any kiss users have exp. with veg+bloom

[Aspenou812]

What are you doing about cooling? 2K watts are going to stack up in that small of a room, and if you are relying on the 6" fan to pull the heat off, I think that it is going to be too small. 6 airpots, but 12 plants? I've got both Phresh and Mountain Air filters, and prefer the Mountain Air. Good luck.

Well i was thinking that my room is 6.5x7.5x9 = 439 cubic feet and the 6 inch fan has a rating of 430 cfm so when the lights are on the fan will be running and when they are off have the fan timed 15 minutes on and 30 minutes off. That should change the air in the room and pull the heat out pretty effectively. Or am i wrong about that? And i meant to say 12 - 3 gallon airpots. I certainly dont have the experience to know if this will work out or not. Thanks Rives

 

[Aspenou812]

No , that actually sounds like a pretty solid plan !!! just make sure your intake air is double the size of your exhaust .... & have good air circulation inside the room . a couple 12" fans on the walls will help .

& for seeds , look at Bog's gear . you won't be disappointed in anything you grab from his stock . SSK , sour bubble, grape punch , sour lifesavor etc ..... god stock , good germ rates , vigorous plants & great smoke !!

Good luck Girl

Thanks Dans i knew i was forgetting to list something i have 2 sixteen inch wall fans on order Opse!!!

 

[dansbuds]

Well i was thinking that my room is 6.5x7.5x9 = 439 cubic feet and the 6 inch fan has a rating of 430 cfm so when the lights are on the fan will be running and when they are off have the fan timed 15 minutes on and 30 minutes off. That should change the air in the room and pull the heat out pretty effectively. Or am i wrong about that?

My buddy runs 2k watts in a 4 x 8 with 6" vent system & during the winter months it runs great , but during the summer he needs the AC in the main room by the intakes to cool the tent with lights on .

as far as fan speeds go .... I like the temp fan speed controlers . i've been using the CAP fan speed controllers but they're not being sold anymore cuz CAP was bought out by hydrofarm . but these Titan controllers work well too , just a little more expensive .

you set the temps on the unit to whatyou want your room temps to be with day & night settings & it slows down or speeds up the fan speed till it reaches the set temp .

http://www.titancontrols.net/products/ventilation/mercury-4.aspx

 

[dansbuds]

Hey Aspen .... you might want to start your own thread here at IC to gain all the info you can from everybody & it won't clog up this V&B thread . just sayin , your questions could get lengthy responses here & thats not what this thread is for .

I'll look for it & help if i can .

 

[papaduc]

I'm sorry dude , but i'm not giving young seedlings 1.0 EC , that would nearly kill them .

In an inert medium, 1.0ec of base feed alone is close to, if not the perfect level of nutrients for a cannabis seedling.

 

[papaduc]

This baby is on 1.0ec of 3-1-3 starter feed




This is her 8 days later. Still on 1.0ec starter feed. At this point it gets moved into a 11L pot and put under a 600w.




12 days on. Still on between 1.0-1.2 ec starter feed


I've never seen a seedling come even close to dying.

Water pops the shell, then the baby leaves pop out. At that point the seedling has enough energy to sustain itself. But at the point when it has it's first two leaves to process light, if you want quick growth rates and have it within 1 inch of your fluorescent, you need to provide it with 1.0ec of base nutrition to see the kind of growth rates above, otherwise the plant will yellow.

This is why you saw what you thought was a magnesium deficiency, when in fact it was just a hungry plant.

If the baby is further away from the light and isn't being pushed as fast, you might not see the same effects. I don't know, I've never tried it to find out. Every seedling I start goes onto the same formula, even tomato seeds. You will never come close to killing a seedling unless you're adding in some other additive to your routine which could do that.

Keep it simple to start and provide the basic macro and micros a young plant needs and leave everything else on the shelf. There's no better way.

 

[dansbuds]

I've never seen a seedling come even close to dying.

I have .... i killed damn near a whole tray of seedlings giving them 1.0 ( i don't have a pic) . I have rooted clones that I've given 1.2 & they threw a fit , they look like they're going through a reveg . where clones right next to it took it & loved it .so that strength is not so perfect like you think for all strains . sorry but thats just not the case .what works for you does not work for everybody .

this one was fed 1.2 just like the others & it was too much , it started throwing 3 blade & single blade leaves with no serrations & totally dark green .

& this one fed from the same jug of 1.2 took it & took off with it .... no problem . the bottom leaves are like that from the cloner , the rest is new growth .

So , i'm sorry that strength doesn't work as perfectly as you think . its more strain dependant .

 

[papaduc]

Clones are not seedlings tho Dans. Their nutritional requirements are different.

Rooted clones get 0.6 to begin with from me and only progress onto proper feed when they've rooted out and began growing properly. So in the case of freshly rooted clones it's no surprise if you get waxy green overfed looking appearance if you feed at 1.2 from the get go.

The first clone pictured above is, for whatever reason, re-vegging. That's what's causing the deformed growth and single-bladed leafs. A re-vegging plant needs the feeds kept low for longer than the average clone because it's a while before it starts to grow properly again.

This further emphasises the point though dans, because if you're feeding clones, whose nutrient demands are - for a number of days at least - lower than a plant growing from seed, with a feed strength of 1.2, and you're still not killing it, that shows you the food alone at that strength is unlikely to be the cause of your near-dead tray of seedlings.

This is not strain dependent and it's not a matter of personal experience or opinion. That might sound blunt but tone is a hard thing to get across on the internet. Certain plants have certain ranges of ec which, when made up of a set ratio of elements, is known to keep them happy.

In sealed co2-enhanced rooms the parameters might change. But in every other case things remain the same.

From a starting point of tap water at 0.2ec, you can feed any strain from a list of hundreds at 1.0ec from the size they are in the first picture in my post above. That's been the same for every single seed every single time without exception. We're talking about commercial hybrid genetics here btw, which is all 90%+ of this forum will be growing, not landrace sativas.

If a plant mutates it's usually because of genetics, Ph, or some other environmental issue. It's definitely not 1.0ec of starter feed which is causing it. Without doubt if you test the theory you'll find that what I'm saying is true. I'm in no doubt about that.

I think in your case what you've found with V+B nutes is that you're using just a simple basic feed without lots of additives and maybe because your ec isn't being made up of things to which a seedling might be sensitive, you're finding that they grow well on just 1.0ec. But whatever it is, do it over again with a number of different genetics and you'll find the same thing.

I've been saying it for a long time now and what you have found is no surprise whatsoever for that very reason. That's more than a coincidence my friend.

Start your seedlings on 1.0ec of good quality well balanced veg feed from the moment they extend their first leaves, put a fluorescent propagation light within an inch of them, keep the fan trained at the bulb and not the plant, leave all the additive and potions, and watch them grow.

Peace.

 

[jayjayfrank]

In sealed co2-enhanced rooms the parameters might change. But in every other case things remain the same.

From a starting point of tap water at 0.2ec, you can feed any strain from a list of hundreds at 1.0ec from the size they are in the first picture in my post above. That's been the same for every single seed every single time without exception. We're talking about commercial hybrid genetics here btw, which is all 90%+ of this forum will be growing, not landrace sativas.

this rings true for me but... any tips for landrace sativas?

 

[papaduc]

but... any tips for landrace sativas?

I haven't sorry Jay. I'm not working with any. Later this year maybe/hopefully. You?

 

[PetFlora]

JJ come by my thread. I am growing a wonderful BrandX poly cross- WWxWH, pollinated with BGum

V+B @ 800ppm

New thread, not yet in my sig. Go to lighting>cfl> 432w hot5 v 210w led

Here's a teaser Roughly 3 weeks to harvest
View attachment 251847 View attachment 251848

this rings true for me but... any tips for landrace sativas?

 

[jayjayfrank]

so the description of veg+bloom is 'for fast flowering oil producing plants' but i need something for plants that are long flowering.

i need a half way step between growth(v+b) formula and bloom (MOAB) formula and using half of each doesnt seem to be the right 'half way step' before a long flowering sativas starts to ripen (at 80+ days)

not 'overcooking' a landrace sativa with salts in coco is a little harder than it looks.

i suspect 'cheating' with some earth worm castings might be the last resort. but id hate to turn to dirt.

 

[ICbuds]

new generation of the blueberry OG on deck and ready to rock the dirty. These are at 2.0EC pH 5.5 and chugging. I'm going to try the +SIZE again on these but start a little earlier.

 

[smailer]

Hello!
I want to put my two penny to this thread.
Previously I grow using KISS method of maxibloom, but decide to make an experiment and bought V+B.
So I don't live in US and to take me V+B was not to easy and expensive (in total I was pay about 720$ for 25Lb) Also, thanks Chris for bonus for me like small can of microlife and some test bag of V+B dirty
Anyway.
I was make few mistakes.
First of all I was order "soft water" version. But my water source is not suitable for V+B.
And I install RO filter, after that plants become to looks more better. For future buyers need admit what they must be sure what they water source is really good

Another my mistake what I start trying V+B at winter time, and in my growing place is dam cold winter at this year. and as result my stealth growing place not so warm.
I use Ebb&flow tables on pure perlite. and nute tanks have only 10-12C degrees temp. what can reduce P absorption.

and few pics of test growing with different strains sorry for quality...

Thats my results on pure V+B.
And I thinks what they can be more better on another growing facilities.
I can give +positive mark for this nutrients,
they works, easy dissolve in water, good keep pH (in my case after dissolving nutes make pH level on 6.3-6.4, after adjusting pH stable about 3 days)
But seems like expensive to me in comparison with maxi KISS method.

 

[slowandeasy]

I have .... i killed damn near a whole tray of seedlings giving them 1.0 ( i don't have a pic) . I have rooted clones that I've given 1.2 & they threw a fit , they look like they're going through a reveg . where clones right next to it took it & loved it .so that strength is not so perfect like you think for all strains . sorry but thats just not the case .what works for you does not work for everybody .

this one was fed 1.2 just like the others & it was too much , it started throwing 3 blade & single blade leaves with no serrations & totally dark green .
View Image

& this one fed from the same jug of 1.2 took it & took off with it .... no problem . the bottom leaves are like that from the cloner , the rest is new growth .
View Image

So , i'm sorry that strength doesn't work as perfectly as you think . its more strain dependant .

May I give you my personal opinion and a little advice? Those clones are way too moist, I do not see roots on the sides of the cups. I have cloned in coco for a long time, and keeping the coco damp is better than soaked. Also, try bottom feeding once roots are visible.. Just dampen the top if it drys out a little. Doing this promotes root growth downwards...and the roots will be large and fuzzy. Keeping the coco too moist slows growth of roots and they will looks small and stringy. Btw, I precharge my coco with 1/2 strength nutes..once the clone gets roots I am at 1.0-1.2 EC. Never burn and never skip a beat. Overwatering a clone will slow the growth tremendously, roots seek moisture....if it is too most they do not need to grow. The faster the cup fills with roots the faster it will grow. The bottom feeding technique works well to avoid overwatering and roots grow much faster. Not telling you what to do, just sharing my years of experience with cloning in coco. Give it a try sometime

 

[PetFlora]

Here's a real time update referencing my own pics here 11 days ago. Temps over the last 10 days have below 65* day and < 55* night- so slow growth.

Last 2 days, high 70s day, low 70s night.

Next week low 80 days/low 70 nights.

View attachment 253382 View attachment 253383

View attachment 253384 View attachment 253385

JJ come by my thread. I am growing a wonderful BrandX poly cross- WWxWH, pollinated with BGum

V+B @ 800ppm

New thread, not yet in my sig. Go to lighting>cfl> 432w hot5 v 210w led

Here's a teaser Roughly 3 weeks to harvest
View attachment 251847 View attachment 251848

 

[smailer]

Here's a real time update referencing my own pics here 11 days ago. Temps over the lat 10 days have below 65* day and < 55* night- so slow growth.

Sorry, but on your new pics looks like your plant's have some leaf issue.
not sure but seems like overfert.

Cold weather boring me too

 

[PetFlora]

That's what it looks like alright, but I am using the exact same batch of nutes in my hot5 tent with ZERO leaf mottling.

The only thing I did in the led tent was raise the tote ~ 6" closer to the ufos about 6 days ago. Also there is a mother on the far right, not close to the 2 ufos, and its' leafs are fine

Sorry, but on your new pics looks like your plant's have some leaf issue.
not sure but seems like overfert.

Cold weather boring me too

 

[smailer]

some new pics make at the "night" time
White widow

OG Kush

Cinnamon

AK-47

 

[smailer]