Jack's Hydro Clone/Copy Recipe?

[Zen Medz]

I'm about done with my first 1 pound containers of Jack's Hydro and calcium nitrate from JR Peters. Pretty happy with the stuff and wanted to buy some more. I wanted to save some money in shipping costs so I found a local feed store that sells 50 pound sacks of Yara greenhouse grade/water soluble calcium nitrate for $24. If I have the 25 lb bag of Jack's shipped to my casa the cost will be $88. Total combined cost for both is about $112, not too shabby! But...

I got to thinking how hard would it be to make/mix my own "Jack's Hydro"? Yeah, I know, a wee bit ambitious but what's the worst thing that can go wrong? It's not like I'm gonna burn my house down!

If you're a home-brewer you know there are a ton of great clone recipes out there for beers, after a while as your brewing skills progress you can start making your own beer recipes. Many similarities to mixing up dry nutrient salts; ratios, calculators, scales, water profiles, etc.

I think Jack's w/ the calcium nitrate used in the 3 grams Jack's to 2 grams calcium nitrate ratio is a great basic nutrient formula so that's why I chose to copy it. If anyone has any other nutrient ratios that they prefer please share.

So I looked over the ingredients for Jack's: mono-potassium phosphate, potassium nitrate, magnesium sulfate, and some chelated trace minerals and found out that I can buy all of these individual nutrient salts in greenhouse grade 50 pound bags locally with the exception of the trace minerals. I can buy the trace minerals on-line from JR Peters. The total cost for buying the bulk nutrients breaks down like this:

Mono-potassium Phosphate (MKP) $50
Potassium Nitrate $44
Magnesium Sulfate (Epsom Salts) $20.50
Calcium Nitrate $24
JR Peters M.O.S.T. w/ shipping $22

Total: $160.50

So before I get too deep with things I was curious if there are any other ingredients that JR Peters puts into Jack's that aren't listed on the guaranteed analysis, for example any pH buffering additives? I honestly think the high levels of calcium and magnesium will buffer the pH pretty good but who knows. Are there any things missing in Jack's that you would add other than silica or other supplements like aminos? Any lessons learned on mixing dry nutrients? I'm a small gardener and shouldn't have any issues with mixing things evenly in small batches.

Here's a ppm breakdown of Jack's w/ calcium nitrate in the 3/2 ratio and my first attempt at crafting a recipe using a calculator that I found on Custom Hydro Nutes website. I tried to keep things simple. Let me know what you guys/gals think.

Jack's with calcium nitrate (N-P-K,Ca-Mg-S) 122-41-171,95-50-65

Zen's Clone Recipe: 126-42-173,100-50-69
These numbers are from adding grams per gallon to RO water:
2 grams calcium nitrate
1.2 grams potassium nitrate
.7 grams MKP
2 grams magnesium sulfate

I will add somewhere around .1 grams of the JR Peters MOST trace mineral mix and will also use some seaweed when I mix up nutes for my rez. If it's any help I plan on growing in a peat, coco, pumice mix.

I know this was a large post but I think it could be helpful to the growing community to have a simple nutrient recipe for growing. We've seen how good a dry nutrient mix like Jack's can be and why not take it a step further and have an even cheaper and more flexible nutrient formula. If you can't buy water soluble nutrient salts locally then this obviously won't be cost effective. Cheers!

 

[Zen Medz]

Bump...

For the folks out there who have mixed their own salts any feedback on my recipe?

Zen's Clone Recipe: 126-42-173,100-50-69
These numbers are from adding grams per gallon to RO water:
2 grams calcium nitrate
1.2 grams potassium nitrate
.7 grams MKP
2 grams magnesium sulfate

I will add somewhere around .1 grams of the JR Peters MOST trace mineral mix and will also use some seaweed when I mix up nutes for my rez. If it's any help I plan on growing in a peat, coco, pumice mix.

Gracias!

 

[Zen Medz]

Come on now, is there anybody out there that has mixed dry salts and been happy with the results? There's got to be some folks lurking in the shadows that by salts locally from feed stores, Custom Hydro Nutes website or Crop King and mix their own. I guess I'll experiment and see what works. Thinking about doing a part A with calcium nitrate and a B with potassium nitrate, MKP, magnesium sulfate and a trace mineral mix. Keep it simple the first go round. It's not rocket science... If I can make kick a$$ beer and cider I can make a good nutrient mix. Stay tuned!

 

[high life 45]

I have been interested, but I dont have much time to mess with it. Keep us posted.

 

[reg24]

Hey zen... there a dozen good formulas around here many in the funkymonkey diy thread and still more in spurrs thread , also the phophate myth thread has some
I also mix a two part with A containg my CaNO3 and a little DAP.
I mix a stock solution at 200 to 1...for example with your formula I go 2 grams per gallon divide by 3.78 gives me a g per litre formula of .53 grams per litre times 200 egals 106 grams dissolved in a little less tham 1 litre of water top it up to 1 litre and done ... I ad 15 mls of ph down to the water before mixing the salts , both A and B, helps with the precip...

Reg
Ps guess I should put this in my sig but ...green dots and post count means diddly squat around here ...think it was soquik typed it

reg

 

[Zen Medz]

High Life, I'll let you know how things go with my KISS dry salt mix. I'm new to chemical nutrients but feel comfortable with dabbling a little bit. Jack's Hydro has been great for my first go with chems.

Reg24, Appreciate the info. For a second I though there was a conspiracy at IC against people wanting to mix their own nutes! I have read through FunkyMonkey's, Suprr's, and looked over some ideas on Fatman's old thread on another forum. It's all been good reading but a bit complex to be honest. I'm still wrapping my head around some of the details of mixing salts and was wanting to see if anyone was doing something real simple. You mind sharing the rest of your recipe for part B? I'd PM you but you don't have the magic dots yet! Long night of trimming, time to hit the hay.

 

[high life 45]

Want to share some links to those other threads on diy ratios?

Id love to get away from the food coloring in jacks.

Dont let my green dots and post count fool scare ya...

 

[Zen Medz]

Here's a few good threads about DIY mixes and general nute info:

https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=222646
https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=181405
https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=199034
https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=191007

The thread below is stickied but I think it's worth adding to the list, Shroom Dr.'s Nutrient Info.
https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=177807

I'd add a few more links about nute mixes but they're from other forums, do a search for "fatman nutrient mixes" and you'll find some interesting information. Personally, it seems like his early NPK suggestions were really high and closely related to tomatoes but still good $hit.

If anyone would like to share thoughts on nutrient ratios or dry salt mixing techniques feel free. Please don't post things like: "I like Maxibloom or Jack's Hydro". We already know those are great nutrient lines, it's about time people start sharing some DIY simple mixes for the community. Cheers!

 

[high life 45]

thanks zen, looks like i got my work cut out for me..

I kinda remember some ratio that was repeated often when searching in the past. 3-1-4?

I have several of the same set up going and Id like to do some jacks vs diy at some point...

 

[Zen Medz]

High Life, Those threads have a lot of info and it's easy to get lost or confused with them. That's why I'm trying to put together a simple nutrient salt recipe for veg and bloom like Jack's. Jack's used in the 3/2 ratio is close to 3-1-4. Ionic Bloom also has a similar ratio. Some other nutrient companies like Heavy 16, Rock, CX, and H&G's coco are all very similar to each other but have higher K amounts, their ratios are closer to 3-1-6. I'm gonna try and use hydrobuddy to copy Jack's but I'm having trouble. The spreadsheet from custom hydro nutes is a little easier for me.

 

[reg24]

zen... the math in those spread
sheets etc is basic grade school math w calci
ulator ...for example my cano3 15.5% N...if my target ppm was 121 then simply divide 121 by 155 and you get .78 grams per litre and the follow up math is .78 times 3.78 = 2.9 g per semi gallon

reg

 

[high life 45]

zen... the math in those spread
sheets etc is basic grade school math w calci
ulator ...for example my cano3 15.5% N...if my target ppm was 121 then simply divide 121 by 155 and you get .78 grams per litre and the follow up math is .78 times 3.78 = 2.9 g per semi gallon

reg

Nice!

I have a few rooms set up nearly identical.
I could monocrop and run slightly different profiles and learn a strains sweet spot...Would take some attention to detail but its very possible. I dont think I will have time for that right now, but maybe after I read some of those threads...

 

[Zen Medz]

Reg24, The spreadsheet from CHN has been pretty nice to use but it'd be good to double check the calculations. Snowcrash gave me a great rundown on how to crunch numbers for mixing salts a little while ago.

 

[reg24]

thought I would give an example with MKP

from the label we have 51.5% p2o5 times .44 = 22.7% P
so if my target ppm for P is 65 ppm then 65 divided by 227 = .29 grams per litre of MKP = 65 ppm P

34% k2o times .83 = 28.2% K we already have our amount of .29 grams per litre so 282 times .29 = 82 ppm K

just for those that still find diy nutes mysterious

reg

 

[high life 45]

https://www.icmag.com/ic/picture.php?albumid=49639&pictureid=1168381View Image

thought I would give an example with MKP

from the label we have 51.5% p2o5 times .44 = 22.7% P
so if my target ppm for P is 65 ppm then 65 divided by 227 = .29 grams per litre of MKP = 65 ppm P

34% k2o times .83 = 28.2% K we already have our amount of .29 grams per litre so 282 times .29 = 82 ppm K

just for those that still find diy nutes mysterious

reg

I just took a big dab so I might be missing something and im dyselxic.... but where did you get .44 and .83 ?

 

[Zen Medz]

High Life, when a nutrient label lists phosphorus (P2O5) the available amount to the plant is only 44% of that amount or .44. Similar deal with the potassium (K2O) at 83% availability. Weird shit eh? Not sure why the labels don't just show the available amount in the first place.

Reg, appreciate the breakdown for dry nutes, I am mathematically challenged sometimes. I get by though!

 

[2xsss]

[URL="https://www.icmag.com/ic/picture.php?albumid=49639&pictureid=1168381&thumb=1"]View Image[/URL]

thought I would give an example with MKP

from the label we have 51.5% p2o5 times .44 = 22.7% P
so if my target ppm for P is 65 ppm then 65 divided by 227 = .29 grams per litre of MKP = 65 ppm P

34% k2o times .83 = 28.2% K we already have our amount of .29 grams per litre so 282 times .29 = 82 ppm K

just for those that still find diy nutes mysterious

reg

new here but been reading and searching for weeks, is it really as simple as reg24 makes it look

thankyou 2xsss

 

[ganjourno]

OK I have been mixing my own salts for a while now with great results. There are a few tricks I can't give away just yet, but here are some things to consider...

- There are many different ratios of ferts that can get you to the same target NPK, but not all these are created equal. Read up on potential basicity and you can infer what I'm getting at.

- It is important to consider the solubility of each mix if you intend to make a liquid concentrate. Fertilizers vary greatly in their solubility, from 70-1200 g/l.

- There are compatibility issues to be considered when blending fertilizers. Read up on those

- The ratio of micronutrients is very important and therefore a micronutrient mix is probably not going to do it for you - each micro needs to be individually weighed and added to the mix.

- You will not use the fertilizers evenly, so keep in mind from your starting set of large bags, you will have a lot left over of certain components that may take you a long time to use up. You will need to plan for dry (air-tight) storage of these or they will absorb moisture and be "ruined." This also means your payback will be delayed since you will be sitting on inventory for a while.

- Try to understand the math and make your own fert calculator in excel. A few of the calcs out there that I have used have had some slight errors.

Hopefully this is enough to get people started!

 

[Bio boy]

Did u mamage to copy jacks in the end? Wud help ukers who csnr ship it easily lol

 

[BillFarthing]

A - Calcium Nitrate Ca(NO3)2.4H2O 294
A - Magnesium Nitrate Mg(NO3)2.6H2O 161

B - Ammonium Monobasic Phosphate (NH4)H2PO4 58
B - Potassium Sulfate K2SO4 124
B - Chelated Micros 4.3
B - Pyroligneous Acid 100 ml


10:1 N03-:NO4+. Calcium drench/foliar at transition. K dominant bloom booster week 4-6 of flower.