Sub Panel help/setup (pic included)

[noobwithskillz]

Hello all, if a mod is reading this please delete my other thread.

So i know something of how subpanels work but lets get the obvious out of the way. As seen in the picture below we can see the "box" is almost full. And at capacity.




I need to Stress the following This main box is only for the 1st floor. Currently the 1st floors power service is off because the apartment is not close to being finished and will not for a few months.

SO i was told i have 100amps free in this box as nothing is drawing power from the box.
I understand this is not the best setup but i cannot disconnect those breakers from the box and must work around it.

I am thinking of locking those breakers to the off position so no mistakes can be done while this is going on.

Now if the above rings true I have 100 amps free and i NEED 50 amps to power my 2 rooms

Single or Double pole breaker @ 60 amps connected to the main panel with #6 or #4 wire.

Sub panel in room1.

Main feed into sub panel @60 amps.

From here this will split into 6 outlets, 3 in each room
Room1 outlets
1. 15 amp breaker connected to outlet1; 7 amps used --intake/ fans
2. 20 amp breaker- 9-10 amps used -florescent/MH
3. 15 amp breaker - 6 amps used --misc stuff (more of an over estimation to be safe)

Room2

1. 15 amp breaker - 7 amps used exhaust/fans
2. 20 amp breaker - 9 amps used HPS
3. 20 amp breaker - 9 amps used HPS

Total 46-47 amps


Note- I will be using #10 wire for the 20 amp breakers will this be ok?
Also please tell me your honest opinion

 

[Marquis de Sod]

sounds like you got a plan. just good luck finding an old ass 50A Federal breaker!

 

[LEDfoot]

FPE Stab-lok? Shit, that's what I'm working with. Not a good reputation but I've got my fingers crossed. Two-pole 50A breakers are available new at Platt or used on ebay.

You only need 12 gauge wire on a 20A circuit breaker but 10ga is fine.

 

[LEDfoot]

My local hardware store carries China-made substitute breakers.

 

[LEDfoot]

McLendons if you're around Seattle.

 

[LEDfoot]

I don't know if they carry the 50A units.

(I can't edit yet.)

 

[rives]

If the pricing on Federal-Pacific breakers has held steady over the years, you could probably swap that panel out and stuff the new one full of breakers (that actually work!) for about the same cost. FPE gear is notorious for both breaker cost and creating problems.

As LEDFoot mentioned, #12 wire is fine for 20 amp circuits - you are probably going to have problems getting #10 to fit into the receptacles.

You are coming awfully close to the 80% rule before you've even set the new panel. You are only allowed 80% of the breaker rating (the 60 in this case) for continuous loads, which are defined as any load with over 3 hours duration. This would include your lighting, fans, etc. The shorter duration loads are allowed to bump up to the full capacity of the breaker, but with FPE you might be playing with fire.

Before you start buying things, you should pop that cover off and make sure that those two empty spaces will actually accept a breaker. I've seen panels that won't take a breaker across from the main, and don't recall how FPE is set up in that respect.

 

[noobwithskillz]

If the pricing on Federal-Pacific breakers has held steady over the years, you could probably swap that panel out and stuff the new one full of breakers (that actually work!) for about the same cost. FPE gear is notorious for both breaker cost and creating problems.

As LEDFoot mentioned, #12 wire is fine for 20 amp circuits - you are probably going to have problems getting #10 to fit into the receptacles.

You are coming awfully close to the 80% rule before you've even set the new panel. You are only allowed 80% of the breaker rating (the 60 in this case) for continuous loads, which are defined as any load with over 3 hours duration. This would include your lighting, fans, etc. The shorter duration loads are allowed to bump up to the full capacity of the breaker, but with FPE you might be playing with fire.

Before you start buying things, you should pop that cover off and make sure that those two empty spaces will actually accept a breaker. I've seen panels that won't take a breaker across from the main, and don't recall how FPE is set up in that respect.

Thank youfor both of your inputs upon further investigation I have decided to replace this pos.
So I have a question now, would it be cheaper to get a 16 or 20 breaker panel and set it up that way or replace the the box and add a sub panel to the room.

 

[EclipseFour20]

Swap out the panel with a new one with "modern/affordable/easy to get" circuit breakers would be my choice. Besides, in time I bet you will be adding more breakers (240 and/or 120 volt) and with that old box your "future growth" will be limited. Talk to an electrician too...safety first and all!

Cheers!

 

[rives]

Thank youfor both of your inputs upon further investigation I have decided to replace this pos.
So I have a question now, would it be cheaper to get a 16 or 20 breaker panel and set it up that way or replace the the box and add a sub panel to the room.

I'm not sure what you are asking here. The big box stores have damn good pricing on 200 amp, 42 space panels, which would work great for the main. If you check pricing, I think that you will find that these big panels are probably cheaper than the small ones because of the volume of them that are used. You could run your room straight off of the main panel, but my preference would be for a sub-panel in the room to make future modifications easier. Get panels made by the same manufacturer so that you can have one type of breaker.

 

[noobwithskillz]

This is a temporary setup in this location a year or less. I think I will get one panel and run off the main