Shatter??

[jump117]

Imo, decarboxylation doesn't seem to be speeded up by lowering the pressure. The BHO lab results the MMJ dispensaries put online show both THC and THC-A percentages, and I only see about the same relative proportion of THC-A to THC, never anything close to all THC. These oils are vacuum purged, some of the waxes probably for days... Another thing, I recently purged some BHO for several hours trying to get rid of mercaptans, no little bubbles from CO2. I then decarbed it at ~250F, watching the bubbles, and it stopped bubbling only a few minutes short of the expected twenty-seven.

Hey SkyHighler!
Thank you for the report of very interesting observation!

 

[r543]

So tried another run again and again got a softer product. This is within an hour, checking often. Is this overheating? Thanks for all the help guys

 

[nakadashi]

So tried another run again and again got a softer product. This is within an hour, checking often. Is this overheating? Thanks for all the help guys

If you really want a harder product you could try winterizing. This usually gets me a shatter that will crack at room temp.

 

[2000 tran zam]

The resin starts out as a carboxylic acid shatter, and softens with decarboxylation from heat.

We reliably produce room temperature shatter by purging in a thin film at 115F and -29.5" Hg until the solvent bubbles cease.

Can you point me to a product that i can actually set the temperature to without overheating my vacuum chamber?

I seem to be getting around -30.5 Hg.... that doesnt seem to sound right does it? is there a specific way to calibrate it?

Ive been using my electric top stove to heat up my chamber till it starts to bubble. I keep the heat on for another 10 seconds or so and then shut it off while keeping the pot on top the heated "off" part. It bubbles a decent amount. The whole time i do this i just keep it pressurized and closed off on both ends. Then i basically bring it back to my vacuum and reconnect it and continue for another few mins. After the bubbles kinda slow down i pull it out of vacuum to normal atmospheric pressure then cool it in the fridge, pull it out, mold it into a ball, mush it up a bit between my oil slab sheet and then pressurize it again and repeat the process. it seems to stabilize at room temperature the more I do it but it never seems to get to "shatter" material or a crumble material, both of which ive been chasing after. Its much more of a stiff taffy like substance.

Any suggestions?

 

[Gray Wolf]

Can you point me to a product that i can actually set the temperature to without overheating my vacuum chamber?

I seem to be getting around -30.5 Hg.... that doesnt seem to sound right does it? is there a specific way to calibrate it?

Ive been using my electric top stove to heat up my chamber till it starts to bubble. I keep the heat on for another 10 seconds or so and then shut it off while keeping the pot on top the heated "off" part. It bubbles a decent amount. The whole time i do this i just keep it pressurized and closed off on both ends. Then i basically bring it back to my vacuum and reconnect it and continue for another few mins. After the bubbles kinda slow down i pull it out of vacuum to normal atmospheric pressure then cool it in the fridge, pull it out, mold it into a ball, mush it up a bit between my oil slab sheet and then pressurize it again and repeat the process. it seems to stabilize at room temperature the more I do it but it never seems to get to "shatter" material or a crumble material, both of which ive been chasing after. Its much more of a stiff taffy like substance.

Any suggestions?

Suggest you check out heat mats. Perhaps Skyhighler will pop in, as he has done considerable field work on the subject and posted these two, along with his experimentation with controllers.

http://briskheat.com/
http://www.omega.com/

Ya, your gauge needs calibration. Does it have a calibration gauge in the face?

You will get to shatter faster in a thin film at about 115F and -29.5" Hg. If you pull it when the solvent bubbles stop, and only C02 bubbles remain, it will stay shatter.
​

 

[r543]

Thanks for all the advice guys.

I will keep trying gray wolf. It sounds like I am over heating. This is a true art. Do you have any kind of time frames? is under an hour reasonable?

 

[SkyHighLer]

Can you point me to a product that i can actually set the temperature to without overheating my vacuum chamber?

I seem to be getting around -30.5 Hg.... that doesnt seem to sound right does it? is there a specific way to calibrate it?

Ive been using my electric top stove to heat up my chamber till it starts to bubble. I keep the heat on for another 10 seconds or so and then shut it off while keeping the pot on top the heated "off" part. It bubbles a decent amount. The whole time i do this i just keep it pressurized and closed off on both ends. Then i basically bring it back to my vacuum and reconnect it and continue for another few mins. After the bubbles kinda slow down i pull it out of vacuum to normal atmospheric pressure then cool it in the fridge, pull it out, mold it into a ball, mush it up a bit between my oil slab sheet and then pressurize it again and repeat the process. it seems to stabilize at room temperature the more I do it but it never seems to get to "shatter" material or a crumble material, both of which ive been chasing after. Its much more of a stiff taffy like substance.

Any suggestions?

How to test and recalibrate dial vacuum gauges by comparing the observed boiling point of water under vacuum to the standard boiling point of water under vacuum.

https://www.icmag.com/ic/showpost.php?p=5869373&postcount=76


Heat mats,

https://www.icmag.com/ic/showpost.php?p=5915060&postcount=4


DIY PID temperature controller with solid state relay wiring,

https://www.icmag.com/ic/showpost.php?p=5935324&postcount=152

115F down to -29.5" Hg for twenty minutes purges the butane, I usually go for about an hour to an hour and a half to be sure all the moisture has also been boiled off.

 

[2000 tran zam]

Suggest you check out heat mats. Perhaps Skyhighler will pop in, as he has done considerable field work on the subject and posted these two, along with his experimentation with controllers.

http://briskheat.com/
http://www.omega.com/

Ya, your gauge needs calibration. Does it have a calibration gauge in the face?

You will get to shatter faster in a thin film at about 115F and -29.5" Hg. If you pull it when the solvent bubbles stop, and only C02 bubbles remain, it will stay shatter.
​

Thank you for the info. Im using a tamisium extractor to extract my oils and im wondering if im overheating the extraction chamber to evaporate the butane out and in the process maybe its darkening up my extract? They dont have heating jackets yet but when I spoke to david at tamisiumextractors.com he said it was gonna be something close to 1000 bucks for it for the te175 system... which seems a bit outrageous. Im wondering if I can contact brisk heat and give them the dimensions of the extraction tank and have one custom built.

the pressure gauge i have is a durachoice oil filled one as seen here :
http://www.amazon.com/2-1-Filled-Va...dp_top_cm_cr_acr_txt?ie=UTF8&showViewpoints=1

I am using vector for my butane as im waiting for my friend to get a tank of 99.5 n butane in. is there any difference in the quality of it as long as i purge the shit out of my end product with low heat and many hours of vacuum?

Also, is there a difference if I run my vacuum to full pressure and then close the valves to keep it pressurized as opposed to just letting the vacuum run for a long time? My pump gets REALLY hot after 10 mins of use and starts spewing mineral oil a bit so I just dont want to run my pump to death if its not necessary.

Thanks again for any advice

oh and just for reference below are pics of some of the product ive made so far... the one with finger prints was actually made from pretty frosty indoor trim from about half a year ago... and other one was made from some sour grape nugs that were about 8 months old.

 

[2000 tran zam]

How to test and recalibrate dial vacuum gauges by comparing the observed boiling point of water under vacuum to the standard boiling point of water under vacuum.

https://www.icmag.com/ic/showpost.php?p=5869373&postcount=76


Heat mats,

https://www.icmag.com/ic/showpost.php?p=5915060&postcount=4


DIY PID temperature controller with solid state relay wiring,

https://www.icmag.com/ic/showpost.php?p=5935324&postcount=152

115F down to -29.5" Hg for twenty minutes purges the butane, I usually go for about an hour to an hour and a half to be sure all the moisture has also been boiled off.

Ok so basically id need to purchase this for the controller :

http://www.dorkfood.com/Dorkfood-Temperature-Controller-Sous-vide/dp/B0088OTON4

and from here : http://www.omega.com/pptst/SRFR_SRFG.html#order

SRFR-12/2 $77.00 $77.00 1 Week
ROUND SILICONE RUBBER HEATER


Do they just simply connect to each other or is there anything else I would need to purchase for it?

 

[SkyHighLer]

Ok so basically id need to purchase this for the controller :

http://www.dorkfood.com/Dorkfood-Temperature-Controller-Sous-vide/dp/B0088OTON4

and from here : http://www.omega.com/pptst/SRFR_SRFG.html#order

SRFR-12/2 $77.00 $77.00 1 Week
ROUND SILICONE RUBBER HEATER


Do they just simply connect to each other or is there anything else I would need to purchase for it?

You need to add a plug to the mat, anything with screw terminals, I found these at Ace,
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00176JQQ0/ref=oh_details_o04_s00_i00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

There must be insulation under the mat, the sensor must be tight up against the mat, and the mat must be tight up against the bottom of your chamber.

Check the set value of the temperature controller against the actual oil temperature measured with an IR thermometer, do this with the lid off the chamber. You can't get a good reading through plastic or glass, and with the lid on, the trapped warm air will raise the oil temperature higher than what it would be under vacuum. Once the oil is in the chamber I don't leave the lid on unless I'm pulling a vacuum to avoid this rise in temperature.

 

[SkyHighLer]

Thank you for the info. Im using a tamisium extractor to extract my oils and im wondering if im overheating the extraction chamber to evaporate the butane out and in the process maybe its darkening up my extract? They dont have heating jackets yet but when I spoke to david at tamisiumextractors.com he said it was gonna be something close to 1000 bucks for it for the te175 system... which seems a bit outrageous. Im wondering if I can contact brisk heat and give them the dimensions of the extraction tank and have one custom built.

the pressure gauge i have is a durachoice oil filled one as seen here :
http://www.amazon.com/2-1-Filled-Va...dp_top_cm_cr_acr_txt?ie=UTF8&showViewpoints=1

I am using vector for my butane as im waiting for my friend to get a tank of 99.5 n butane in. is there any difference in the quality of it as long as i purge the shit out of my end product with low heat and many hours of vacuum?

Also, is there a difference if I run my vacuum to full pressure and then close the valves to keep it pressurized as opposed to just letting the vacuum run for a long time? My pump gets REALLY hot after 10 mins of use and starts spewing mineral oil a bit so I just dont want to run my pump to death if its not necessary.

Thanks again for any advice

oh and just for reference below are pics of some of the product ive made so far... the one with finger prints was actually made from pretty frosty indoor trim from about half a year ago... and other one was made from some sour grape nugs that were about 8 months old.

Inexpensive dial pressure gauges,
http://www.directmaterial.com/Pressure_Gauges_s/1.htm

After your dial gauge reaches it's maximum reading, the pressure is still going down, you need an electronic micron meter to read it. I love my Yellow Jacket 69075...

The pumps are designed to be run for 6-8 hours straight in the field, but if your chamber's holding the vacuum there's no reason to keep it running.

Also there is no reason for crazy ass long purges except to manipulate the texture of the product, as in to get wax/budder rather than sap/shatter.

 

[2000 tran zam]

Inexpensive dial pressure gauges,
http://www.directmaterial.com/Pressure_Gauges_s/1.htm

After your dial gauge reaches it's maximum reading, the pressure is still going down, you need an electronic micron meter to read it. I love my Yellow Jacket 69075...

The pumps are designed to be run for 6-8 hours straight in the field, but if your chamber's holding the vacuum there's no reason to keep it running.

Also there is no reason for crazy ass long purges except to manipulate the texture of the product, as in to get wax/budder rather than sap/shatter.

ya i really enjoy the consistency of crumble/honeycomb, I seem to be able to make decent shatter so I need to figure out how to get it that way, Ive tried whipping it but at room temp it just starts to ball up in a taffy amber ball. right now its sittin in the chamber somewhat poofy, I did throw a little heat under it just dont wanna do it too much. ill try to get a pic of how it looks in the chamber here shortly. its no problem holding pressure, even overnight, it comes out to be the same as i put it in.

 

[Gray Wolf]

Thank you for the info. Im using a tamisium extractor to extract my oils and im wondering if im overheating the extraction chamber to evaporate the butane out and in the process maybe its darkening up my extract? They dont have heating jackets yet but when I spoke to david at tamisiumextractors.com he said it was gonna be something close to 1000 bucks for it for the te175 system... which seems a bit outrageous. Im wondering if I can contact brisk heat and give them the dimensions of the extraction tank and have one custom built.

the pressure gauge i have is a durachoice oil filled one as seen here :
http://www.amazon.com/2-1-Filled-Va...dp_top_cm_cr_acr_txt?ie=UTF8&showViewpoints=1

I am using vector for my butane as im waiting for my friend to get a tank of 99.5 n butane in. is there any difference in the quality of it as long as i purge the shit out of my end product with low heat and many hours of vacuum?

Also, is there a difference if I run my vacuum to full pressure and then close the valves to keep it pressurized as opposed to just letting the vacuum run for a long time? My pump gets REALLY hot after 10 mins of use and starts spewing mineral oil a bit so I just dont want to run my pump to death if its not necessary.

Thanks again for any advice

oh and just for reference below are pics of some of the product ive made so far... the one with finger prints was actually made from pretty frosty indoor trim from about half a year ago... and other one was made from some sour grape nugs that were about 8 months old.

We did a nice extraction job using a 110F hot water bath for the TE-175. Heat transfer is better than with a heat mat.

Both are high quality, but one is just n-Butane and the other is a mixture of n-Butane, Isobutane, and Propane.

You can valve your pump off under vacuum and run it intermittently, as long as your chamber is holding the vacuum levels.

 

[ceosam]

I use an infrared thermometer to check the temperature while it's still under vacuum. Someone with professional equipment can just set the temp with a vacuum oven.

How without opening it? My infrared thermo gives me the temp of the clear acrylic vacuum top when I try to beam through it.

 

[2000 tran zam]

We did a nice extraction job using a 110F hot water bath for the TE-175. Heat transfer is better than with a heat mat.

Both are high quality, but one is just n-Butane and the other is a mixture of n-Butane, Isobutane, and Propane.

You can valve your pump off under vacuum and run it intermittently, as long as your chamber is holding the vacuum levels.

Thats pretty much what ive been doing... i put a pot of water on the stove... put the heat on mid till it gets to about 100 degrees give or take then put it on low to keep the temp from creeping up too much and then put my extraction chamber in the water and use the IR gauge to keep an eye on it. Usually the extraction chamber stays between 88 and 94 degrees and the line that the butane evaps through back to the recovery tank stays a bit warm. Im starting to freeze my recovery tank and purge out the propane to keep my pressures from rising, seems to help with recovery time so far.

heres a picture of the grapefruit kush extract i purged overnight while holding vacuum... its really nice but Im really looking for that crumble consistency. What would you guys suggest I do from this point? I heated purged while under vacuum once but didnt want to keep doing it cause I want to keep the color light.