This is my 2nd vert attempt. And I was wondering if it's better to veg flat seems to me my little ones would grow taller with a. Flat veg I would think they would reach for the light. Last round I switched to vert when they went in to flower so I don't know how they do in a vert veg. So far a few. Seem to be growing out instead of up. I finished a foot from the celing. I would like to use all my available space. Any input is appreciated?
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vert veg? or horzontal veg?
- Thread starter packerfan79
- Start date
I veg vert. I use the placement of the light to shape my plants. For example if I have a plant that stretches a lot I will lower the light on the side of the plant. If I have a plant that tends to bush out I raise the light above the plant and cause it to stretch up to the light.
If you know how your strain grows in vert flower you can use the light placement to get the shape you want so you do not have to prune the plant to get the shape you want going into flower. This just means you will need to grow your strain to learn it's growth tendencies. But what will you do with the extra smoke while you learn them? Oh the troubles us vert growers have to deal with.
If you know how your strain grows in vert flower you can use the light placement to get the shape you want so you do not have to prune the plant to get the shape you want going into flower. This just means you will need to grow your strain to learn it's growth tendencies. But what will you do with the extra smoke while you learn them? Oh the troubles us vert growers have to deal with.
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DHF
Icky knows his strains and how they react to sideways lighting , however....
Plants don`t veg the same with bare bulbs as they do under horizontal fixtures , so bottom line it depends on what your goals are as far as your setup`s concerned......
I started out veggin under 400 watt MH fixtures way back in the day runnin Krusty buckets for big plants , and then switched over to T-5`s when I went to increased plant numbers with ebb and flow buckets then Coco DTW setups.....and why ?......
Cuz keepin the lights down as close as possible to the plants stacks nodes and keeps lateral limbs from branchin out , as to where regardless of strain and light orientation with bare bulbs the plants will ALWAYS bush out toward the sideways lumens even while stretchin up as well with the proper hybrids.....that said.....
We really need more info on your gameplan to determine how many plants will be run , and what type setup for that perfect sideways canopy that makes vertical growing advantageous with appropriately increased yields and returns......IOW....
The less "sideways" growth from the laterals keeps plants from growin into and choking each other out , and finding that happy medium for dialed and consistent results is whatchas are after......anyways.....
Good luck and welcome.....
Peace.....DHF.....
......Ok more info. I have a 24 inch shelf that runs the perimeter of my 6.5 x 6.5 x 6.5 tent.with 12 plants on the shelf and 12 plants on the floor in front the shelves. I am running 2 1ks stacked in cooltubes. I know barebulb is better but I live in a hotass desert so I have to run ac. I am running real og, Skywalker og, and a bubblegum/ chemdog cross. So the ogs stretch pretty good. The bubblegum cross doesn't stretch as muchso it stays on the floor level. My. Last round wasn't a fair judge I had a Spidermite problem.
D
DHF
Ok...Now we`re getting somewhere.....If you`re only runnin 2 strains , then all yas gotta do is learn how long to veg the more indica dominant strain on the floor so they reach up to the bottoms of the upper shelf plants by the time they stop their limited stretch cycle.....and then.....
You`ve got the rest of the height of the tent to create that perfect sideways canopy so there`s no holes , and yas form the "walls of weed" so every sq in is covered and "penetrated" by the sideways light source......and hey.....
I`ve ALWAYS fucked with folks about usin cooltubes cuz they`re not needed with major air exchange twice per min , even in dry arid locations like you live in , but I respect fully your decision to control your environment by any means necessary cuz it don`t matter HOW much light yas sling at em if yas can`t control ambient temps and relative humidity.....now....
I strongly suggest yas put in the budget some type of humidifier/fogger to keep RH in the 70% range till end of stretch to keep the plants fvrom sweatin/transpiring too much that in turn fucks with nutrient uptake that will in turn cause ph issues with lockouts and imbalances right around the corner....so....
Back to your original question of how to veg....I suggest T-5`s right down on top of the plants to stack nodes and limit lateral growth till goin in the tents and flipped to 12/12 , but.....
With only 3 plants on each 6.5' wall , you`ve gotta watch out for the corner plants choking each other out and STILL fill in a ft on each side on each shelf to fill in the sideways canopy for finished walls of weed with no open holes in said sideways canopy , and that means runs under yer belt with trial and error to find the plant`s sweet spots by end of stretch.....anyways....bottom line....
It`s possible that veggin with the cooltubes might be beneficial to make the plants bush out by end of stretch since you`ve got plenty of light in the tent to prevent elongated internode spacing , but again it`ll take doin it to find out where they`ll end up so they don`t grow into each other by end of stretch....and .....
Make sure yas clean and hack out the backs if veggin with the cooltubes , cuz they will be bushier and thicker by the time stretch is done , and the last thing yas want is a buncha flarfy ass popcorn the lights can`t get back to and promote proper swellage....
When yas chop out the backs , yas`re allowing the front limbs and nugs closest to the light source to be all they can be and swell accordingly , just like horizontal growers "lollipop" their plants underneath for the same end results come Harvey......things to ponder.....and...
As yas see it`s not simple/cut and dried on how to veg since different folks have different goals with far more plants , or far less like your situation , so get ta work and figure out which works best for your personal setup and get back to us....
Good luck....DHF..........
You`ve got the rest of the height of the tent to create that perfect sideways canopy so there`s no holes , and yas form the "walls of weed" so every sq in is covered and "penetrated" by the sideways light source......and hey.....
I`ve ALWAYS fucked with folks about usin cooltubes cuz they`re not needed with major air exchange twice per min , even in dry arid locations like you live in , but I respect fully your decision to control your environment by any means necessary cuz it don`t matter HOW much light yas sling at em if yas can`t control ambient temps and relative humidity.....now....
I strongly suggest yas put in the budget some type of humidifier/fogger to keep RH in the 70% range till end of stretch to keep the plants fvrom sweatin/transpiring too much that in turn fucks with nutrient uptake that will in turn cause ph issues with lockouts and imbalances right around the corner....so....
Back to your original question of how to veg....I suggest T-5`s right down on top of the plants to stack nodes and limit lateral growth till goin in the tents and flipped to 12/12 , but.....
With only 3 plants on each 6.5' wall , you`ve gotta watch out for the corner plants choking each other out and STILL fill in a ft on each side on each shelf to fill in the sideways canopy for finished walls of weed with no open holes in said sideways canopy , and that means runs under yer belt with trial and error to find the plant`s sweet spots by end of stretch.....anyways....bottom line....
It`s possible that veggin with the cooltubes might be beneficial to make the plants bush out by end of stretch since you`ve got plenty of light in the tent to prevent elongated internode spacing , but again it`ll take doin it to find out where they`ll end up so they don`t grow into each other by end of stretch....and .....
Make sure yas clean and hack out the backs if veggin with the cooltubes , cuz they will be bushier and thicker by the time stretch is done , and the last thing yas want is a buncha flarfy ass popcorn the lights can`t get back to and promote proper swellage....
When yas chop out the backs , yas`re allowing the front limbs and nugs closest to the light source to be all they can be and swell accordingly , just like horizontal growers "lollipop" their plants underneath for the same end results come Harvey......things to ponder.....and...
As yas see it`s not simple/cut and dried on how to veg since different folks have different goals with far more plants , or far less like your situation , so get ta work and figure out which works best for your personal setup and get back to us....
Good luck....DHF....
......I don't run the high numbers you run. I run 6 plants around a room with 1600 or 2000 watts. That said freds info is better at helping you.
One thing to consider though is a way to support the limbs come end of flower so they don't snap from the weight of the buds. I find is is better to let the buds stretch toward the light more with a dual light set up than a single bulb. I have tried both and the yeild is higher when they hang out toward the bulb on a dual stack set up. This is because there is less shading with the dual bulb.
As for the spider mites I have found that no pest strips will kill mites in flower with no taste left on the buds. Just put a fan on low on the floor and set twice the recomended amount of strips on the fan for 4-5 days. This is best when you have striped all the fan leaves. The mites are on the leaves and what is left is killed with the strips.
MAKE SURE YOU DON"T GO TO ANOTHER ROOM AFTER STRIPPING THE FANS!!! If you do you will spread the mites. I run several individual flower rooms to prevent the spread of mites or mold. If I find mites in one room they all get treated except maybe the one that will be chopped in a week or two.
One thing to consider though is a way to support the limbs come end of flower so they don't snap from the weight of the buds. I find is is better to let the buds stretch toward the light more with a dual light set up than a single bulb. I have tried both and the yeild is higher when they hang out toward the bulb on a dual stack set up. This is because there is less shading with the dual bulb.
As for the spider mites I have found that no pest strips will kill mites in flower with no taste left on the buds. Just put a fan on low on the floor and set twice the recomended amount of strips on the fan for 4-5 days. This is best when you have striped all the fan leaves. The mites are on the leaves and what is left is killed with the strips.
MAKE SURE YOU DON"T GO TO ANOTHER ROOM AFTER STRIPPING THE FANS!!! If you do you will spread the mites. I run several individual flower rooms to prevent the spread of mites or mold. If I find mites in one room they all get treated except maybe the one that will be chopped in a week or two.
@ dhf last round I ran 31 plants and the corners suffered. So I cut the corners out. I'm still trying to figure out how to keep the plants from growing into the lights lastime I used bamboo with twine ran in front of the plants it worked ok. I am wary of screens makes it hard to inspect for bugs and spray.alittle more info the wife has delegated my garden to my garage so without ac temps run up to 110 degrees. I plan on building a couple well insulated rooms soon so that will help. I'm 10 days in to veg and they. Seem to be bushing nicely. Should I run a longer veg with vert, I think yes 6 to 7 weeks was my plan. I'm still new to this so I thank you and Mr. Crane for your input
I use screens to keep my plants in some kind of order. I can walk into my room and look around and tell if something is wrong in seconds. With a plant that is left to grow how it wants this is harder to do because parts of the plant is shaded and can not be seen fully. I place my screens behind my plants. I also use tomatoe clips to hold them back. Marlo uses twist ties as well for his.
I have used bamboo to tie too but it always seemed like I had to add more to control the plant because it was never in the right spot. I also have used twine to hold them back as well. I just did not feel like it worked well for me.
I believe that after 6-7 weeks you may out grow your room especially with a plant that stretches a lot.
I have used bamboo to tie too but it always seemed like I had to add more to control the plant because it was never in the right spot. I also have used twine to hold them back as well. I just did not feel like it worked well for me.
I believe that after 6-7 weeks you may out grow your room especially with a plant that stretches a lot.
Ichibad I used Dr. Dooms and Azatrol alternating. I also bombed my garage 3 times to kill anything that's left after the last crop. I'll pick up some no pest strips just in case. Last round the Azatrol took care of them for 3 weeks or so and they came back I wound up vacuuming the little bastards for the last week or so. I'm pretty sure spraying 5 weeks in to flower cost me some yeild the pistls started to turn red after spraying Azatrol.
Try Abamectin for your veg and when you first put the into flower. 1ml per gallon with a couple drops of spreader. This will kill the eggs and adults if they touch it. It is a one time use for me. Never had mites after that unless some brings them back in. Use the no pest strips in flower so you are not poisoning your smoke or changing the taste.
The Abamectin is about $100 a quart but it will be there forever. I Brake it down to smaller bottles and give it to other growers I know. This way I don't get their mites back again.
The Abamectin is about $100 a quart but it will be there forever. I Brake it down to smaller bottles and give it to other growers I know. This way I don't get their mites back again.
Ichibad i'm thinking of doing a chicken wire screen around the lights once I get my rooms built and can get out of the tents. I like the screens on the wall it may work better for the tent i'll still have to bamboo the plants on the floor and where the door of the tent is.Right now work has me gone 15 to 16 hours a day, so it's going to be a while till I have the time to build em. I was thinking of doing a veg room with 2 600s and a flower room with 2 1ks.right now I am using 4 CO2 bags since my tent is essentially a sealed room. I hate paying for ac that gets sucked out the exhaust. Especially since we have ridiculous electric rates here in California
If you tie them back to the walls you should not need a screen around the bulbs. Like DHF says don't block the light in front of the buds.
You can run screens for the bottom as well as the top. Just use a long pipe cleaner to hold the back. Marlo does this in his WOW thread. pipe cleaners are cheap. Like $2 at Walmart for 100 one footers. If I use them I get the white ones they are the easiest to see when the plant grows and hides them in it's foilage.
You can run screens for the bottom as well as the top. Just use a long pipe cleaner to hold the back. Marlo does this in his WOW thread. pipe cleaners are cheap. Like $2 at Walmart for 100 one footers. If I use them I get the white ones they are the easiest to see when the plant grows and hides them in it's foilage.
That gives me a lot of good idea's for me to ponder. I didn't like the bamboo and twine. Thanks for the insights. Other growers think i'm crazy , but I know vert is the future, with guys like ichiban and the rest of the vert guy's here.
D
DHF
I devoted my indoor growing efforts to bare bulbs from the get many yrs ago , and it takes some time to dial shit for consistent returns run in and run out , and........
Vertical setups take dedication and runs under yer belt to dial in what`s essentially 4 times the available plant canopy on each wall compared to a 1 dimensional flat/horizontal setup on the floor.....but......
Once yas get it , it`s on....now.....howta dial said setup.....If yas intend on a scrog type setup , then as Icky advised put the screens "behind" the plants to utilize all available lumens.... nothin in between the plants and bulbs....
Light diffusion/dispersion/lumen penetration/plant absorption suffers with cages around the bulbs , just like runnin cooltubes diminishes bulb performance as well.....
I see folks use em to keep from getting burnt by bare bulbs , but trust me......plants will not do as well as if the screens were behind like Marlo`s WOW thread....also.....
Cover EVERYTHING that ain`t green in reflectix/orca/prodex that`s in your budget so all the light that gets PAST the plants , gets bounced right back at em FTW.....anyways....
Not tryin ta tell yas what ta do.......Just tryin ta help....
Good luck....DHF..........
Vertical setups take dedication and runs under yer belt to dial in what`s essentially 4 times the available plant canopy on each wall compared to a 1 dimensional flat/horizontal setup on the floor.....but......
Once yas get it , it`s on....now.....howta dial said setup.....If yas intend on a scrog type setup , then as Icky advised put the screens "behind" the plants to utilize all available lumens.... nothin in between the plants and bulbs....
Light diffusion/dispersion/lumen penetration/plant absorption suffers with cages around the bulbs , just like runnin cooltubes diminishes bulb performance as well.....
I see folks use em to keep from getting burnt by bare bulbs , but trust me......plants will not do as well as if the screens were behind like Marlo`s WOW thread....also.....
Cover EVERYTHING that ain`t green in reflectix/orca/prodex that`s in your budget so all the light that gets PAST the plants , gets bounced right back at em FTW.....anyways....
Not tryin ta tell yas what ta do.......Just tryin ta help....
Good luck....DHF.....
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