Yields, Past vs Present

[StayFoolish22]

So last year i ran 4x1000w in a 9x9 room and had 25 plants growing in 7.5g pots using ProMixHP as a medium, Botanicare as a line and then Great White and Azos.

Now its a year later.

After reading a few books I realize the terrible-ness if you will of using soup blended nutrient lines. The salts from Botanicare were surely killing whatever micro life i had going on in there etc.

So this year Im rebuilding, lot has changed a lot has happened.

Organic soil seems to me the only way to go.

Now, my plan, is 4-8 plants per 1000w light. Now instead of containers I wanted to use beds. Was thinking 1 bed per light, keep it to 1 strain per bed. Might just end up making 4 big beds per light not sure yet.

Is an all organic completely supplemented way of growing going to give me at least the 1 gram per watt I'm looking for. Or is this only after a few years and a very dialed in recipe book for soils and teas.

I really need to not waste time or money this run through, so I figured ask here as opposed to just hit the ground and hope for the best.

I have been endlessly reading books, True Living organics by the rev, Teaming with nutrients and microbes by jeff lowenfels. Marijuana botany by clarke, permaculture handbook by peter bane. I want to incorporate it all into a very systematic machine for making top quality organic medicine.

Low Plant counts is not a requirement, I just feel like i will get a better yield off a monster root structure and a monster plant being supported by an enormous army of micro life. But I hope this isn't all a pipe dream.

Any tips, ideas, nudges in the right direction would be great. My head has been spinning endlessly now for id say 2 months solid with information so. Kind of a scattershot of energy right now trying to dial it into a forward momentum.

Thanks all, much love.

 

[Crooked8]

Ive been at it a long time. Still havent hit a gram perwatt. Hydro has helped my yields greatly. Organic wasnt for me and ever since i bailed on the soil thing ive done much better. I love and respect organic growers, especially those who get excellent yields. I think it takes a lot to dial an organic setup. You probably wont hit a gram per watt just starting out.

 

[Snype]

So last year i ran 4x1000w in a 9x9 room and had 25 plants growing in 7.5g pots using ProMixHP as a medium, Botanicare as a line and then Great White and Azos.

Now its a year later.

After reading a few books I realize the terrible-ness if you will of using soup blended nutrient lines. The salts from Botanicare were surely killing whatever micro life i had going on in there etc.

So this year Im rebuilding, lot has changed a lot has happened.

Organic soil seems to me the only way to go.

Now, my plan, is 4-8 plants per 1000w light. Now instead of containers I wanted to use beds. Was thinking 1 bed per light, keep it to 1 strain per bed. Might just end up making 4 big beds per light not sure yet.

Is an all organic completely supplemented way of growing going to give me at least the 1 gram per watt I'm looking for. Or is this only after a few years and a very dialed in recipe book for soils and teas.

I really need to not waste time or money this run through, so I figured ask here as opposed to just hit the ground and hope for the best.

I have been endlessly reading books, True Living organics by the rev, Teaming with nutrients and microbes by jeff lowenfels. Marijuana botany by clarke, permaculture handbook by peter bane. I want to incorporate it all into a very systematic machine for making top quality organic medicine.

Low Plant counts is not a requirement, I just feel like i will get a better yield off a monster root structure and a monster plant being supported by an enormous army of micro life. But I hope this isn't all a pipe dream.

Any tips, ideas, nudges in the right direction would be great. My head has been spinning endlessly now for id say 2 months solid with information so. Kind of a scattershot of energy right now trying to dial it into a forward momentum.

Thanks all, much love.

Getting a gram per watt is more related to genetics and even when you have them you still have to master them to achieve that goal as well as quality. When you grow less plants per light, they have to be bigger which makes it harder for the light to penetrate the plant. So your mids and bottoms arent the same quality as the tops. I think focusing on 16 plants per 1000 or 9 plants per 1000 would be easier to hit a gram per watt only needing 110 grams per plant or lower than 100 grams per 16 plants. Then the plants dont have to get taller than 30" and will get great light penetration with defoliation of leaves at the right time as well. There are many variables involved for top shelf gram per watt.

 

[StayFoolish22]

Well, Strains and variables aside. Is organics a viable solution for say 3/4 production. I basically would take a loss for a better product. But I don't want to be getting 1/2 the normal weight per plant by switching organics.

 

[Snype]

Well, Strains and variables aside. Is organics a viable solution for say 3/4 production. I basically would take a loss for a better product. But I don't want to be getting 1/2 the normal weight per plant by switching organics.

When you know what you are doing, you can achieve a gram per watt organic or hydro. You really have to get to know your specific flants and monocrop everything. All one strain.

 

[otis33]

^^^ it's all about dialing every aspect of their grow in. you could have the best amended soil or a dialed salt regimen, but if your environment isn't dialed those numbers will be hard to hit. there are some organic growers killing it in the yield department, but they have put in work and have dialed environment. I wouldn't expect more than 1/2g per, then be happy when your yield grows as your skill set improves. it looks like yiu are studying up and that's a big part of it. start a journal, people here will help you along the way. good luck!

 

[StayFoolish22]

Thanks a lot for the replies everyone.

Basically what I was thinking. I am going to go organic soil I'm pretty sure, I really want good medicine after all. After awhile of dialing it in it will be very worth it.

Now, would beds be a good idea per strain? I was thinking a huge mass of soil and a giant network of life to support each plant, let them spread their roots out nice and wide.

I was thinking at least 10gal of soil per plant. I was running 7.5 before and think if I give it more soil and veg an extra week or two I should be solid.

Is 1 bed per light a bad idea? I could see if a problem happens it would affect everything, but on the other end, if it goes right each plant benefits.

I usually don't fail so I truly am not worried about that. It is always nice to eat your own words though >_>

Thanks again all, much love.

 

[VerdantGreen]

good genetics and good canopy management (getting as many buds in the canopy as possible with no gaps) is the key to big yields.... presuming you have decent genetics.

organic soil done properly is as high yielding as any other method.

VG

 

[VerdantGreen]

this thread will be useful to you
https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=258258

 

[StayFoolish22]

Boom. That was a perfect answer brotha. Thank you kindly.

I don't want to be blowing up the forum, but I live in the middle of the hills so I can't really talk with anyone else about stuff. Sorry for the swarm of replies >_>

Now Ive read a solid 3 books on organic gardening, 1 having to do with cannabis.

The rev runs spikes and layers setup, is this the norm when it comes to TLO? It just seemed kind of odd to me to have such potent spikes inside your container. I agree with the layers aspect, but those heavy spikes just scare me. If only I had time to setup an aquaponics >_>

I am basically sold on square beds, I will be building them myself. In terms of space and soil volume, can't beat it. Unless I can find perfect fitting square pots at the local store.

Has anyone done a mono crop test of organic soil, vs nonorganic, vs hydro, vs coco or w/e. I feel like someone out there has a large enough setup and enough time to dabble and get good results. I was looking through the search but most results seemed inconclusive or full of biased opinion.

I feel like the best way to do anything is to try and mimic nature. Tried and true, it works. Heh feel like such a chump for buying Botanicare and all of the other lines i used to. Out with the old in with the new.

 

[VerdantGreen]

hey there, i think really the important thing is doing it well, whatever method you choose. personally i think the spikes thing is a 'gimmicky' way to feed your plants, but the rev, last time i looked, was getting results that its hard to argue with. i just use a recycled organicsoil in my pots and re-amend/mix each time. i always get somewhere around 1gpw, sometimes more, but thats more to do with the canopy management, and my grows are small so i can have attention to detail.
same with comparing hydro or soil. vert or horizontal, if you do either well then you'll be beating the yields of most people.
look at the floor in your grow space, if you see light hitting it then thats potential yield you're wasting right there. i spose if you do vertical then maybe you should look at the walls
big soil volume is another thing that'll really help your yields.

GL

VG

 

[StayFoolish22]

I have been growing since i was 11 years old in my moms crawlspace. Did a 24 plant DWC and had them all LST'd perfectly. It was somewhere on grow kind, I looked it up a year or two ago for kicks. But training is my thing man, I absolutely love sitting in my room for hours on end, talking with the plants and moving them around exactly how they need be. Its an art form. Really appreciate your knowledge verdant, and really respect how you handle yourself. Much love brotha, can tell I may be picking your brain and swapping ideas in the future.

 

[Weyenot]

Howdy everybody, its always so nice to see people moving in the organic direction, well its the way for me at least

SF, youre going to do great! Youve already checked out some great books and you sound like the creative type so itll be all good. I would definitely recommend spending plenty of time checking out the ROLS threads; there is soooooo much awesome info there alone that has been immensely helpful during my growing journey. Infinite thanks to CC ,Gasc, Von, Jaykush and everyone who has shared their knowledge, its not possible without your help!!

Oh, and the compost tea brewer thread that CTguy started is super awesomeness too; teas of all kinds are an important part of my method for sure!

I really like the idea of indoor beds(if youre doing indoor that is, or course they're great outside!!) and for me its been a progression in that direction from 5g "airpots" to 5g buckets and im just about to build those beds now. From my observation it does seem that the more soil there is the more it actually acts like the good soil outside and therefore there are benefits like increased health followed naturally by those yields we are after!

Ill be watching your progress with excitement, keep up the goodness

seriously, what you are doing is awesome !

 

[DinosaurCocks]

i love beds myself, been using them for 3 years now and have never had a plant go rootbound, no matter how many clones i pack per foot, and i have really pushed the limits! the large soil volume also helps buffer ph and nutrient levels, it's really hard to spike the ph in a big soil bed, you have to really be messing something up long term.

for me beds with super tight sogs was my best yeilding method, but since up scaling my grow i just can't handle the immense amount of clones neccessary each month and the mom upkeap to keep getting that many, i was getting a gpw here and there with my 400 using an ultra tight sog but im nowhere close with my 600 using bushes, though getting substantially closer with each harvest...as others have said it's all about canopy management...

 

[StayFoolish22]

Do roots grow down or sideways? For the plant. I want to make rectangle beds and was wondering if depth or width is the biggie. Any tips would be greatly appreciated.

Setback this week, the house I was going to sign a lease on won't be available until the 2nd of December. So I canceled that and am searching again for a new spot. Everything is still up in the air, its just a matter of landing in the right spot. Gives me more time to plan everything out and make it perfect.

 

[SpicySativa]

If you want to be successful with your first organic endeavor, NOW is the time to get started with building your soil, even if you are months away from starting a garden. The soil needs plenty of time to compost (break down amendments) before you plant into it.

Now would also be the perfect time to start up a worm bin. Start it up now, and you'll have some usable castings within a few months; pure black gold for organic gardens...

 

[StayFoolish22]

I know that, trust me I do. New Moon just happened, theres so much I should be doing. Living in a friends garage while I setup for a new move right now. Im encompassed by such a depression at this point. Another property I had to turn down today. Its been about 2 months of solid searching for the right spot. Im not being picky, having a pit bull is a pain in the ass. She is a 35lb runt that is full of love with not a single mean bone in her body. Rejection after rejection, and the places that like her, impossible to grow in. One day, hope it just isn't too late.