Soil/Indoor: Giving nutes everytime or alternate?

[subdub]

Hi,

I am a soil/indoor grower and I always put nutes everytime I water the plants. I start with clones most of the time.

Using classic grow/flowering nutriments then PK13/14, I was wondering if alternating clear water / water+nutes would impact positively or negatively the growth and development of my plants.

Would it improve the final product taste as well ? I had a friend who grew indoor and would never put any nutriments. Buds were a bit less dense, but taste was truly great.

Personal experience and/or technical proof most welcome!

Thank for your time,
subdub.

 

[Granger2]

For one thing, what are you feeding? If you are using organic nutes, I would water every third time, because you've probably got slower release nutes in the medium. If your using chems, watering every 3rd time keeps salts from building up. Good luck. -granger

 

[subdub]

I was using chems nutes so far (A/B solutions), but I might want to switch to bio this time to try it out. So 1 out of 3 times, clear water? Seems reasonable

 

[Granger2]

I would use dechlorinated Ph'd water unless your tap is pretty close to 6-6.5 in soil. -granger

 

[hawkwindzoo]

Feed everytime for me

 

[RonSmooth]

Feed low EC every time here until the final 2 weeks when they get plain tap water. Tap water is 50 ppm and 7pH.


ps

what are "chem nutes"? I know what you mean but isn't that term a bit misleading?

I guess there isnt a really good generic term for non-"organic" nutrients but there has to be something better than "chem"

 

[subdub]

Yeah I was doing the same, feed until 14 to 20 days of clear water.
I guess I'll try feeding 2 of 3 times next session and check if taste improves.
And yes you are right, "chem nutes" is confusing, well I meant the non-organic ones, ie: Atami B'cuzz Soil A/B.

 

[Granger2]

Ron,
I guess you mean YOUR tap water. Tap water varies from local to local. Mine is 8.3 pH and 340 ppm. -granger

 

[Granger2]

I don't know why yall say that chem nutes is not a good term. It is very apropo, since most ingredients in chem nutes are chemicals. -granger

 

[Snow Crash]

I don't know why yall say that chem nutes is not a good term. It is very apropo, since most ingredients in chem nutes are chemicals. -granger

That depends on how you define "chemical."

I actually consider them to be more "salt" or "mineral" rather than "chemical." To me, something like shampoo or clothing dye is a chemical. Elements are just elements, and salts are just a step up. Chelates like EDTA are sort of chemically to me but so are organic chelates like Fulvic acid.

I think that organiphiles tend to use the word "chemical" to describe element/salt/mineral nutrients specifically for the negative connotation associated with the word. Calling it a Salt or Mineral based nutrient is less harsh sounding.

Actually, if anything contains "chemicals" in the way I define them (Molecules containing more than 3 elements) it's organics. Humic and Fulvic Acids contain chemicals. Auxins and Cytokinens, while hormones, are still "chemicals." I think we need to shed the coercive language when discussing nutrients for the sake of accuracy and legitimacy.

Having said all that... Don't use chemical/salt/mineral based nutrients in soil. Just don't do it. You will get much, much, much better results supporting and nourishing the microbial population in the soil. If you want to grow with bottled nutrients then go soilless, peat or coco is fantastic. But if you're in soil then utilize the system at your disposal by applying compost tea, fungal tea, and botanical tea. Soil IS Nutrients. Beneficial bacteria will help break down organic molecules to release the elemental nutrition inside and the fungal symbiosis will enhance uptake. You also don't need to worry about pH in true organics as the bacteria will regulate the pH buffer.

Salts in soil is just a bag of worms. Yes, it can work. But there's just an easier and "better" way of helping your plant to thrive.

 

[subdub]

Interesting, Snow Crash.
Would Canna "Bio" line work with "classic" soil? If not, is there any "bottled" nuts you could recommend? I have no experience with compost and tea whatsoever, I got a few thread bookmarked there, but for my new session I'll go soil again.
Thanks for your answer guys.
Cheers!

 

[Snow Crash]

Bottled Organics are tricky, as they can differ greatly from product to product.

The one that I would recommend is Age Old Organics. I have run Roots Organics, Organicare, General Organics, CANNA Bio, and Earth Juice in my own past trying to find the best of the bunch. Organics is just a completely different way of getting nutrition into the plant and bottled nutrients aren't always designed to completely support the soil system.

Age Old Organics has great concentrations, great prices, and they are the absolute opposite of the advertising megashitstorm Advanced Nutrients, you may have never heard of them despite being one of the older nutrient companies still on the market because of their utter lack of advertising. I encourage you to do more homework into Organics so that you better understand the symbiotic nature of the Rhizosphere, the Trichoderma, Mycorrhizae, and all the beneficial bacteria. The best results from organics come from a more complete understanding and properly directed nutrient feedings, starting with a good soil mix and supporting that mix is paramount to dropping in massive amounts of NPK to try and get your plant what she wants.

Bottom line though, the results I get from compost tea BLOW AWAY the results I have gotten from bottled organics. It's super simple stuff. Do a little reading, get a couple of the staple products (Molasses, Compost, Kelp), and get your brew on man. If you can make pancakes from instant mix you can brew compost tea. It's that easy.

 

[subdub]

Excellent, I'm definitely going to check that.
I'm reading a lot about coco right now and it seems great to, somewhat reliable *and* reusable which is a plus when you grow indoor.
Anyway thanks for your great advices ! Do you have any grow log with compost tea I could check ?

Thanks,
Cheers!

 

[Snow Crash]

Coco is great. It's my absolute favorite hydroponic media because it is just so versatile. You can use stronger feeding draining to waste, you can use light feedings with minimal runoff, you can mix it with soil, you can recirculate your nutrients, water 2x a day or once ever 2 days. It basically does it all.

Reusability was one of the main reasons I chose coco. I find the 2nd and 3rd rounds tend to out perform the first and fourth rounds. Usually I save what is loose and easy to knock out of the root ball but I don't recycle every last little bit. Instead I add a little fresh coco back into the mix every time and just keep that going.

Unfortunately I don't have any grow logs up here right now. I'm sort of lazy when it comes to that stuff... There's a lot around and you can learn quite a bit from the organic forums here. Jerry111165, Microbeman, Uncle Ben, and Legion have all helped contribute to my organic knowledge base and I would suggest looking into them.

For what it is worth though, it takes me a solid 6 months of investigating and mulling over information before I feel I have even a tenuous grasp of any new subject in growing. It took me some time to really come full circle and to understand the organophiles method and mentality. There's nothing you're going to read in 20 minutes that will fill in every gap. Just take it slow, keep researching, and over time you'll get it figured out. The nature of watching plants grow I guess. We learn better slowly over time.

 

[Granger2]

Sound advice^^^^.

On recycling coco-I've done it different ways, but it performs equally well like this, and is a huge labor/mess saver. Remove previously harvested plants. Just yank them out. Water with pH'd water with 1 Tbl Hygrozyme with good runoff. The coco was flushed heavily at end of previous crop. When pots are quite a bit lighter when you pick them up, I water with a Ca, Mg, trace charge like it were new coco. Next day plant new plants by digging a hole just big enough to accommodate the transplant, using Mycos. Water with med strength transition nutes with Ca, Mg, trace, and root stimulator. Plants take off same as if I had removed and broken up the coco. Way easier, same results. Good luck. -granger

 

[Deftoner]

I always water,water, feed. Never failed to produce healthy girls

 

[subdub]

Coco, here I come ! Still digesting so much read and notes

 

[mohammed romney]

Hey SC

Have you investigated and mulled over the research that debunks the compost tea bandwagon?

I grow organic with choice amendments. i had been a tea advocate for years but Chalker Scott and others along with personal experience have me wondering if tea is legit.

 

[Snow Crash]

Hey SC

Have you investigated and mulled over the research that debunks the compost tea bandwagon?

I grow organic with choice amendments. i had been a tea advocate for years but Chalker Scott and others along with personal experience have me wondering if tea is legit.

Nope, I haven't heard anything about debunking compost tea but it would take some serious convincing to change my mind on microbes. I've seen first hand the impact that a good compost tea can have.

 

[mohammed romney]

Theres plenty of easy to find tea debunking info online. The basic argument seems to be that there in no peer reviewed literature documenting the efficacy of tea. On the other hand top dressing and soil amendments are well documented,proven techniques. So the authors basically suggest using our tea fixens directly in the media.