Vert with LEDs?

[flat9]

Is this possible? Would it make sense to hang an LED panel vertically?

I realize that part of the gain you get in hanging a bulb vertically is that you can use all 360 degrees (as in a doughnut), but I'd imagine that in general it's just a better way to distribute the light in that you're shining light perpendicular to the colas rather than parallel to the colas, right?

Anyway, if one of you experienced grow magicians on here wanna chime in, it's greatly appreciated.

 

[thrillspan]

yup, its possible. expensive but doable. I did a 3000w LED vertical grow, thread is in here somewhere.

 

[DHF]

Flat....Thrillspan`s thread`s in hydro section and definitely the ONLY LED setup I`ve ever seen that rivaled a HID lighting setup......but....

Unless you got deep pockets , you best stick to cheap ass HID lighting till yas get some runs under yer belt cuz Thrillspans 5-600 watt vertical light arrays cost 2500 bucks each for $12,500 total......

Good luck....DHF........

 

[flat9]

Flat....Thrillspan`s thread`s in hydro section and definitely the ONLY LED setup I`ve ever seen that rivaled a HID lighting setup......but....

Unless you got deep pockets , you best stick to cheap ass HID lighting till yas get some runs under yer belt cuz Thrillspans 5-600 watt vertical light arrays cost 2500 bucks each for $12,500 total......

Good luck....DHF........

Thanks DHF for the reference and the info, however I'm afraid you're looking in the wrong places if you want to find quality LEDs and save a buck or two.

I can get my hands on the hydrogrowled penetrator pro 336x (the same light anyway, but direct from the semiconductor company in China) for under 600 each w/ shipping, so total would be under $3000 for the setup. If anyone is interested, PM me.

 

[DHF]

Well Flat....I was just referencing what thrillspan posted in his thread bout the cost being $ 2500 per fixture after looking at the website....

I think you need ta get some and start a thread in vert-ville to document em Bro.....

Plenty of ground support down here to walk yas through any setup you decide on trust me.....

Good luck....DHF........

 

[AlterEgo860]

jesus 2500 a fixture.. I think he would have been better off making them himself. and having a fixture the size of the walls lol.

 

[DHF]

Just saw the pm F......Thrillspan`s lights got taken by LEO , so maybe post that link here for the other LED`s so all vert members can see the diff tween $ 2500 and $ 600 delivered to the door for an exact duplicate.....BUT.....

Quality over quantity in my book every day , although I understand about advertising costs and greed from hydro whore manufacturers and distributors when prices on similar products vary so much.....

Peace....DHF........

 

[Mister_D]

Sure it can be done, start up a thread and i'll be watchin

 

[DamnUglyDogE]

​

 

[flat9]

Alright guys ... here's the deal. You can get the exact same lights as hydrogrowled's ordered directly from China. Actually, the company that makes Hydrogrowled's main light pods makes the same exact lamps except for two things:

-- The PC fans used in the China ones are louder. Though this is an easy fix: you can replace those w/ low noise and still high cfm fans quite easily for about $40.
-- The power supply is better in hydrogrowled's in that it is dimmable, but this isn't really that much of a problem (use fewer LED panels and just move them further away)

The company is www.bsled.com, and the woman I ordered from previously is named Antty (sales11@bsled.com). You need to paypal or mail order, which seems scary, but trust me it's 100% legit. They send by DHL air mail, arrives usually in about a week or so. She also makes sure you don't have to pay any customs duties by stating the value of the package is pretty low.

 

[Bennyweed1]

I own a butt load of LED panels including that douchbag company HGL, that women cammie or whatever her name is, she is a attached to the same seven headed dragon as G. Bush, Obama and osama binladen.

They do not out perform HID....I do not care what anyone says, they do not. Watt for watt not in a million years.

600w of LED produces just as much heat as a 600w HID lamp. And save the claim "90w UFO = 1000w HPS" that shit is so 2009.

1 watt of electricity used outputs the same amount of heat and power.

A vertical LED grow would be cool, I have seen them but that are a huge waste of money.

Only time an LED setup would be viable is for small grows such as tents, closets..ext because you can get LEDs in smaller output powers rather then the standard 250, 400, 600, 1000.

And who ever said the above post about buying direct from china....DO IT. I have spoken with the manufacturer of HGL lights, they are nothing special, HGL has done no research on these lights aside from what cammie grew in her home, she just started importing them and did a huge marketing campaign built on lies and she has screwed many many people.

I do not lie, and I mean this from the bottom of my heart, from grower to grower with mutual respect. HGL is a bad company built on deception and horrible horrible business tactics.

I did a side by side grow for her back in 2010 using her 126w pentrator and a 120w GLH led. The veg was great, but once I started bloom her claims and lies started to surface.....she deleted my thread and banned me from the site.


She was a moderator at the time....and the worst thing was she did the same side by side I did after banning me but completely staged it. I remember once looking at her pictures during bloom and the horrible women she is, she forgot to get the 1000w HPS out of the picture frame. You could see it hanging from the ceiling, clearly pulled out of the way but just not enough.

I forget what forum it was but a user named: IRISHBOY did a lot of work for cammie at HGL and he too was bashed, slammed, and discredited by this devil of a human being. She will cheat, lie, and steal to make a buck.

Stay away from HGL. Buy directly from China using either: aliexpress or alibaba. I prefer alibaba because you can talk directly with MFGs not a middle man and sales agent.


if you dont believe me, look at my join date......2010, because that beast banned me from my other forum in 2010.....good luck growers and stay green without giving HGL any of your green.

 

[flat9]

Benny I think you should tell us how you really feel... I mean it seems like you're holding something back...

 

[DHF]

LMAO......Benny....Don`t hold back now , let it out..........Bro......

I`m as leary as the next guy bout LED`s cuz I saw the fiasco that went on with LEDgirl and her bullshit , but thrillspan`s thread WITH "HydrogrowLED" vertically hung light arrays impressed the fuck outta me.....and that ain`t easy.....regardless.....

Never say never Benny....all things are possible with technology upgrades and getting past the learning curve......

Go look at those plants and the size of those colas in TS`s thread ....Proof`s in da pudding although they pulled up light in bottom line weight.....and yeah.....

I agree LED`s have a long way ta go in reproducing consistent results compared to dialed HID lighting setups and can`t compete at this point in the game , but again....never say never..,..

You`ll end up eatin yer words......bet on it....and for the record....I thought those 5 sided LED vertical 600 watt light arrays were/are bad ass.....price was/is insane , but still ....bad ass.....

Peace....DHF.........

 

[Bennyweed1]

Lol peeps, I came off like a ignorant ass. HGL just strikes a cord with me.

I can't be that cynical, I'm running an led garden right now and as dhl called me out on, they still impress me.

But I will adamantly hold my claim, watt for watt they just do not out weigh their cost.

People have to spend thousands of dollars just to match hid. I know people including myself can kill it with led but it comes at a huge cost.

When the claim "90w UFO=1000hps" becomes true, then IMO led will be viable.

 

[flat9]

Benny you realize you can order Hydrogrowled lights straight from their supplier I China (bsled.com) for about twice the retail cost of an HID, yes? I was quoted a bit under $700 I think it was with shipping for 560w model which has PAR equivalent to a 1000w HPS. I figure most retail prices for 1000w HPS are above 300.

I think their downside is their footprint is usually a bit smaller than HID. But they do make growing in the summer possible for many that otherwise wouldn't be able to, and also save big on electrical costs not only in the lower power but also in that you don't have to worry about heat extraction as much.

 

[Bennyweed1]

Benny you realize you can order Hydrogrowled lights straight from their supplier I China (bsled.com) for about twice the retail cost of an HID, yes? I was quoted a bit under $700 I think it was with shipping for 560w model which has PAR equivalent to a 1000w HPS. I figure most retail prices for 1000w HPS are above 300.

I think their downside is their footprint is usually a bit smaller than HID. But they do make growing in the summer possible for many that otherwise wouldn't be able to, and also save big on electrical costs not only in the lower power but also in that you don't have to worry about heat extraction as much.

I know about all about china importation, I run a business around imported products. Just be careful if you choose that route because its a lot of smoke and mirrors, and you must not believe everything they tell you.

The number one tactic when speaking with suppliers is they will all say they work directly for the manufacturer. This statement is simply un true in most cases. The reason I tell you this is because they are tacking on a overhead fee which means it can be bought cheaper. Be careful with customs too, look into tarriff fees and make sure your supplier properly marks all invoices and bill of lading otherwise customs will take your package. I had it happen to me an a $2700 order of merchandise. I found out the hard way. If you find a great middleman, that does document eveything, and keeps you up to speed with tracking orders and is honest, then it is worth paying for their services. Money talks in China, it is slave labor over there. Humans working for cents and their government makes trillions from the rest of the world. Its actually sad when I think about it but its the world we live in. No wonder firearms are banned in that country, so the people can never rise up. Its really shocking communicating with my supplies and learning understanding the different forms of propaganda used and the news they hear and the stories they receive. It really puts things into perspective how corrupt and horrible government really is.

ANYWAY.....little rant....

So let me ask you a question. Do you believe 560w of LED produces less heat then 560w of HID? You first must find out if the panel is actually drawing 560w because in the LED world everything is highly exaggerated.

When I run 500w of LED and im talking actual power consumption, I have to vent and or run A/C just as I would have to with HID. 1 watt of energy used outputs the same amount of heat. Yes, HID is intense heat directly at the bulb which causes burning if touched but thats because all amount of input power is being output through a single filament oppose to an array of LEDs attached to a heat sink.

None the less, the heat output of 500 or 1000w of LEDs is equivalent to HID at the same power output.

For every action.....there is and equal and opposite reaction. 1 watt input delivers same energy and heat output.

I wish myth busters would take this up! I understand why people think they run cooler though. Because usually the panel they own is running way under advertised current and power consumption. But those heat sinks on the back will be hot to the touch and give off a lot of heat.

To this date I only know of one company that actual gave more juice then the advertised amount but I do not think they are around anymore. The company was growledhydro.com, I own three of the 120w panels which consume actually 160w.

Feel free to check it out: https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=273599

I am only running two panels and its is winter and cold here. I still have to vent my tent otherwise my temps will climb to high.

Im not bashing LEDs, just HGL! haha I think they are cool and high tech. I was all into LEDs a few years ago, I convinced myself they were better then HID...I spent loads of money.........I studied the PAR and all the NM lengths needed for the correct LED arrays along with IR and UV but at the end of the day, im back using HID for my serious grow and save the LEDs for the extra plants i have.

They do have their perks.....the bud LEDs produce is some of the greatest smoke but that is subjective....and the plants seem to require far less watering.

 

[flat9]

I know about all about china importation, I run a business around imported products. Just be careful if you choose that route because its a lot of smoke and mirrors, and you must not believe everything they tell you.

I've already purchased through this method and have a BSLED SP112D which is the same as the Hydrogrowled Penetrator Pro 189x. They are the semiconductor company which supplies HGL/makes their pods in th first place. All you're doing is cutting out the middle man. They do allow you to pay with Paypal, so if you're concerned, you can go that route...

 

[flat9]

As for the power draw question, I used a Kill-A-Watt meter and after start up it stays pretty consistent at 275 watts actual draw. Put it in my bathroom for right now and the temps stay about 2 degrees warmer than the rest of the place w/o any extraction (don't have the blower on). I'm waiting on a small veg tent, btw.

My guess is why it's actual draw of 275 watts instead of the 315 they list at BSLED.com is because it spikes a bit when you first turn it on. The equivalent model from HGL is quoted as 290 watts, so go figure.

 

[flat9]

Similarly, the 560 watt model from bsled (sp113d) is quoted as 500 watts on HGL. My guess is that it will be somewhere about 460w actual draw.

I intend to grow medically and donate my excesses, but I don't have any extra cash to spend on these right now, so I'll have to wait for a grow under my belt in order to give them a whirl. Check again with me in March ha ha.

 

[flat9]

Let's assume I accept your premise (by the way, I don't -- more on that below) that 500w of one source of heat (LED) is equivalent to 500w of another source of heat (HID). Well, the PAR watts of an HID are much lower, so you'd have to go at least 750w HPS (more likely 1000w) to get the same PAR, right? So even accepting your premise, you save $ on extraction.

Now why I don't agree with you about 500w of one source of heat = 500w of another source of heat. It's true that 500 watts is 500 watts whichever the source, but the means of cooling the LEDs is far more efficient than any means of cooling HIDs. Namely, there are large heat sinks and very efficient PC fans on each LED pod, which is a far more effective method (using a heat sink) than just blowing air at the problem and hoping things sort of work out; so much air is wasted that never touches the bulb, whereas the PC fan used in LEDs is blown directly onto the heat sink.