacles. If you go to the store and buy the parts he suggested, even if you don't know wtf they are, you'll have everything you need and someone can give you a step-by-step on hooking it up.

As far as bandwidth is concerned - you try typing the same damn thing about 20 times and see how anxious you are to type it again. The Sparky's here are only trying to help, and sometimes that means referring you to a link to do some of your own research. No need to get snippy about it. ...bandwidth my ass... lol

PC

mexilandrace · Dec 27, 2009

just plug a 15 amp timer into each plug then

PharmaCan · Dec 27, 2009

mexilandrace said:
dude, if you have 110 you have 220 capabilities.

Think of it this way:

110+110=220, that is basically what you end up doing.

wait, you have 110 going to the main panel? are you in like a duplex or a multiplex or something?

This is and isn't true. You're right about the theory, but the 120v legs have to come off opposite sides of the electrical sine wave. If you combine two 120v's from the same side, you simply have 120v going thru a bigger wire.

PC

mexilandrace · Dec 27, 2009

conceptual explanations need not be precise.

PharmaCan · Dec 27, 2009

mexilandrace said:
conceptual explanations need not be precise.

Very true, and that's why I replied nicely. My only point was to clarify to the OP, or anyone else that might be trying to learn something from this thread, that he can't just combine any two 120v wires and come up with 240v. No offense intended.

PC

johnnyla · Dec 27, 2009

thanks a lot Sparks!!!!!

yeah it's two 120 lines coming from the same side. only 120 coming into the panel now.

i would gladly put 4 timers into that 4 outlet box but i don't think 4 timers will fit into that small box.

thanks!!!!

johnnyla · Dec 27, 2009

madpenguin said:
Dude... Crop that picture man. No faces please. Compliant or not.

Read up top on the sticky.

I'd have a short nipple (EMT conduit) coming out the side of that 4 square and get a 6x6x4 enclosure. Mount a 30A DPDT relay. Buy just a little bit of #10awg, reroute the incoming feed for that 4 square to the line side relay, conductors coming off the load side relay to feed the receptacles. Punch in a simplex receptacle off the relay box to plug a digital timer into. SJO cord plugged into the timer and then routed back into the relay box for the center contacts.

That's just one way you could do it fairly inexpensive.

OK, so after morning coffee this makes more sense. however, wouldn't i need two 30 AMP relays since i have TWO 30 AMP 120 lines. one 30 AMP 120 line powering left two outlets and one 30 AMP 120 line powering right two outlets.

it was originally ran for 240 until the guy realized after the fact there was no 240, but since 240 is two 120 lines plus a couple others, he just hooked up that line to two 30amp breakers and fed on hot 30 amp wire to the left two breakers and the second 30amp wire to the right two outlets. i DO NOT have 240 at the panel. the panel is 120. don't ask, don't tell.

PharmaCan · Dec 27, 2009

johnnyla said:
OK, so after morning coffee this makes more sense. however, wouldn't i need two 30 AMP relays since i have TWO 30 AMP 120 lines. one 30 AMP 120 line powering left two outlets and one 30 AMP 120 line powering right two outlets.

it was originally ran for 240 until the guy realized after the fact there was no 240, but since 240 is two 120 lines plus a couple others, he just hooked up that line to two 30amp breakers and fed on hot 30 amp wire to the left two breakers and the second 30amp wire to the right two outlets. i DO NOT have 240 at the panel. the panel is 120. don't ask, don't tell.

The one relay controls both hot legs. You don't have to break (switch) the neutral lines, just the hots.

You probably (maybe) need an unswitched 120v for the timer, so what you'd do is disconnect the black wire from one receptacle and run a jumper from the hot and neutral sides of the other receptacle. Run both hot wires through the relay then one would go back to the original receptacle and one would go to a new, third receptacle, along with the neutral and grounds you jumped from the other receptacle. If you don't need an always-on timer receptacle from this set-up, just disconnect both hot wires, connect them to the relay, connect new wires to the other end of the relay and run them back to the receptacles.

PC

johnnyla · Dec 27, 2009

PharmaCan said:
The one relay controls both hot legs. You don't have to break (switch) the neutral lines, just the hots.

You probably (maybe) need an unswitched 120v for the timer, so what you'd do is disconnect the black wire from one receptacle and run a jumper from the hot and neutral sides of the other receptacle. Run both hot wires through the relay then one would go back to the original receptacle and one would go to a new, third receptacle, along with the neutral and grounds you jumped from the other receptacle. If you don't need an always-on timer receptacle from this set-up, just disconnect both hot wires, connect them to the relay, connect new wires to the other end of the relay and run them back to the receptacles.

PC

thanks mang!!! you do realize though that the heavy gauge wire ran from receptacle to panel was intended for a 30 amp 240 breaker until he realized it was only 120 at the panel. at that point he said "no problem, i wire it for 120, use two 30 amp breakers" so one 30 amp breaker for the left side of that 4 outlet box, and 30 amp breaker to the right two outlets. ***120V*** that's the way it is right now.

i would buy that controller if i knew it would work. maybe i'm trippin', but i'm worried that i can't hook up a light controller to two hot wires that each have their own breaker. i'm confused.

thanks so much!!!!

johnnyla · Dec 27, 2009

so i think i am going to just run short extension heavy guage wire from each of these outlets and have each light on a separate timer.

i have two 30amp circuits running to this 4 outlet box, one circuit per 2 outlets so that's where i'm confused as most timer boxes wether they are DIY or store bought, are probably hooked up to once circuit.

sorry i'm a stoner too so probably didn't explain myself right mang.

here is a picture of the size of the box like the one i have.

two 30 amp circuits powering one 4 outlet box. i need to be able to switch all four lights on and off via timer.

thanks for bearing with me and helping me burn bandwidth and rainforests. i'll buy some carbon tax credits from Al Gore aka Ozone Man.

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