Set Up Costs for MMPR Grow Op

[Buddha1]

Its bad enough having to sell cheap ass ballasts because guys don't want to spend the extra $25 it would cost to have one that contains a Venture/Advanced core and the wholesalers wont bring in anything good. The industry is full of cheap fucks and then they bitch and whine about returns and bad batches.

What would you consider a good quality and cheap quality ballast???

Just curious, my digitals are about 3-4 years old, they are going to start crapping out soon. Don't know the name but I'm using the big gold adjustable(50%-75%-100%-110%), that aren't available anymore. Never had a hint of problems with them...ever. Wouldn't surprise me if I got another few years use.

Peace...B

PS. I'm quite happy with my Hortilux lamps...There $100.00 a pop, but I've never had a problem with them or a reason to use anything else.

 

[Buds Bundy]

What would you consider a good quality and cheap quality ballast???

Just curious, my digitals are about 3-4 years old, they are going to start crapping out soon. Don't know the name but I'm using the big gold adjustable(50%-75%-100%-110%), that aren't available anymore. Never had a hint of problems with them...ever. Wouldn't surprise me if I got another few years use.

Peace...B

PS. I'm quite happy with my Hortilux lamps...There $100.00 a pop, but I've never had a problem with them or a reason to use anything else.

Well as long as the ballast had a copper core and brand name inside the box with brand name cap/ignitor it should last for a while. There aren't too many made like that these days. Of hand Hydrotek had/had Starlight ballasts that had Sylvania raw ballasts inside.

For digital's I don't think it really matters these days, most seem to have the same return rates.

The big gold digital ones (are they light in weight?) are probably from Quality Wholesale, they were the ones before they came out with the Ace Ballast.

Not sure where you are located but $100 per Hortilux seems quite steep unless you're but fuck no where and the shipping for the store to get thems kills the price. I have to sell them at around $68+ tax and my last cost was $59 but that was about 6 months ago. It would be nice to make $20 on the bulb and it was like that in the early mid 2000's but when stores start low balling because they are hurting or laundering money there's not much you can do but to go head to head.

 

[Buddha1]

Not sure where you are located but $100 per Hortilux seems quite steep unless you're but fuck no where and the shipping for the store to get thems kills the price. I have to sell them at around $68+ tax and my last cost was $59 but that was about 6 months ago. It would be nice to make $20 on the bulb and it was like that in the early mid 2000's but when stores start low balling because they are hurting or laundering money there's not much you can do but to go head to head.

Sorry...I was rounding off the price...They were $90.00 tax included.

I'm at the far east end of the Fraser Valley. So not to many options except driving to Vancouver and that's $60.00 return trip. Its a 6 of this, and half dozen of that...situation. I like the convenience and it feel right to support the local shop.

Peace...B

 

[tomjonesthe3rd]

the biggest thing is just meeting the health canada standards. from what I've seen of a few of the mmpr growers so far, they're being run by clowns who just managed to convince some investors to "get in on legal weed" or they saved up their MMAR profits.

.

Gasp! But NO ONE was making a profit under MMAR!

 

[rongillispei]

I agree totally, I believe in response to market questions and new requirements, there is going to have to be a strong management / ownership group, not all having MMJ experience, but rather offset what the others lack. Also, a "prudent risk averse" approach will also be considered I believe.......here's to hoping anyway!!! haha

 

[SeedsOfFreedom]

The start up costs with this are not the problem. Its is the monthly stuff that starts before any flow of customers. I did a couple plans out ,and it will likely take 15000-20000$ monthly to keep things running for a 70000w setup with three employees. Much more money than the average person can shell out.

 

[med-man]

hi seeds

are you sure you arent missing a 0 there?

70 lights isnt much. hydro for that is roughly 3500. doubt rent meets that even

med-man

 

[SeedsOfFreedom]

hi seeds

are you sure you arent missing a 0 there?

70 lights isnt much. hydro for that is roughly 3500. doubt rent meets that even

med-man

No those are the numbers I had. In my plan there was lots of room for veg(more than 50$ a light/month). And each employee(3) getting paid like a human not a slave.70 lights would suffice. I want to focus on breeding still. Production would be only half my game. I also budgeted a few thousand a month for upkeep(bulbs,fans) and nutrients. I think these numbers are realistic. This is not a cheap business to run.

 

[med-man]

hey seeds

okay cool dude, respect!

i am not the best typer, and sometimes i screw up my numbers and letters, so i was just doublechecking your numbers

thanks for sharing man, and i agree, it is not cheap

med-man

 

[SeedsOfFreedom]

Has anyone looked into insurance for these businesses? I am just wondering. Since its legal business it shouldn't be a problem to get, but could be quite costly because of the risk involved? I am not sure, but big policy costs will up monthly costs even more.

 

[rongillispei]

The start up costs with this are not the problem. Its is the monthly stuff that starts before any flow of customers. I did a couple plans out ,and it will likely take 15000-20000$ monthly to keep things running for a 70000w setup with three employees. Much more money than the average person can shell out.

Yes your absolutely right, so when seeking investors / debt to build and buy equipment you need to also secure working capital that cover min 6mos...ours is going to have a cushion of 3 more months on top....so we could "run" the operation with no funds.....but the return on investment here is so high and potential is so massive, that working capital (riskiest type of loan because no collateral really) but....banks are interested in issuing lines of credit if the capital investment is there.....

Operating costs for our facility (Inc insurance and all other fixed costs) to be between $20k n $25k.....but again, once you have product and even minimal customers to start, you'll be cash flow positive by 9mos....so able to pay down the LOC from bank....

Don't forget debt / investor payments.....

I'm a fiend for numbers and believe in them....but starting small (our approach) and building out as demand requires....lowers the risk of running out of funds......again, my background is business and numbers and in all my years of commercial lending for the big banks, I've never seen such upside potential in any industry......now this being so new, there are other inherent risks, however as I have said before, I have people around me that know their roles and I'm confident that out managment team and future grower(s) is strong....and I think this is what's lacking at a lot of LPs currently....

 

[SeedsOfFreedom]

Yes your absolutely right, so when seeking investors / debt to build and buy equipment you need to also secure working capital that cover min 6mos...ours is going to have a cushion of 3 more months on top....so we could "run" the operation with no funds.....but the return on investment here is so high and potential is so massive, that working capital (riskiest type of loan because no collateral really) but....banks are interested in issuing lines of credit if the capital investment is there.....

Operating costs for our facility (Inc insurance and all other fixed costs) to be between $20k n $25k.....but again, once you have product and even minimal customers to start, you'll be cash flow positive by 9mos....so able to pay down the LOC from bank....

Don't forget debt / investor payments.....

I'm a fiend for numbers and believe in them....but starting small (our approach) and building out as demand requires....lowers the risk of running out of funds......again, my background is business and numbers and in all my years of commercial lending for the big banks, I've never seen such upside potential in any industry......now this being so new, there are other inherent risks, however as I have said before, I have people around me that know their roles and I'm confident that out managment team and future grower(s) is strong....and I think this is what's lacking at a lot of LPs currently....

I would want to count on no profit for 12-16 months, this may take longer to produce a profit than you think. From clones, to dried cured buds you are looking at 5-6 months, then you must get customers, and by then there will be many LP options. As long as a company could make it until recreational legalization future profits will be huge, but until then these companies could become temporary money pits, and they will fight for the (maybe)10000-15000 customers that will actually buy it.

 

[SeedsOfFreedom]

ron- how many lights was the 20-25k number about 100000w? If you don't mind sharing, they seem similar to my numbers anyway.

 

[rongillispei]

I would want to count on no profit for 12-16 months, this may take longer to produce a profit than you think. From clones, to dried cured buds you are looking at 5-6 months, then you must get customers, and by then there will be many LP options. As long as a company could make it until recreational legalization future profits will be huge, but until then these companies could become temporary money pits, and they will fight for the (maybe)10000-15000 customers that will actually buy it.

Agreed, but loses aren't always draining the most important thing for a new company, cash flow......I truly believe that with our working capital funds plus the minimal cash flow to begin can carry us through 3 years of "bottom line" profits, but remain cash flow positive allowing operations to operate at a loss......

Recreational is the golden goose for sure, but I've spent the past two weeks crunching numbers on exporting....I Believe until recreational is approved the export market is very viable and.lucrative.....i think a lot of people are not focusing on this gargantuan opportunity......I had a msg board / site dedicated to all things cannabis help me to do.a blind survey of us patients only and 62% responded they would switch to buying Canadian pot as it's regarded as some of the best in the world and most believed even if US did the same today as Canada is with MMPR it would take up to 5 years for the average grower to be able to march the quality and price the Canadian medicinal growers grow now, I mean the numbers are staggering.....and I truly believe the market values being thrown around are very conservative.....look at Colorado, they've had to continually adjust their forecast for tax dollars because the market is doing better than even the most aggressive numbers being predicted during the lead up to Jan 1

 

[SeedsOfFreedom]

The export market will grow, but at the moment, I only see Israel(med),Netherlands(med) and Uruguay as potential options. With the cost it takes to produce (roughly 1-3$ a gram) , you may see many countries avoid us as a potential supplier. Once American and EU marijuana policies change I could see the export market will being huge, for now I think it's going to be slow to expand.

 

[diffusing]

The export market will grow, but at the moment, I only see Israel(med),Netherlands(med) and Uruguay as potential options. With the cost it takes to produce (roughly 1-3$ a gram) , you may see many countries avoid us as a potential supplier. Once American and EU marijuana policies change I could see the export market will being huge, for now I think it's going to be slow to expand.

Uruguay has set their price at approx 1$/gram, so i don't see any Canadians competing over there any time soon.. especially with the taxes/transport.. and the current bunch of LPs mostly trying to get 10$/gr here

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/oct/22/uruguay-legal-cannabis-1-dollar-gram

 

[med-man]

the prices quoted are for local producers

surely they will have to consider importation costs for foreigners. just like anything else in the world

med-man

 

[SeedsOfFreedom]

Only the richest countries in the world will even think of buying Canadian indoor. If the government allowed outdoor, we could be much more competitive worldwide. Even the greenhouse grown will likely be too costly for many international markets.
USA is the biggest potential market for Canadian indoor in the near future. They have 320000000 people, that should be nearly 100000000 potential customers once fully legal(including edibles and extracts). 100,000,000! Canadian herb will be extremely marketable to these people. This is just USA... then most of the EU shouldn't be far behind America. I could make investors drool with these numbers. Recreational legalization will create an industry at very least the size of the Alcohol industry. USA has a $135000000000 Alcohol market. Soon there will be a $135000000000 Cannabis industry..