Help, I'm going Coco for the first time

[the gnome]

a good way to rinse coco is with a huge (50+ gal) smart pot. I don't really rise it anymore unless it's going to be reused, but it was nice to be able to put the smart pot in the shower filled with coco and just turn it on for 10 or 15 mins...esp in winter when it's 10° outside

great way to do large amts otis
I have an outside shower... perfect!!

i broke off a piece of BC coco and soaked in water-->1oo over tap
did a quick rinse and its right on the $$
a few yrs ago i bought some at a local seed-n-feed outlet to mix with soil and see if it helped.
it was something like 500ppm!!
and had to be flushed for a loooong time.


btw
sorry, didn't intend to

 

[Snow Crash]

1. Flush Before Use
I've said this a few times before... Brand favoritism when it comes to coco is pretty pointless. Are the "CANNA coconuts" really all that different from the "Botanicare coconuts?" These are facilities in the south pacific that turn out tons of coconut husk. It breaks down and is rinsed by monsoons. The quality of your coco is determined more by nature than we give it credit.

Sometimes there's a good batch, sometimes there's a bad batch, and it's impossible to tell who's getting what and when because all of the brands are picking from these inconsistent by nature outside sources. Then there's secondary variables like the volume of coco these companies are really dealing with, and how long it's been sealed in an air tight bag, sitting on a pallet, baking in the sun. There's a variable here no matter what we do and rinsing the coco before use has been the best and most sure fire way to ensure a healthy start for my young plants. The risk of being set back days or weeks due to an improperly rinsed, charged, or decomposed coco is just too great to be so cavalier as to think a few moments of my time and a dollar of my money could be better spent.

I use Botanicare CocoGro. It's affordable, works fine, and I like the consistency. Although I have tried a variety of other coco products and mixes, GH, Sunleaves, CANNA, Roots Organics, NutriField, Slacker and Royal Gold, I keep coming back to the Botanicare as they are all fairly equivalent.

I will expand my brick with good ol' fashioned tap water (I'm about 0.5ec, a little hard but not crazy) in an 18gal rubbermaid. Then I fill my seed starter tray and rinse it thoroughly with RO filtered water, which is really just a gallon or two. Cost... about $0.50 and 2 minutes time.


2. Charging the Coco
To transplant from the seed tray I'll fill my 1 gallon fabric planters with the remaining coco. I then rinse each container with 2-3 gallons of water straight from the hose. After this rinsing I use about 1 gallon of a mild 0.7ec nutrient solution per container - which basically goes straight through the stuff. The nutrient solution is usually something like 2ml/gal of CANNA Coco A+B, 5ml/gal Botanicare Liquid Karma, 2ml/gal General Hydroponics Rapid Start, 2ml/gal Silica, 2ml/gal Kelp Extract. This broad assortment of elements, organic acids, chelates, surfactants, and hormones have really improved my root development. Now the coco is ready to use for myself.

The total cost of the water and nutes I would need to set up twelve 1 gal plants is probably around $10, maybe $8, certainly less than the bale. Total time spent rinsing is probably close to 30 minutes, but I multi-task.

In your case, with the Hesi, fill your reservoir about half way full and mix your nutrients as directed. Now add as much water as you need to to drop the EC back down to a 06. to 0.8 level. Use a non-phosphoric acid based pH down solution to balance around 5.8ish, and rinse it until you can collect about as much liquid as there is media.

3. Germination
I use a seed tray filled with rinsed and uncharged coco. The reason for this is that any over charge of the media will definitely stall the growth of a seedling while an undercharge is extremely easy to resolve in such a small amount of media for such a small and young plant. A few ounces of a mild nutrient solution around the 8th to 10th days from breaking ground is a lot easier on everyone involved rather than trying to flush out hot coco 8 -10 days in.

No cups of water, or plastic bags and paper towels. No transplanting a fragile tap root. Just plant them and let them do their thing. I like to get a low wattage CFL in a clamp light reflector on them from the start in the seedling tray so that when they do hatch they don't stretch and stretch.

4. Watering Schedules
There's no one way to describe exactly when to water. I don't even stress that much, as missing the "perfect" window could be the difference between watering them before or after work. I'm not running home on lunch to get it just right... know what I mean? But the idea here is to not keep the coco totally saturated when the root system doesn't fill it completely. Allowing a day or three between waterings, while the coco is still more moist than soil would be, does seem to provide that additional O2 the roots require at that stage. Every feeding will come a little sooner as the plant gets bigger, so just play it loose and lift the containers frequently to get an idea of just how much water is actually retained. Don't go more than 5 days without watering though even if the media is still fairly moist. The fresh nutrient solution is better for the system at that point.

5. Runoff
10% is the minimum in my garden most of the time. There are variables here. My advice is to use enough runoff to maintain the EC level of what comes out to be within 30% of what is going in. If I am using a 1.0 ec solution then anything above 1.3 or below 0.7 in the runoff would require more runoff to better balance the media to what is currently in use (either adding charge or removing buildup). This could be as much as 50% runoff at times when I have recognized a pattern in the runoff. Save this info in a journal and next time around you can look at your nutrient strength for a particular time of the grow, then fast forward through the next few days to see if that nutrient solution wasn't strong enough, was too strong, or was just right, so that your skills can grow while your plants grow.

6. Feed Strength
Follow the manufacturers instructions. If their instructions suck, it's probably because they suck and their nutrients suck. Botanicares CNS17 system is where it's at IMO when it comes to the ideal nutrient ratios and strength through a coco grow! I will actually use other nutrient programs and a variety of supplements to try and closely mimic their levels because of how dialed they are. Goopy stuff though...

Generally I start around 0.8ec, and gradually work up to around 1.2-1.4 ec in peak veg. Drop it back around 1.1ish for the beginning of flowering, I'll hit 1.4-1.6ec around day 15 and ride that pretty much to the flush. Less is more in coco sometimes and I typically find myself using too much food and not enough runoff rather than the other way around. Nutrients are cheap, the final product is not, consider about where you'll make the sacrifice when everything isn't perfect and cheery. I rinse.

 

[papaduc]

Unless you're getting coco from an unreliable source, flushing and pre-charging is completely unnecessary.

Buffered-grade coir is flushed with calcium nitrate at source, and the re-seller at your end should be able to give you a guaranteed analysis of the product. With buffered grade you should be looking at 0.2EC and a Ph of around 6.0

Some shops, especially hydro stores, won't have a clue where their coco comes from, how it's prepared, or much else for that matter. But the company who import the bricks will.

They will sell the bricks in various grades.

Good companies know who they're dealing with and none of the major importers will be buying from a source which isn't consistent. That's not to say bad batches don't come in, just that they're rare and that you can easily test them without having to rinse gallons of water through them. There's absolutely no need. All I use is brick, and if your bricks aren't doing the job, buy them somewhere else.

Organic/Natural, is the lowest grade. Not suited for our purpose. Ph will be too low, sodium will be too high. Cheapest to buy.

Washed/rinsed/flushed is the next grade. It's not buffered. It won't be as ph stable, and it'll have a higher EC. Not suited for our purpose. Next cheapest to buy.

Buffered is the highest grade. Ph stable, clean, ready to use. Don't hydrate it with plain water otherwise it won't reach the target EC for your plants until after a couple of feeds. Otherwise, it's ready to go once wet. Most expensive, but still cheaper than bagged and the equivalent of 280L can be brought to your door with the delivery guy holding it in one hand.

You buy buffered grade for a reason. So the hard work is done for you. If not, buy the washed grade, or cheaper still, organic.... if you've got back bones to spare...

You should always test a small piece by hydrating enough to fill a 1L pot, running some water through it, then checking the run off.

If your coco isn't properly buffered you will know about it straight away. The Ph will drop way below 5.5, sometimes as low as 4.5 and the EC will be much higher than 0.2, sometimes as high as 1.8.

If the reading of a snapped off piece of your bale is good, that's all you need to know. Hydrate the rest of it with a 1.0EC base veg solution and you're good to go.

 

[nachoconqueso]

Papaduc is correct. Pay attention to what he said about pH and all that calcium nitrate stuff. Where's Mistress? She is so knowledgeable in how coco works. I remember Krunchbubble talking so much shit to her about how coco sux and all this bullshit. She fucking schooled him on hydro knowledge then the guy ends up going coco and I don't think he ever gave her her due. She was such a smarty and challenged all the guys here. We need more of that. I digress. Flushing and charging coco is not needed in my experience. Also, you don't buy B'Cuzz to just rinse it out either. It's fully loaded so go Canna for the most trouble free experience. I've heard of guys planting in B'Cuzz and going start to finish with nothing added. It's all hearsay but you never know. Anyways, Canna has been the best for me. I just wet it down in pots and plant directly into it. I do stick all my coco in the oven at 220F for 90 minutes because I'm very afraid of root aphids. It also kills other random nasties. I germ directly in a cup of regular old tap water and drop right into coco I've wetted down in a little clear plastic cup (also non pH adjusted tap). When I see roots on the side of the cup I hit it with full strength nutes (Head formula at 1.4ec). They take off well before they have a chance to even think about chewing up their cotyledon. Coco is amazing to work with and Canna is cheap at the store. $16 a bag by me.

Side note. Coco loves to hold onto calcium more than others imo. I get cal deficiencies if I do not set a few rez's at 5.7pH. Anything over 5.8 and cal doesn't get sucked up as well. Typically when my pH meter falls out of calibration (drifts away from calibration after 3 weeks) it is showing 5.8 when in reality it is a touch higher. Keep your pH meter calibrated and set a few rez's at 5.7 and a few at 5.8.

 

[papaduc]

I want to make a coco run in the next bloom run so trying to absorb info now.
papaduc...on the subject of rinsing and buying a buffered rady to roll coco.
is botanicare block coco good to go, or is B'cuzz the one to get.

sorry not trying to change the subject

Sorry gnome, I never even noticed that question before now. I didn't even know I'd posted in this thread before, either. Feel free to drop me a pm any time if I don't answer in a thread.

Buy a small brick (not bale) of whatever brand you choose. Hydrate a small piece of it with some warm water, put into a 1L pot, pour some water through it, collect and test the run off. That'll tell you everything you need to know.

You can do that now, no need to wait til you're ready to start using the stuff.

Remember though, that's only to test. When you're re-hydrating the whole block to use, do it with a nutrient solution made up of 1.0ec base veg feed.

If you hydrate with plain water, it'll take a few feeds to get the medium to the sweet spot.