A Warning regarding Dabs from Dale Gieringer

[rasputin]

joedogsong, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul.

As for the moldy buds/BHO issue, people often talk about making bubble hash with their moldy buds too. This is not exclusive to BHO. Nor is it a BHO issue so much as it is an individual issue with unscrupulous people trying to salvage shit bud they ruined by being poor growers and subjecting unsuspecting people to the compromised end product.

Unfortunately, that can't be helped by reducing BHO or even bubble hash consumption. Hell, even dry sift is subject to adulteration but it's not as economic as either BHO or bubble so it fortunately remains almost exclusively within the domain of connoisseurs.

Think of the soap bar hash in Europe. At any point did people think it unwise to smoke any and all types of hash simply because some of it was being adulterated? No. They dealt specifically with soap bar and avoid(ed) it like the plague.

The issue, again, is not BHO or bubble hash or dry sift specifically. It's the people, surprise surprise, making the stuff without regard to those consuming it. People. They are the problem. Not hash. Not concentrates. Not cannabis. PEOPLE.

BHO gives them an easy out for their shitty buds but before that it was bubble hash that gave them the easy out. There are scores of threads on this very site with people casually making mention "oh, I got some bud rot so that's going in the bubblebags."

I don't recall anyone ever denouncing bubble hash or discrediting it wholesale because of this practice. Bad bubblehash is the problem, just like bad concentrates. Poorly made BHO and poorly made bubblehash have something in common: poorly skilled hash makers. That's the issue, the people making it. Not the hash itself.

The problem is people and their greedy, immoral behavior. Same as it ever was.

 

[Weird]

My point which is still valid is that making dabs out of trash buds or shake is not healthy for patients, or do you really think patients should be smoking mildew and botrytis infected plants made into BHO extract?

just because the material is shake or trash buds do not mean it has mildew and botrytis but you know this. You also know that people have been oiling/hasing weed trim and trash buds well before the BHO craze. Ethanol, isopropyl, petroleum ether, as well as many other extration solvents exist and have been used over the past decades. Once again you know.

Truth is Sam and I BEG you offer some science to prove otherwise.

Reality is there are greater risks to patients from what is used in the growing during process (avid, etc) than what is used in the extraction process.

Bottom line is, at every step of the game integrity is required for the end user to get a proper product.

BHO in and of itself has not created the oiling/hash craze nor has it set a health hazard because of the type (trash or trim) starting material used.

Solvents have flash points and they need to be properly purged, conversely sift poses no danger but has overall less yield and is less viable from differing types of materials.

in many instances the comparison between the two become very much apples and oranges, bottom line is they are concentrates and sans adulterants on a level of danger they are equal.

I also stick to my belief that the whole BHO concentrate fad is because of supply and demand economics, people know they can get additional income from shake or buds, too often with mold or mildew

that's great but remember belief does not necessarily reflect reality.

once again solvent hash is not new and either is hashing moldy buds as they have done before and please offer some evidence that BHO manufacture is heavily reliant on improper starting materials.

Please show me how a specific solvent or hash making technique decreases human integrity more so than others.

your projecting how your own personal view, there are no real raw facts that you have to prove what your saying.

fact is people will lower the bar for money in any variety of manner.

your sift is as dangerous as dabs if not more so if we are basing it on the concentration of cannabinoids.

I believe right or wrong that when the prices of herb are so cheap that people will just toss their shake or any buds with mildew or mold and make dry sift or water hash. These BHO extracts are often not good for patients, wise up....

rasputin makes some excellent points on the matter in the post above me. I will reference that to save the bandwidth.


it is counter intuitive to reality (at least here in the US) as it looses value people will compromise more to maintain profit margins. in our existing modern agricultural market it means heavy preventative pesticide and fungicides (expect acceptable residual levels to be set) and toxification of the aguafer via nitrification (tip of the iceberg).

rasputin hit the nail on the head its about human integrity.

Then there is the points of Dale and Chris, which I dismiss as they are a problem with people smoking to much to fast, they just need to learn how to smoke strong Cannabis materials, like do not stand up right after taking a big hit. People that don't will continue to break noses and teeth...
-SamS

for what its worth the points dale and chris made are the exact topic of the thread not the virtues of one concentrate over another but the need and danger to even do so, oddly enough something you are a proponent of.

 

[Gert Lush]

Outstanding post, Weird mate, really covered everything spot on.

 

[Sam_Skunkman]

just because the material is shake or trash buds do not mean it has mildew and botrytis but you know this. You also know that people have been oiling/hasing weed trim and trash buds well before the BHO craze. Ethanol, isopropyl, petroleum ether, as well as many other extration solvents exist and have been used over the past decades. Once again you know.

THERE WAS VERY LITTLE OIL AVAILABLE PRE BHO, BUT YOU KNOW THIS.

Truth is Sam and I BEG you offer some science to prove otherwise.

Reality is there are greater risks to patients from what is used in the growing during process (avid, etc) than what is used in the extraction process.

SO YOU BELIEVE THAT BHO DOES NOT PICK UP PESTICIDES AND CONCENTRATE YHEM IN THE EXTRACT?

Bottom line is, at every step of the game integrity is required for the end user to get a proper product.

BHO in and of itself has not created the oiling/hash craze nor has it set a health hazard because of the type (trash or trim) starting material used.

BHO EXTRACT IS NOT HASH IT IS MUCH MORE LIKE OIL. MAKING BHO EXTRACT HAS BEEN HARMFUL TO MANY FOLKS, BUT YOU KNOW THIS.

Solvents have flash points and they need to be properly purged, conversely sift poses no danger but has overall less yield and is less viable from differing types of materials.

SO IT IS ECONOMICS?



in many instances the comparison between the two become very much apples and oranges, bottom line is they are concentrates and sans adulterants on a level of danger they are equal.

ONE OF THE THE REASONS I LIKE DRY SIFT IS BECAUSE IT IS NOT ADULTERATED LIKE BHO CAN BE.


that's great but remember belief does not necessarily reflect reality.

once again solvent hash is not new and either is hashing moldy buds as they have done before and please offer some evidence that BHO manufacture is heavily reliant on improper starting materials.

SOLVENT HASH IS NOT HASHISH IT IS OIL, BUT YOU KNOW THIS.

Please show me how a specific solvent or hash making technique decreases human integrity more so than others.

WHAT % OF THE BHO IS MADE WITH MOLDY OR MILDEW BUDS? WHAT % OF DRY SIFT IS MADE WITH MOLDY OR MILDEW BUDS?
BUT YOU KNOW THIS...

your projecting how your own personal view, there are no real raw facts that you have to prove what your saying.

fact is people will lower the bar for money in any variety of manner.

your sift is as dangerous as dabs if not more so if we are basing it on the concentration of cannabinoids.



rasputin makes some excellent points on the matter in the post above me. I will reference that to save the bandwidth.


it is counter intuitive to reality (at least here in the US) as it looses value people will compromise more to maintain profit margins. in our existing modern agricultural market it means heavy preventative pesticide and fungicides (expect acceptable residual levels to be set) and toxification of the aguafer via nitrification (tip of the iceberg).

rasputin hit the nail on the head its about human integrity.

I GUESS IT IS JUST A WHOLE LOT EASIER TO SCREW WITH BHO EXTRACTS, THEN DRY SIFT, BUT YOU KNEW THAT...


for what its worth the points dale and chris made are the exact topic of the thread not the virtues of one concentrate over another but the need and danger to even do so, oddly enough something you are a proponent of.

YOU ARE RIGHT THAT I PREFER DRY SIFT, BUT YOU KNEW THAT....
-SamS

 

[BushyOldGrower]

I much prefer dry seived or ice hash to BHO.

Try a dab of my SB bubble hash and it's really good and just made with water.

No nitrates created in the process so no brain lesions are caused.

I have found that you can make high grade BHO from low grade product like leaves or even de seeded buds! Try making bubble hash from crap.

Sam is right..BHO is economically feasible but not reasonable to expect quality in. Most of the time butane is still in the dabs and you know because it gives you a headache.

I have had good dabs and I liked it so it can be made right. I just don't see it as better than bubble hash though and dry is best tasting.

Can you name the strain when you taste a dab? Gaping and dancing makes it too much all the same to me. But what do old dudes like Sam and me Know? Bog.

 

[HUGE]

For what its worth I have always preffered bubbly and dry sift. But I recently got a vape pen and the bho isn't too friendly to it so I made some oil with 195 proof everclear. It tastes grrat and doesn't seem to have the downsides of bho like headache lung peralasis nd such.

 

[Hydrosun]

For what its worth I have always preffered bubbly and dry sift. But I recently got a vape pen and the bho isn't too friendly to it so I made some oil with 195 proof everclear. It tastes grrat and doesn't seem to have the downsides of bho like headache lung peralasis nd such.

GrayWolf style BHO doesn't have those downsides. In fact winterized BHO is about as clean and pure as you can get. Removing the waxes from the BHO (winterizing) makes it less easy to use in vape pens but the product is lab grade pure.

 

[HUGE]

GrayWolf style BHO doesn't have those downsides. In fact winterized BHO is about as clean and pure as you can get. Removing the waxes from the BHO (winterizing) makes it less easy to use in vape pens but the product is lab grade pure.

Ya I have never had lab grade bho. Everything I have experienced was backyard bho and tasted as such.

 

[Sam_Skunkman]

Ask Graywolf if he prefers dry sift to BHO extracts of the same variety made by him. I did and he said dry sift is what he prefers, he also said he does smoke a lot of BHO extracts.....

-SamS

No doubt Terpenes are lost in the purge. Being that Butane is far more volatile than any terpene, if proper technique is used, terpene loss will be kept to a minimum.

To what percentage of bho out there is made properly, I am sure the number is relatively low. Probably pretty close to the percentage of flowers that are actually grown well. I prefer to look at the individual instead in this instance, because there is where the magic is being found, first in flower then in concentrate.
This is still all in its infancy, and right now I look to the few out there pioneering the way for us all. Graywolf being a fine example.

 

[Sam_Skunkman]

If you remove the waxes don't you lose terpenes also?
I like terpene rich dry sift.
-SamS

GrayWolf style BHO doesn't have those downsides. In fact winterized BHO is about as clean and pure as you can get. Removing the waxes from the BHO (winterizing) makes it less easy to use in vape pens but the product is lab grade pure.

 

[one.sixoneeight]

If you remove the waxes don't you lose terpenes also?
I like terpene rich dry sift.
-SamS

If the plant is the messenger, the wax protects the message inside.
when did terpenes and wax become the same thing?

 

[Pangea]

One can look through a magnification tool and see if dry sift is free from microbial contamination, cant do that with other concentrates. Making it inherently safer for the end user.

In a legal world herbs and sifts will completely dominate the market.

The original post is retarded though, good herbs can easily drop folks especially if they are not regular users.

I laughed at dr. purpur's squat description;

Squat, roll to side and enjoy the ride!

 

[Weird]

Can't BHO weed and sell it after but you can certainly keif the shit our of it sell it.

Beaster'd

not to discredit the effect of taste and aroma on the connoisseur experience, but rather the relative necessity for those who smoke for medical purposes for example.

how about edibles?

Sift plant tops to make edibles from sift that contains waxes or oil them and eliminate them?

oil makes more sense in many applications once again depending on main objective so even if there is a differential it doesn't elevate one over the other

 

[Weird]

If the plant is the messenger, the wax protects the message inside.
when did terpenes and wax become the same thing?

Flavinoids reside in the waxes?

 

[BushyOldGrower]

Dry is tastiest but a lot harder to do than ice hash. Bubble hash is also harder to make than BHO.

 

[m314]

Dry is tastiest but a lot harder to do than ice hash. Bubble hash is also harder to make than BHO.

I've made all three, and I love all three. One thing I still haven't tried is jelly hash. Make dry sift, make BHO with the screened buds, then mix them together. It seems like you'd get the best of both worlds if it's done right. All the flavor of dry sift along with the potency and yield of BHO.

 

[Hydrosun]

If you remove the waxes don't you lose terpenes also?
I like terpene rich dry sift.
-SamS

You lose terpnes with every step that includes heating, frangelating (sp.. grinding into smaller pieces), and solvent extracting. If your nose can smell the cannabis then you are smelling terpnes escaping.

It is kind of like roasting coffee. Some people like a light roast, others are quite happy with a very dark winertized roast that clears almost all waxes as well as trace solvents. MANY terpenes are lost but the remaining lab grade product is heavenly.

 

[delta9nxs]

since the op has bailed and the thread is not on "topic" anymore i might as well ask a question.

i make dry sift with a 100 micron screen that bubbles. is it common for dry sift to bubble?

 

[Sam_Skunkman]

When I made oil from a Kg of buds I got a huge amount of wax, colored reddish orange with THC and smelling strongly of terpenes.
I also got wax/THC/terpenes when I used dry sift to extract oil from the resin.

I don't really know BHO extracts I have never made one.

I know the difference between terpenes and wax, I have worked with terpenes for over two decades now.

I agree the plant is the messenger, I also believe wax is part of the message, required to keep resin and cannabinoids and terpenes conserved for a long long time, specially if frozen.

-SamS

If the plant is the messenger, the wax protects the message inside.
when did terpenes and wax become the same thing?

 

[supermanlives]

since the op has bailed and the thread is not on "topic" anymore i might as well ask a question.

i make dry sift with a 100 micron screen that bubbles. is it common for dry sift to bubble?

mine melts and bubbles.man I got to make some bubblehash soon.bho is last on my list. dry sift,bubble,bho in that order. moldy stuff goes into compost not concentrates. not that I get much mold anyhow.