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Help me expand!

soursmoker

East Coast, All Day!
Veteran
Lol didn't actually mean look but like the brand and everything... is it a good deal or should I get a different brand? judging by your attitude, they are all the same though and it really doesn't matter...

Should I still go with the Can33 for this fan or should I upgrade my scrubber while I am at it?
 

Resistance

New member
That fan will do just fine. I've a 6" Typhoon, a 6" Vortex, a 4" Typhoon, and a 4" generic. I see no difference between noise/efficiency whatsoever

I'd have went all generic but it was a clearence sale at the hydro shop.

I made my scrubbers from Pontiac's DIY thread. They work great so I'll never buy one, so I can't comment on that. :biggrin:
 

soursmoker

East Coast, All Day!
Veteran
Can you link me to the scubber you are talking about? I believe there are a few different designs in the DIY thread. I considered making my own, but was told not to trust a DIY and spend the money on a well made one.
 

soursmoker

East Coast, All Day!
Veteran
The cheaper fans leak more around the electrical box, rivets, and were the 2 housings come together. check out this fan for best price vs performance

http://www.amazon.com/Inch-ValuLine...d=1367464326&sr=1-1&keywords=valueline+6+inch

Ive made DIY scrubber years ago and worked great, i guess buying one is just more convenient.

thanks man, that ones only a few bucks more than the other 6" I was looking at and claims to have an extra 35 CFM. Also looking back, thanks for convincing me to go bigger... Now I understand why you really thought I should upgrade...

A $92, 4" 135 CFM (supposedly quiet)
A $85, 6" 435 CFM (unknown noise level)

Thanks alot, 6" was deff the better choice!

If I was going to buy a scrubber to match that fan, would you reccomend I still go with the Can33 or something else?

What speed controller should I get, I have seen a few different ones on amazon, and it the reviews/comments there is always someone claiming the speed controller doesn't work...
 
T

trichster

I think/know a Can33 will do great with 6'' fan, another good option is phresh 6x24. I bought my speed controllers at my local Harbor Freight many years ago and have never had any issues with them. Im sure if you turn down 6'' fan will be quieter and have more pressure once all hooked up and speeded down then running a 4'' at full power. I have a 4'' and its noticeable louder then my 6'' Vortex when i turn it down to equal power of the 4''. You wont regret getting 6''!

here is link to speed controllers i have, i see people having issues with them on amazon but i never have and lots of people i know have them to with no issues.
http://www.amazon.com/dp/B000HQAVNI/ref=dra_a_cs_mr_hn_it_P1300_1000?tag=dradis-20
 

soursmoker

East Coast, All Day!
Veteran
thanks man, I think I have just about everything covered so far... now I just need to start building and buying!
 

soursmoker

East Coast, All Day!
Veteran
Okay since I am still waiting for my safe addy to be ready, to order everything for the big cab... I figure I might as well build a replacement for my current cab since I can source all materials to build the cab from homedepot. and test out how well the design works, since I will be basing my next cab off of this one...

Ok so here is the list of materials I will need from homedepot...
Anything I should add or get rid of, feel free to tell me...

3-5 Pieces of 4x8 Insulation board ($12.76 each)
About 6 or 7 2x3x8's ( I was thinking about the 2x3x10's but idk how hard it would be to transport those...
Some foil duct tape
And some pond liner to cover up light leaks...

Plan is something like this...

Frame it out with 2x3's
Use insulation board as walls...
Put a piece of Plywood on the top (the "roof")... mount my current bathroom fan on there and exhaust out the top...

Pretty much like what Tick did here...

10152BoxBuild30.jpg


then on the inside, screw some anchors into the plywood and hang my light from it as well...

Originally I was just going to run a 2x3 across the middle up top but castout reccomended putting a sheet of plywood on top and I think it is a much better idea...

I still need to figure out a light proof intake...
And how I am gonna open it up...
Doors and intake are always the biggest problems for me... the main causes of light leaks...

Here is a rough sketch of my design... it is not perfectly to scale or anything... I am really bad with sketchup.. but you get the idea...


[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]
picture.php
[/FONT]

You can see the sheet of plywood on top with the fan mounted on it...

The walls aren't on it there obviously...that is just the frame..

That should be strong enough for a 2x2x4 right?


Any suggestions, criticism, comments, is all welcome!

I want to get this done ASAP!
But don't want to buy the materials until I have a solid list of what I need...
I hate going back to the store fifty times...
 
Hey man,

What I did was take some 3mil plastic and cover the entire structure with this,using staples.

Also,on your intake,use some ducting and put it in a circle like configuration on the outside of the cab.This will stop the light leaks.

The thing with my room is,it is a permanent structure.So it's kinda big.11'x3.5' .So I can sleep in their if I wont to.Plus I can and have gone in to it with lights out to check for light leaks,sound etc.

I only grow from Oct-April.

On the door thing,what I did was make my door,then make another door slightly bigger,about an inch ,or two larger then the door itself.Screw it to the door and you have it
overlapping the seam.On the hinge side I just use duct tape,or you could use some left over plastic on the hinge side.I don't have any light leaks!

I used 2x3's on everything.I don't like 2x2's,they tend to sag.
 

soursmoker

East Coast, All Day!
Veteran
Hey man i will be doing pretty much the same thing but with an interior wall (insulation board).

I want to use this because it is reflective on one side and it's insulation properties should help as well...

On the exterior of the insulation board I was thinking of wrapping pond liner around to cover any possible light leaks...

I found this site... seems they have nice prices on poly sheets...

http://www.plasticsheetingsupply.co...plastic-sheeting-mil-c-24312_24306_24308.html

Thinking about going with that instead of pond liner, as pond liner is a rip off!!

As far as intake, yeah that is the best Idea I can come up with so far...

Yeah mine will not be permanent...

You got any pics or anything to help me picture the door thing? I think I get it, just want to make sure...
 
I might have to take some pics of my room later.

My whole room is 1" reflective insulation,ceiling and walls.I used 3/8" plywood,then the plastic,then the insulation and used foil tape on all seams.
 

soursmoker

East Coast, All Day!
Veteran
I plan on skipping the plywood, and reversing the order of plastic and insulation...

I understand why you did it that way because it is permanent, but for me I want this to be lightweight and easily taken down...
 

wildgrow

, The Ghost of
Veteran
You might need to put cleats in the corners to brace it. Not interested in just wrapping the whole thing in plywood? 1 sheet will do it.

Black caulk to fill the gaps you might have. Or roofing rubber as a flange. Cut the whole slightly smaller than what it has to go over so it squeezes it.

Maybe try fridge mag strips to secure a completely removable door. You can always use closed cell foam for windows/ac for the door. Id just make sure the door is up and compressing it before drilling any pilot holes for hinges/latches - should ensure a snug fit.

Could the fan be wired to a basic dimmer switch? $12-20 at the HDepot.
 

rives

Inveterate Tinkerer
Mentor
ICMag Donor
Veteran
Take a look at the Fantech EC series fans. While they are fairly expensive, they handle reasonably high static pressures well and have an integral speed control which works over a much broader range than the other types of controllers. There are frequent compatibility problems between fans and speed controllers, and some of the controllers will cause the fans to make a noise that many people don't like. S&P fans are mixed vent fans, and tend to be fairly quiet from what I've read, but they don't deal well with static pressure. I use a Panasonic Whisperline on one application, and it is very quiet but doesn't deal with static pressure well at all.

I'm not sure what you are trying to achieve with insulation on the cab, but if it is for temperature control the high rate of air exchange is going to work against you if you are pulling air from the same room that the cab is sitting in.

I use a GrowLab GL80 that is roughly 32" x 32" x 71", and it has worked very well for several years. Mountain Air filters have worked the best for me, and the best pricing that I've seen is from eHydroponics.com.
 

soursmoker

East Coast, All Day!
Veteran
You might need to put cleats in the corners to brace it. Not interested in just wrapping the whole thing in plywood? 1 sheet will do it.

Black caulk to fill the gaps you might have. Or roofing rubber as a flange. Cut the whole slightly smaller than what it has to go over so it squeezes it.

Maybe try fridge mag strips to secure a completely removable door. You can always use closed cell foam for windows/ac for the door. Id just make sure the door is up and compressing it before drilling any pilot holes for hinges/latches - should ensure a snug fit.

Could the fan be wired to a basic dimmer switch? $12-20 at the HDepot.

Nah I like the idea of the insulation board for walls over plywood becuase it will keep it lighter... and easier to move around...

I was planning on the foil tape and black poly to do the trick to cover any gaps I had...

the fridge mag strips is a good idea for the door...

what is closed cell foam? I will have to look into it...

For the first cab I am building, I'll be using a 50 cfm bathroom fan, I don't think I need a dimmer switch... I'd rather run it wide open...

Take a look at the Fantech EC series fans. While they are fairly expensive, they handle reasonably high static pressures well and have an integral speed control which works over a much broader range than the other types of controllers. There are frequent compatibility problems between fans and speed controllers, and some of the controllers will cause the fans to make a noise that many people don't like. S&P fans are mixed vent fans, and tend to be fairly quiet from what I've read, but they don't deal well with static pressure. I use a Panasonic Whisperline on one application, and it is very quiet but doesn't deal with static pressure well at all.

I'm not sure what you are trying to achieve with insulation on the cab, but if it is for temperature control the high rate of air exchange is going to work against you if you are pulling air from the same room that the cab is sitting in.

I use a GrowLab GL80 that is roughly 32" x 32" x 71", and it has worked very well for several years. Mountain Air filters have worked the best for me, and the best pricing that I've seen is from eHydroponics.com.


thanks for the suggestions man. fan thing is settled already. I am going with this fan. the same company sells a speed controller so I don't think I will have any compatibility issues... I think the fan will do fine with the scrubber...

the insulation is just a lighter material than plywood and it is reflective on one side already! seems perfect to me...

I am still pondering the idea of buying a tent...

But this first cab is getting constructed solely from materials from homedepot... then we are deciding if we are building or buying the second one

EDIT: this is getting confusing...

I am designing 2 different cabs!

Any equipment being talked about is going in the 2nd cab, the bigger one, that has no definites yet...

The first cab is going to be 2x2x4, made solely from materials purchasable at homedepot, lowes, etc...

Equipment for first cab is as follows...
150w HPS
50 cfm bathroom fan
 

NKOTS

follow the pink rabbit!
Veteran
hi there, sour

wow, a lot is going on in this thread. you seem to change your mind 2 times on every page ;)
tent -> cab -> tent -> cab -> tent -> cab

don't get me wrong, i hear where you're coming from and i fully understand your dillemas / concerns.

not sure if i can be of great help but i will try.

i think that you need to sit down with a pen and list all your key requirements and must-haves. by prioritizing items from your list you will narrow down your choices to what will meet all/most requirements. the final solution may not be perfect in regard to lighting /or grow area but it will allow for a safe - and still happy - growing.

the idea of growing in the attics always gave me thrills as i know this calls for super efficient venting due to heat issue in summer.

ok, a couple thoughts from me:

1. cab or tent?
if i got it right, you're on a budget and this may be a temporary build? plus you're reluctant to buying over the internet.

in such case (and if DYI is an option for you - but i think it is) i would not spend hundreds of $$$ for all this equipment you mentioned before (well, some of it). i would look around and search a decent cab that looks like every other regular cab (= is stealthy) and i would adapt it to my needs.

why not browse garage sales if you have those in your location? people get rid of good stuff for peanuts, especially now when spring calls for 'house clearance'.

maybe a friend of yours wants to get rid of one? maybe your HomeDepot or other local supplier have some cabs that they used as temporary display? or maybe your perfect cab is sitting in the room next to yours but you never looked at it this way? :)

i personally wouldn't buy a tent since they look totally not-stealthy to me (all can notice it is not a normal piece of furniture). besides i am a DYI rabbit and enjoy to build my own contraptions.
plus a tent would increase your spend considerably!

2. lighting
i can't help you much here as i don't know enough about HID lighting just yet.
i am quite experienced with CFLs but HIDs are a new story to me too.

however i do think that a 400-watter must be a bitch when it comes to cooling it down...

3. ventilation

i have only grown under CFLs so far and these bulbs can heat up the grow area like hell too. cannot imagine 400W HID in a small area and a poor fan on top of it.
so make sure this is done right. i think it is your most sensitive issue.

so what i recommend:

a) get as much gearas possible OUT of the cab. this will allow more grow space and will reduce number of factors that could cause overheating.
b) make sure your inlets are way bigger than the outlet - but you know that already, don't you?
c) get a decent fan

when it comes to fans, i think Bulénath summed it up as good as it gets in his thread, read carefully his first post here.

i am totally fascinated with his venting system in that thread.
if i was in your situation, this would be the only gear that i would not hesitate to invest my $$$ in. after all, it is only 100 bucks, comparable to many inline fans, eh?

why not copy his 'silent fan' project? this would give you both: ventilation & scrubber
personally i would choose a more powerful unit for this 400watter you're planning to install, i would probably look at 200-300 CFM.



hope this all helps. should anything else come to my mind, i will post again.

stay cool and first plan it well, buddy :smoke:
 
T

trichster

For light proof intake you could double up one wall with insulation board and put vents 1 at top or bottom and opposite with other one.Make sure you point vent covers the right way. So basicly that wall will act as a big vent and light wont be able to make it in/out. For door try velcro and go over size with door compared to hole . Not sure if you will need pond liner or anything like that if you make your seams good and use foil tape, no light makes it through foil tape.
 

soursmoker

East Coast, All Day!
Veteran
hi there, sour

wow, a lot is going on in this thread. you seem to change your mind 2 times on every page ;)
tent -> cab -> tent -> cab -> tent -> cab

don't get me wrong, i hear where you're coming from and i fully understand your dillemas / concerns.

not sure if i can be of great help but i will try.

i think that you need to sit down with a pen and list all your key requirements and must-haves. by prioritizing items from your list you will narrow down your choices to what will meet all/most requirements. the final solution may not be perfect in regard to lighting /or grow area but it will allow for a safe - and still happy - growing.

the idea of growing in the attics always gave me thrills as i know this calls for super efficient venting due to heat issue in summer.

ok, a couple thoughts from me:

1. cab or tent?
if i got it right, you're on a budget and this may be a temporary build? plus you're reluctant to buying over the internet.

in such case (and if DYI is an option for you - but i think it is) i would not spend hundreds of $$$ for all this equipment you mentioned before (well, some of it). i would look around and search a decent cab that looks like every other regular cab (= is stealthy) and i would adapt it to my needs.

why not browse garage sales if you have those in your location? people get rid of good stuff for peanuts, especially now when spring calls for 'house clearance'.

maybe a friend of yours wants to get rid of one? maybe your HomeDepot or other local supplier have some cabs that they used as temporary display? or maybe your perfect cab is sitting in the room next to yours but you never looked at it this way? :)

i personally wouldn't buy a tent since they look totally not-stealthy to me (all can notice it is not a normal piece of furniture). besides i am a DYI rabbit and enjoy to build my own contraptions.
plus a tent would increase your spend considerably!

2. lighting
i can't help you much here as i don't know enough about HID lighting just yet.
i am quite experienced with CFLs but HIDs are a new story to me too.

however i do think that a 400-watter must be a bitch when it comes to cooling it down...

3. ventilation

i have only grown under CFLs so far and these bulbs can heat up the grow area like hell too. cannot imagine 400W HID in a small area and a poor fan on top of it.
so make sure this is done right. i think it is your most sensitive issue.

so what i recommend:

a) get as much gearas possible OUT of the cab. this will allow more grow space and will reduce number of factors that could cause overheating.
b) make sure your inlets are way bigger than the outlet - but you know that already, don't you?
c) get a decent fan

when it comes to fans, i think Bulénath summed it up as good as it gets in his thread, read carefully his first post here.

i am totally fascinated with his venting system in that thread.
if i was in your situation, this would be the only gear that i would not hesitate to invest my $$$ in. after all, it is only 100 bucks, comparable to many inline fans, eh?

why not copy his 'silent fan' project? this would give you both: ventilation & scrubber
personally i would choose a more powerful unit for this 400watter you're planning to install, i would probably look at 200-300 CFM.



hope this all helps. should anything else come to my mind, i will post again.

stay cool and first plan it well, buddy :smoke:

yeah I have a real hard time deciding between cabs and tents. tents are so conveinent, just setup, intake and exhaust holes are all ready...

anyway I am going with a cab, and as much as I would like to get one for nice and cheap and modify it... I don't think I could find something the height I am looking for, so I am going to custom build... It won't cost that much, and I'm willing to spend the money for a worth investment..

I plan on keeping as much gear as possible out side the grow area...

The 400 will be hot, but atleast a few degrees cooler than it's HPS counterpart... and if I wait to long I might end up having to go with a different type of CMH, which would require a MH ballast and use a 330w bulb, so I imagine that would be slightly cooler...

It's been decided against any bathroom style fans for the size I am going for... and I agree... and i no doubt would of needed a 6" fan evetually even if i didn't buy it for this grow, so once again it's a good investment...

For light proof intake you could double up one wall with insulation board and put vents 1 at top or bottom and opposite with other one.Make sure you point vent covers the right way. So basicly that wall will act as a big vent and light wont be able to make it in/out. For door try velcro and go over size with door compared to hole . Not sure if you will need pond liner or anything like that if you make your seams good and use foil tape, no light makes it through foil tape.


good idea on the intake I like the sound of that...

the correct way would be to place to vent covers facing opposite directions right? lol

any better explanation with the velcro and the door? sorry im stoned...
 
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