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Leaves curling bad, NEED HELP

sednal

Active member
Setup:
I am currently growing Sensi Seeds Femenized Big Bud in a GL80 (2.5'X2.5'X6') tent with a 400w air cooled HPS light system. I am using LC's soiless mix #2 with the full botanicare line along with calmag and silica added at the appropriate times. They are waterd with distilled water and nuted every 3rd watering, or as needed with half or less doses as listed on botanicare bottles.

Problem:
The plants are now 2 weeks into flower after a 27 day veg period under floros. About a week ago i noticed that the top sets of leaves, closest to the light, were starting to curl upwards, and in from the sides, almost like praying hands. I posted in the Infirmery but got mixed answers as to what was wrong. I was told too much water, under water, too much heat, and salt build up. The over water and underwatering didnt make to much sense to me because i watered them whenever they were competly dry. I was mainly convinced it was the temps, becasue as of last week, the hood was not air cooled and temps were reaching 86-88 degrees. Now that the hood is cool the room does not go over 76, and is around 69 when the light is off.

Problem is, they plants have gotten worse. They are now all showing severe curing, and not just at the tops, but at lower leaves as well.

Now it seems that the salt build up could be the problem, as the temps have been addressed. Someone told me to flush the soil with water to get rid of the salt build up, but i was under the impression you cannot flush the salts from a fully organic medium with just water. Heres some pics to show u what they are looking like. They were waterd on saturday until plenty of run off came out...

If anyone has any ideas of whats happening it would be greatly appreciated.
 

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sednal

Active member
I said i am using the full line of Botanicare and feed them every third watering, or as needed, with half doses or less.

Stated above in previous post.

Please read full post before posting.
 

thekingofNY

Cannasseur
Post in the infirmary, you will get more help there, and don't forget to fill out the form.

Before even looking at the pix i was gonna say nitrogen burn, but the leafs are curling the wrong way for that. I thought it was heat related when the curl upwards, but i can't remember for sure.
 

SpasticGramps

Don't Drone Me, Bro!
ICMag Donor
Veteran
The leaves are curled because the plant can't breath properly. If you moved the lights and fixed the heat then that's not it. If you pH is off that could be locking you out, or too much nutes. Do you have a ppm and pH meter? I highly recommend it. I'd do what durgamata said and flush the hell out of the soil and go from their. I don't have any experience with organics, so I don't know if it will flush it all, but it certainly won't hurt anything. Good luck.
 

sednal

Active member
ph is mostly regulated with fully organic grows and it definitively is not over nueting. Those pics were taken after being without neuts for 8 days. And in that time they were watered with distilled water once and once with quater to half recommended doses of cal-mag and silica. Ph levels of runoff is within ideal parameters.
 

B.C.

Non Conformist
Veteran
Hi Sednal, jus got yer PM.

Hi Sednal, jus got yer PM.

I know everyone tells ya to add cal mag when ya use RO, but in this case I think the lime and the pb pro for soil has you covered. I think the excess mag is makin yer leaves curl in like that. I'd leave out the cal mag, silica, and the liquid karma ( if yer using that too ) for awhile and see if it don't straighten up.

With the worm castings in there the PH will be no problem. I can't see there being too much salt build up either. Jus stick with the pb for soil fera awhile and I think they grow right out of it.

Good or bad, right or wrong, please let us know what happens so other may learn from this aswell. Much luck to you my friend, but I think yul be fine. Take care... BC
 

fireman

Member
I am pretty sure that is a heat problem. The leaves curl like that in order to shade themselves from the heat, in a sense.

How long has it been since you have fixed the heat problem? Takes a couple days to rebound if it hasn`t been that long


fireman
 
J

JackTheGrower

I had some curl under CFL and feeding with low pH liquids.

It was a sensitive plant.

My solution was to dilute the feeding liquid more.
 

hazy

Active member
Veteran
What you have is a manganese toxicity caused by the pH in your rootzone being too low. Caused by nute concentrations. Which could be made worse by letting the medium get too dry between waterings.

Flush.

Then hit it with only mild nutes.

When folks say you can't flush an organic medium, they mean stuff like compost, manure, blood meal, bone meal, etc.
Of course you can flush out all the salts that have already been made ready for the plant by microbes. You can also flush out calcium and lower pH like that.
 

Microbeman

The Logical Gardener
ICMag Donor
Veteran
I have no idea what botanicare is and likely neither do you (no offense intended). If you are using 'true' organics then chasing pH is a waste of time. I suspect you have overloaded your plants/soil and would suggest you use only plain water and ride it out and next time just use good soil with compost or vermicompost and use actual substances like fish hydrolysate, kelp meal, etc.

Also: plain dechlorinated water or spring water is superior to distilled or RO water
 

Microbeman

The Logical Gardener
ICMag Donor
Veteran
Just a wee point. Some people seem to think that nutrients made available by microbial interaction just end up sitting there, available to be flushed away. To my knowledge it does not work that way. It is a controlled system, with the plant in charge. It can be screwed up when we do things like smother the soil with 'stuff' we think is organic or mix in non-composted substances.
 

IWanaGetHiSoHi

Active member
Botanicare is a Huge company not a single product. They make Pure Blend products as well as a shitload of other plant products. Parented by American Agritech they're Pioneers in the Hydroponic "industry". You're clueless microbeman ... no offense intended. The OP is in a soilless mix not soil.
 

fireman

Member
What you have is a manganese toxicity caused by the pH in your rootzone being too low. Caused by nute concentrations. Which could be made worse by letting the medium get too dry between waterings.

Flush.

Then hit it with only mild nutes.

When folks say you can't flush an organic medium, they mean stuff like compost, manure, blood meal, bone meal, etc.
Of course you can flush out all the salts that have already been made ready for the plant by microbes. You can also flush out calcium and lower pH like that.

I have to agree with hazy on this one after second thought. I just assumed that since mag toxicity never really manifests its self visibly, it wasnt it. Good call hazy thats why a myriad of heads is better than one.


Fireman:joint:

sednal listen to hazy on this one
 

sednal

Active member
good info. And microbeman i know what i am feeding my plants. Thanks alot hazy, will do just that. Also stating to notice some general defficincies so i believe they could need some neuts soon, like a little dose of pro bloom. Its just hard because they are showing so many different signs...
 

B.C.

Non Conformist
Veteran
I have no idea what botanicare is and likely neither do you (no offense intended). If you are using 'true' organics then chasing pH is a waste of time. I suspect you have overloaded your plants/soil and would suggest you use only plain water and ride it out and next time just use good soil with compost or vermicompost and use actual substances like fish hydrolysate, kelp meal, etc.

Wow Tim?!? that was a rather pompous thing to say. How would one -not- take offence to a statement like that? ...... I'm not sure why you think everyone is so ignorant, but it may surprise you to know that there are a great number of people here who have been growing big happy healthy pot plants for years before you came along, many using Botanicare products. And guess what? they know what's in it! lol Btw, there's nothing wrong with LC's soil mix either, you should look into it, before you judge it. :2cents: BC
 
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