Perpetual PLL Microcab + LED Scrog Cab

[Neekz]

I think I remember reading over in the LED's about the DIY'ers recommending 1 watt per every sq. inch on the heatsink and I believe that is an active heatsink. Passive I believe was bigger obviously. Don't quote me.

Quoted lol, not hard to achieve proper heat-sink surface area with a finned sink, and most of the wattage crowding problem's can be cured with a proper fan setup. If you look at the Kessil, they essentially have 12-15 little emitter's crammed on a single primary lens, and heat-sink/die, that is then attached to a cpu style heat-sink, then the open driver board, and FINALLY the 40mm fan blowing down it all... Not quite "efficient", and I am sure we can do simillar for cheaper, maybe not as far as adding a third spectrum (Would have to ask the chip manufacturer, but I think they would respond to customer demand, a few whites would round the chip out perfectly...). Also in Chloemob's case, running 5 on a wider spread panel, you could also tone down the current, since the spread is more even. Different strokes for different folk's, some peeps enjoy single-point-of-source-lighting, others multiple (Multiple is really a win, unless confined, in terms of L.E.D.).

 

[Oregonism]

Quoted lol,

Before I hijack this thread anymore, love that attitude, push the limits always, I understand that, message sent.

If this could compete with half of the small HGL fixture, I might just attempt to clusterfawk one together!

happy growing...

 

[Chloemobile]

No need to worry about hijacking at all I love it. Fostering, not inhibiting, knowledge and community


Led cab with about 2- 3 weeks left. Nugs are nice and dense tons of flowers nice and tightly spaced. I like the spectrum of this led but need to figure out out to pretty much double the out put.

1 gallon coco DTW(which is massive) has 4-5 weeks.

 

[hush]

I just now found this thread. Wow, dude, you have your shit dialed!

 

[trem0lo]

Neekz, those are sweet, however, I think I remember reading over in the LED's about the DIY'ers recommending 1 watt per every sq. inch on the heatsink and I believe that is an active heatsink. Passive I believe was bigger obviously. Don't quote me.

I believe it was 9 sq inches per watt for an actively cooled heatsink, 18 for passive. So for a 20 watt light you'd want 180in2 of surface area, or you may risk the junction temps of the LEDs getting too high thus reducing lumens.

If you can find the *C/W, or thermal resistance, of the heatsink, that's basically how many degrees over ambient it's going to get per watt of heat. A heatsink with a thermal resistance of 2 would be 6 degrees Celsius over ambient with a 3 watt LED. That's not much, but any more and it'll get toasty real fast.

That formula is for uncooled heatsinks. Adding a fan, say a basic 120mm 50 CFM computer fan, we can calculate that too. I won't go into the math, but it's moving ~300 LFM (linear feet/minute) which warrants the *C/W to be multiplied by 0.42, giving us 1.05 as the new *C/W rating for the above heatsink. Big difference. So, point a fan at your LED heatsinks, your plants will thank you.

Ok, enough maths. Chloe, the plants are looking great. Love those rock hard nuggets! Do you notice a difference at all between your led and pll cabs in size/odor/quality?

 

[Chloemobile]

Very good summarized heat sink info. Thanks for that trem0lo.

The led nugs are much denser, but not as big as the pll. I attribute this to 110w vs ~26w. The led is better quality light I just need more of it. I also needed to veg my soil plants longer to get the yield I should have gotten out of these 1 gallon containers. But the coco plant is doing fine under the LEDs it has the bigges densest nugs of all my plants. The plls have givn me nice dense nugs before but I've never grown in coco with the Plls and they seem a bit airier than usual. ill have to wait a few more week to see how they start putting in weight to be sure. I figure if I up my wattage to 50 in the 11x11 cab I should really be able to pull a good amount of bud. Coco hempy bed with 4 clones is the plan.

To make sure my heat sink fits in the cab I am going to get a 10x 10 one and woudl like to put 5 of the 10w chips in a dice pattern l think any more than that I think will be over kill. Maybe r/b combo 10w diodes on the corners and a warm white diode in the center. 50watts at 9 sqinches gives me 450 square inches of heat sinks. I think that's doable on. 10i. Sq heat sink. Still conceptualizing but that mostly is the vision.

 

[Oregonism]

I believe it was 9 sq inches per watt for an actively cooled heatsink, 18 for passive. So for a 20 watt light you'd want 180in2 of surface area, or you may risk the junction temps of the LEDs getting too high thus reducing lumens.

If you can find the *C/W, or thermal resistance, of the heatsink, that's basically how many degrees over ambient it's going to get per watt of heat. A heatsink with a thermal resistance of 2 would be 6 degrees Celsius over ambient with a 3 watt LED. That's not much, but any more and it'll get toasty real fast.

That formula is for uncooled heatsinks. Adding a fan, say a basic 120mm 50 CFM computer fan, we can calculate that too. I won't go into the math, but it's moving ~300 LFM (linear feet/minute) which warrants the *C/W to be multiplied by 0.42, giving us 1.05 as the new *C/W rating for the above heatsink. Big difference. So, point a fan at your LED heatsinks, your plants will thank you.

Ok, enough maths. Chloe, the plants are looking great. Love those rock hard nuggets! Do you notice a difference at all between your led and pll cabs in size/odor/quality?

Kessil makes great lights, they use a different concept, they also have a dedicated US research and development team, nothing against stoner science, but we just don't have that budget to develop cutting edge cooling solutions every day, like a Kessil does.


@[Tremolo] ^Yes........I read this thread last night and this morning, I urge everyone to digest it all, 43 pages, but worth it:
Building new panels https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=253160&page=3 rrog and rives + a few other lights that are aesthetically stunning for DIY.

Rives always talks about overkill, which isn't overdriving, it is more a term of guaranteed reliance, strengthening the whole system up. The panel was a bunch of Cree XML-6 [10w's]at 2.1a, even though they could handle 3a @45v. Like Tremolo described as the current increases the heat drops down lumen output.

Heat sinks last forever virtually too! So they can be repurposed technically from other things. I have a 10x8 piece as well and now I need to do some of Tremolo's math to see if one or two of those Cree's would fit @ 75% of max voltage.


Chloe as usual, going off the rails on the dank train, peace.

 

[Chloemobile]

Lol the dank train, I appreciate that O. I really enjoy when you weigh in I know I can count on some thoughtful discussion. Trem and neekz too thank you for dropping the knowledge bombs left and right!

 

[kiwi_growa]

Beautiful buds man.

 

[Chloemobile]

Beautiful buds man.

Thanks m8

 

[Garuda]

Both cabs are very interesting, crazy colored buds with your leds I'm in

 

[VerdantGreen]

scrog is looking nice!

i would try a bigger pot next time and it'll probably give you a bigger yield

VG

 

[Chloemobile]

scrog is looking nice!

i would try a bigger pot next time and it'll probably give you a bigger yield

VG

I started to come to this conclusion shortly after i had everything up and running but was interested in comparing the results from treating two different mediums the same way in my cab. How long do you recommend vegging soil in a 3 gallon pot?i know this is probably heavily strain dependent, but i just havent been able to grasp the best way to up pot soil plants yet.

I have been itching to get my hands on some of those integrated chips like you are running now but im going to wait to see how your grow turns out and what you think about them.

in the mean time i have 7 more slots on my heatsink that i can fill up with LEDS. So I am currently thinking out some different combinations of colors and additional drivers etc. I really like the CW Chips they are so bright and i think really help with the intensity of the lights and attributing to the denseness off the buds. RIght now im thinking 2x660, 2xWW, 2xCW and either 1UV(430?) or 1 IR(730?) still researching and reading. then i could run all of the whites and blues on a new higher amperage driver and leave the Reds on the 700ma. So, i would be getting more power and more light spread, i think at this point i should probably add a fan though. Hopefully i can have all that setup before i start my next grow.

 

[Chloemobile]

Both cabs are very interesting, crazy colored buds with your leds I'm in

Ive gotten used to i guess -. I like the hue of my light even better than traditional light sources -its kind of makes the plants look they are in HD - HD lighting or some shit. its mostly light pink(more white than anything) with just a touch of blue to make it a light white pinkurple. (pinkurple patent pending CM industries)



Here is a little update though. Harvest date is still 2 weekish. probably going to stop feeding them with nutes in the LED cab. took a little sample ( one of many because im dry. and its great now so if it can only get better for to weeks then ill be a happy camper!

 

[2000pm]

Those nugs are looking tight with the led frost coated look, good show!

 

[Chloemobile]

Those nugs are looking tight with the led frost coated look, good show!

Thanks!

 

[Chloemobile]

So I have to start chopping everything a bit early. Having some family over in a few weeks and its just going to be less stressful for my ol lady if I have it all shut down and jarred up before then. Not sure when ill fire it up again but we shall see!

 

[Chloemobile]

Put the LED fixture into the PLL cab. I really would like to get 2 more fixtures of this size.

 

[MrCopyZ]

Buds look nice. Hopefully they end up as tight as they look. I find that my buds are usually more dense then they first appeared...

 

[Chloemobile]

Buds look nice. Hopefully they end up as tight as they look. I find that my buds are usually more dense then they first appeared...

Thanks MrCopyZ.

They didn't end up as tight :/ still not bad though. I ended up with just under 32 grams from all 3 plants. 20 from the biggest plant 8 from the second and 4 from the runty one. I can easily put 3-4 of the bigger ones in there and probably squeak out a few more grams per plant too by growing them a bit better(more attention). Gonna put some pics of the dried harvest up.