What are the best Coco nutriens..?

[bradybunch]

Just read thru the whole thread. Seems like Canna on average is the winner.

What other Canna products besides a/b would one use to achieve HIGH yields?

Thanks!

 

[Snow Crash]

Rhizotonic.

We are root growers. The roots grow the plant. A bigger, healthier, and more robust rhizosphere (root system) means a better ability for the plant to uptake nutrients and a greater number of root cells that can produce and react to growth regulating hormones.

Cannazym also, but to a much lesser effect. In flowering this product keeps the roots that were produced during vegetative growth clean and healthy when the plant is dedicating less time and energy towards making new roots.

 

[bradybunch]

Rhizotonic.

We are root growers. The roots grow the plant. A bigger, healthier, and more robust rhizosphere (root system) means a better ability for the plant to uptake nutrients and a greater number of root cells that can produce and react to growth regulating hormones.

Cannazym also, but to a much lesser effect. In flowering this product keeps the roots that were produced during vegetative growth clean and healthy when the plant is dedicating less time and energy towards making new roots.

That completely makes sense to me. It's all about growing the roots.

I just bought a new bottle of h&g roots excell. Would you say its better than rhizo?

 

[papaduc]

Rhizotonic.

Cannazym also

You found that Rhizo and cannazym boosted your yield?
By how much?
I never found any difference using and not using those products.

 

[Snow Crash]

That completely makes sense to me. It's all about growing the roots.

I just bought a new bottle of h&g roots excell. Would you say its better than rhizo?

They are fairly different products. My experience with H&G has not been the same experience I read and hear about online. In my experiments none of their supplements or additives have done a damn thing. Not Roots Excelurator, not Shooting Powder, not Drip Clean. You know most of the hatred that is directed towards Advanced Nutrients? I direct mine towards H&G. I do not recommend anything they make and wouldn't buy anything from them.

But... Having said that... The hydro store people LOVE to sell the stuff. They seem to think it works, if that tells you anything...

Personally, I think General Hydroponics Rapid Start is the most effective root enhancer. At least in my experience. CX Nutrients Regen-a-Root is a pretty solid product as well. Rhizotonic is effective, but I found that General Organics BioWeed really beats them all when it comes to cost/effect. Since you asked for a Canna Product I listed one, but really, I don't use Rhizotonic myself anymore. BioWeed is my stand by for root growth, I try something else new almost every grow and so far the Rapid Start from Gen Hydro has worked best.

Papaduc,

One who posts a deliberately provocative message to a newsgroup or message board with the intention of causing maximum disruption and argument

I've seen you around. I know you're just stirring the pot. Yes, I have seen larger root systems from using Rhizotonic. Yes, I have seen better nutrient balance using Cannazym with the base Canna Coco, resulting in improved plant health and increased yields. No, I don't feel that you are entitled to my proof. Take my experience or leave it. Doesn't matter to me.

 

[dansbuds]

Personally, I think General Hydroponics Rapid Start is the most effective root enhancer. At least in my experience. CX Nutrients Regen-a-Root is a pretty solid product as well. Rhizotonic is effective, but I found that General Organics BioWeed really beats them all when it comes to cost/effect. Since you asked for a Canna Product I listed one, but really, I don't use Rhizotonic myself anymore. BioWeed is my stand by for root growth, I try something else new almost every grow and so far the Rapid Start from Gen Hydro has worked best.

Wassup snow crash Picked yerself up a doubter huh ? LMAO
I've been using KLN from dynagrow with pretty good results . alot cheaper than rhizo . may not have as many bene's in it as rhizo .... but it puts out some nice fat white roots !!! works great in the aerocloner too . 10 days in the cloner with it & some protekt .... & i get root balls now instead of stragely roots .

 

[bradybunch]

They are fairly different products. My experience with H&G has not been the same experience I read and hear about online. In my experiments none of their supplements or additives have done a damn thing. Not Roots Excelurator, not Shooting Powder, not Drip Clean. You know most of the hatred that is directed towards Advanced Nutrients? I direct mine towards H&G. I do not recommend anything they make and wouldn't buy anything from them.

Personally, I think General Hydroponics Rapid Start is the most effective root enhancer. At least in my experience. CX Nutrients Regen-a-Root is a pretty solid product as well. Rhizotonic is effective, but I found that General Organics BioWeed really beats them all when it comes to cost/effect. Since you asked for a Canna Product I listed one, but really, I don't use Rhizotonic myself anymore. BioWeed is my stand by for root growth, I try something else new almost every grow and so far the Rapid Start from Gen Hydro has worked best.

Thanks Snow Crash!

I heard the mark up on H&G is around 40%! I know exactly why they push it! Im in veg for my second run and below I listed what I was recommended by a friend, lol! I've noticed that lots of growers go thru buying all sorts of nutrients simply because their friend say so.

I'm on a quest for the right "Coco" recipe to maximize yields. My 818 Headbands are on 17gl pots with Canna Coco.

This is what I got from half a run of usage.
H&G Coco A/B
H&G Drip Clean
H&G Algen extract
H&G Roots exc
H&G BudXL
CaliMagic
Dyna Pro Tekt Silicon
Vitamino
Bio-Cozyme
FloraNectar
Monster Bloom
Open Sesame
Bountea (once a week in flwr/veg)

Should I stick to my nutrients and learn to use/tweak them or should I start with a clean slate and adopt another base and additives with the objective of achieving high yields?

Also, I read on the H&G official thread that coco a/b has the most CalMag ratio of any other base and therefore no need to use CalMag additives.

Sorry if this doesn't pertain to the thread. I thought since the topic is "whats the best coco nutes" I figured its within topic.

Thanks in advance!

 

[bmaster]

I agree that Canna nutes are a good choice for coco. They have worked well for my multi strain grows.

The only issues I have are the cost and the low calcium content of the base nutes. I found that I had to supplement with calmag, even using tap water.

I turned to House and Garden coco a&b nutes and haven't looked back. They are more concentrated than Canna, so you use less.
H&G has higher levels of calcium and magnesium which eliminates the need for calmag, even when using ro water.

I don't need or use the whole line, but what I use works well.
I use: coco a+b base nutes
Roots Excelurator.- works really well. I swear by it.
Multi zen
Bud XL
Top Booster
Drip Clean - I have had no salt buildup or toxicity issues since adding 1 ml/gallon to coco. It's a must have, imo.

I have tried them all. AN, Botanicare (also good nutes), Maxibloom, Canna, etc, but am very happy with House and Garden.

Of course, there are supplements that I use that work well and are compatible with H&G nutes

B52
Fulvic acid
Epsom salts - magnesium supplement occasionally
Molasses
Koolbloom ripening powder

They say..use what works for you...this works great for me.

 

[papaduc]

I've seen you around. I know you're just stirring the pot. Yes, I have seen larger root systems from using Rhizotonic. Yes, I have seen better nutrient balance using Cannazym with the base Canna Coco, resulting in improved plant health and increased yields. No, I don't feel that you are entitled to my proof. Take my experience or leave it. Doesn't matter to me.

Not sure where that came from.

I've used cannazym and rhizo and I found they weren't worth the money. So I stopped using them. That's all.

If plant health is being improved noticeably by using cannazym - to a degree you can clearly see and measure by eye - then the simple fact is you (or anyone else) were doing something wrong in the first place. Either that or it indicates that the brand's basic mix and PK don't yield good results alone.

If products like cannazym increase plant health, it should be extremely minimal and not on a level not measurable by the eye from one grow to the next. If the difference is that stark, there was a problem somewhere which wasn't to do with a lack of enzyme.

Whether you think I'm personally entitled to proof isn't even relevant. It's about whether you can provide it for anyone else. If you can, put it up for people to see and learn, critique, understand. Whatever.

If you can prove that things like cannazym work to gain measurable increases in plant health and yield then without doubt you should put that forward on a forum like this because that's the whole point of us being here. I'm sorry If you think being challenged or asked to do so is a personal insult.

Honestly, I'm not saying don't buy them. I'm saying they're optional extras and if you've got the basics dialed, you probably won't see a difference. I think the biggest effect is placebo.

If there's a measurable gain it's one to be measured on scales and will be grams on the pound at most. And to measure that you'd have to do many runs of the same clones in the same setup and minimise every possible variable. You already said you use something new on each grow, sometimes changing entire nute lines, so that isn't the case.

That's something I obviously can't overlook and if we're all mature enough there's no need to tread on eggshells. It is what it is and I'm just being straight.

We're talking about variables and measurable differences. The grow room is your test area. If you get results, explain them, report them, show them. It's one thing to talk about stuff, but another to document it in pictures in the form of a journal or side by side tests; two very important and interesting aspects of this cool forum.

I've used them, I've not used them. Believe me, if I could see a clear difference, I'd still be buying them now. Each to their own.

I welcome any challenges to my opinions on any aspect of gardening, provided it's kept relevant to the gardening itself. If you're looking for a personal argument you've picked the wrong dude. That's not my thing.

Take care.

 

[Lesterburnum]

As far as rhizo and canazym, I do notice a difference with both but I only use them a specific time in plant life cycles. Not every watering. And I use canna line without boost and bloombastic. Have for a long time.
But I have gone back and forth on each. I think it's dialing each one in when to use it.

 

[Lesterburnum]

I did use the gh rapid root in cloner. And rhizo in cloner. Rhizo kicked ass but clogged sprayers. Gh is solid and worked great!

 

[Snow Crash]

Wassup snow crash Picked yerself up a doubter huh ? LMAO
I've been using KLN from dynagrow with pretty good results . alot cheaper than rhizo . may not have as many bene's in it as rhizo .... but it puts out some nice fat white roots !!! works great in the aerocloner too . 10 days in the cloner with it & some protekt .... & i get root balls now instead of stragely roots .

I wish I could get KLN!!! California has them on the no-sell list right now. Probably some labeling thing like always...

 

[Snow Crash]

Thanks Snow Crash!

I heard the mark up on H&G is around 40%! I know exactly why they push it! Im in veg for my second run and below I listed what I was recommended by a friend, lol! I've noticed that lots of growers go thru buying all sorts of nutrients simply because their friend say so.

I'm on a quest for the right "Coco" recipe to maximize yields. My 818 Headbands are on 17gl pots with Canna Coco.

This is what I got from half a run of usage.
H&G Coco A/B
H&G Drip Clean
H&G Algen extract
H&G Roots exc
H&G BudXL
CaliMagic
Dyna Pro Tekt Silicon
Vitamino
Bio-Cozyme
FloraNectar
Monster Bloom
Open Sesame
Bountea (once a week in flwr/veg)

Should I stick to my nutrients and learn to use/tweak them or should I start with a clean slate and adopt another base and additives with the objective of achieving high yields?

Also, I read on the H&G official thread that coco a/b has the most CalMag ratio of any other base and therefore no need to use CalMag additives.

Sorry if this doesn't pertain to the thread. I thought since the topic is "whats the best coco nutes" I figured its within topic.

Thanks in advance!

Their MSRP markup is actually more than 2x the wholesale cost. The best deals out there are still 40% over cost.

Canna has 5% Nitrogen and 4.5% Calcium, I think that's a pretty high ratio... Also, House and Garden has significantly more Potassium than Canna. Potassium is a +1 cation and will compete with Calcium, a +2 cation, for uptake. While there may be more total calcium in the House and Garden, it is in a much lower ratio in comparison to the rest of the elements.

I use a variety of products as well. I can't really tell you what to do; but I can share what I do. Here's my approach:

Root Growth Supplement - GH Rapid Start
N dominant Veg base nutrient - Canna Coco A+B 5-4-3
Kelp Supplement - GO BioWeed
Humic/Amino Supplement - Botanicare Liquid Karma
Silicon Supplement - Whatever... Pro-Tekt/ProSilicate/etc
High P supplement - Green Planet Bud Booster 0-50-34
High K supplement - Advanced Nutrients Big Bud Dry 1-17-38
Magnesium supplement - Epsom Salt
Resin Enhancer - Cutting Edge Solutions Uncle John's Blend
PK Dominant Bloom base nutrient - Botanicare Ripe 1-5-4

My next round is going to be all Cyco Nutrients from their Platinum Line. So:

Cyco XL
Cyco Grow A+B
Cyco B1 Boost
Cyco Uptake
Cyco Silica
Cyco Swell
Cyco Potash Plus
Cyco Zyme
Cyco Bloom A+B

And the Dr. Repair if needed.

I will, of course, let you all know how that goes.

 

[RonSmooth]

Thanks Snow Crash!

I heard the mark up on H&G is around 40%! I know exactly why they push it! Im in veg for my second run and below I listed what I was recommended by a friend, lol! I've noticed that lots of growers go thru buying all sorts of nutrients simply because their friend say so.

I'm on a quest for the right "Coco" recipe to maximize yields. My 818 Headbands are on 17gl pots with Canna Coco.

This is what I got from half a run of usage.
H&G Coco A/B
H&G Drip Clean
H&G Algen extract
H&G Roots exc
H&G BudXL
CaliMagic
Dyna Pro Tekt Silicon
Vitamino
Bio-Cozyme
FloraNectar
Monster Bloom
Open Sesame
Bountea (once a week in flwr/veg)

Should I stick to my nutrients and learn to use/tweak them or should I start with a clean slate and adopt another base and additives with the objective of achieving high yields?

Also, I read on the H&G official thread that coco a/b has the most CalMag ratio of any other base and therefore no need to use CalMag additives.

Sorry if this doesn't pertain to the thread. I thought since the topic is "whats the best coco nutes" I figured its within topic.

Thanks in advance!

Whoa, thats a lot of bottles.

How long do you veg to end up in 17gal pots?

What are you pulling per plant in 17 gals?

I have gone through a few different brands before settling on MaxiBloom. I occasionally have to add Cal-Mag + depending on strain & stage but I have very low ppm tap water.

Also use DynaGro's Protekt as a pH up/silicon supplement.

Simple, inexpensive and effective.

 

[ThePizzaMan]

What is the deal with reusing your coco. Can I still run Koolbloom powder and reuse my coco. Dumping loads of coco every few months is not something I want to do.

Thanks

TpM

 

[RonSmooth]

What is the deal with reusing your coco. Can I still run Koolbloom powder and reuse my coco. Dumping loads of coco every few months is not something I want to do.

Thanks

TpM

The nutrients you use wouldn't matter, you could always flush it. I couldn't imagine removing all the roots. For me, Its not worth it to reuse it. I only go through a 5kg bale every few months.

I do dump it outside in my "compost pile" so its not totally wasted.

 

[Coconutz]

H&G says you cant reuse your media if you use shooting powder...
Im not sure about koolbloom. Id like to know from someone who has tried it

 

[NEW ENGLAND]

The GH works well with a mod Lucas,a li Moab and Soul Synthetics BIG SWELL,some Sugaree thrown in and you got some nice frosty tastey medicine.