Application rates of soil inputs/ammendments

[unklemike]

Hello

This is my first attempt at organic in soil in pots. Ive noticed a few soil recipes around the forum and web. My question is how does everyone figure out application rates in pots for things like kelp meal, alfalfa meal,bone meal etc? I know that most have obviously came up with preferred recipes through trial and error and following other recipes or have a scholarly knowledge of such things. I also was wondering for inputs that have a specific purpose for example bone meal, rock phosphate and high p bat guano all are sources of phosphorus and may release into the soil at different rates, but are they able to be part of the same mix? Are there things that should not be mixed in the same mix? I will follow another recipe for know but would like to have the ability to reformulate a recipe or tinker one if need be.
Thank you

 

[vonforne]

I usually go with the rate of 2 TBS maximum of anything per gallon. Example, I will take the total amount of soil to be added to and divide up what I want to use in TBS per gallon. For N say you have Neem, N guano and Fish Meal and have 10 gallons of soil. That would be 20 TBS total. Now divide up the 3 in equal amounts not exceeding 20 TBS.

With minerals I use 10 TBS of each.......Azomite 10, GRD 10 etc.

V

 

[Hydro-Soil]

Read all the soil growers threads.

Look for folks that have a room, light, strains like you have. Mix your soil according to their method.

The strength of lighting has a lot to do with how much 'amending' you do to the soil. Starting with a mix that's 'close' will help you out a lot.

From there it's trial and error.

You want your amendments to 'run out' about 2-3 weeks before harvest. We're talking all or almost all the fan leaves dead and fallen off, tips of the sugar leaves brown/tan/gold and dry... with just the part inside the bud still alive.

That's perfect.

Stay Safe!

 

[vonforne]

Read all the soil growers threads.

Look for folks that have a room, light, strains like you have. Mix your soil according to their method.

The strength of lighting has a lot to do with how much 'amending' you do to the soil. Starting with a mix that's 'close' will help you out a lot.

From there it's trial and error.

You want your amendments to 'run out' about 2-3 weeks before harvest. We're talking all or almost all the fan leaves dead and fallen off, tips of the sugar leaves brown/tan/gold and dry... with just the part inside the bud still alive.

That's perfect.

Stay Safe!

In a Living soil amendments never ´run out´ as the bacteria and fungi continue to digest the organic matter in the soil and make it available. As long as you maintain an even moisture level and add ACT to raise the bio mass the soil will remain viable for the plants.

 

[W89]

Von dont you "flush" your plants?

 

[unklemike]

Von

Some folks have over 10 inputs per mix you think it would be safe to have up to 2tbs of each per gallon Max including liming agents in a peat based mix?

 

[Greenheart]

Helpful Conversion Rates

16tablespoons=1cup
3teaspoons=1tablespoon
4 tablespoons= 1/4 cup
1 cubic foot = approximate 7.48 (us) gallons

Below is courtesy of ClackamasCootz in the ROLS thread. "To each 1 c.f. of this mix I add the following:

1/2 cup organic Neem meal
1/2 cup organic Kelp meal
1/2 cup Crab meal (or Crustacean meal when available - it has Shrimp meal with the Crab meal. It's a local product from the fisheries on the Oregon & Washington Coasts)
4 cups of some minerals - rock dust" https://www.icmag.com/ic/showpost.php?p=5215162&postcount=4

"The 'rock dust' term I used should have included an explanation, i.e. it's a mix I had made and bagged:
4x - Glacial Rock Dust - Canadian Glacial (Gaia Green label)
1x - Bentonite - from the pottery supply store in PDX
1x - Oyster Shell Powder - the standard product from San Francisco Bay
1x - Basalt - from Redmond, Oregon (new product at Concentrates - about $18.00)
No Dolomite Lime, Greensand or SRP was used. Or Azomite." https://www.icmag.com/ic/showpost.php?p=5216612&postcount=42

 

[vonforne]

Von dont you "flush" your plants?

the only thing I flush is the toilet! Sometimes twice. lol

 

[vonforne]

Von

Some folks have over 10 inputs per mix you think it would be safe to have up to 2tbs of each per gallon Max including liming agents in a peat based mix?

no 2 TBS per gallon max. Take 20 divide by 3 = 6.3 take 6.3 of N guano, 6.3 of Fish meal and 6.3 of Neem meal. Mix into the soil.

Do the same for all of the inputs. 6.3 x 3 for your mineral mix etc. or what ever your numbers come up to be depending on what volume of soil you mix.

Post up what you have altogether....peat, compost, amendments, minerals and liming material and we will help you set it up.

 

[unklemike]

I have blood meal, bone meal ( espoma brand that is not steamed so doesn't release as fast) alfalfa meal, azomite ,excellerite, powdered rock phosphate, powdered dolomite, prilled gypsom, agricultural lime, couple bale bags of peat moss and some bagged ewc. As far as local made compost all I have access too is municipal compost made of primarily leafs. Its winter so forest duff is frozen under snow and in this old fashion town nobody has homemade ewc or compost or anything special until I do my own hot compost pile in summer.

 

[unklemike]

Also forgot to mention I can order most dry inputs or a game changing must haves from my local hydro store guy who is non bios and is totally willing to help

Sent from my PantechP9070 using Tapatalk 2

 

[vonforne]

I have blood meal, bone meal ( espoma brand that is not steamed so doesn't release as fast) alfalfa meal, azomite ,excellerite, powdered rock phosphate, powdered dolomite, prilled gypsom, agricultural lime, couple bale bags of peat moss and some bagged ewc. As far as local made compost all I have access too is municipal compost made of primarily leafs. Its winter so forest duff is frozen under snow and in this old fashion town nobody has homemade ewc or compost or anything special until I do my own hot compost pile in summer.

Now tell me how big are your containers for flowering. Or what is the final size of container you will transplant into.

 

[unklemike]

I usually flower in 3 gallon plastic pots sog style but that was when I was using chems and pro mix . I could do whatever you recommend for 1000k trying to get 50 - 60 watts per square foot in a grow tent.

 

[ziggestardust]

Helpful Conversion Rates

16tablespoons=1cup
3teaspoons=1tablespoon
4 tablespoons= 1/4 cup
1 cubic foot = approximate 7.48 (us) gallons

Below is courtesy of ClackamasCootz in the ROLS thread. "To each 1 c.f. of this mix I add the following:

1/2 cup organic Neem meal
1/2 cup organic Kelp meal
1/2 cup Crab meal (or Crustacean meal when available - it has Shrimp meal with the Crab meal. It's a local product from the fisheries on the Oregon & Washington Coasts)
4 cups of some minerals - rock dust" https://www.icmag.com/ic/showpost.php?p=5215162&postcount=4

"The 'rock dust' term I used should have included an explanation, i.e. it's a mix I had made and bagged:
4x - Glacial Rock Dust - Canadian Glacial (Gaia Green label)
1x - Bentonite - from the pottery supply store in PDX
1x - Oyster Shell Powder - the standard product from San Francisco Bay
1x - Basalt - from Redmond, Oregon (new product at Concentrates - about $18.00)
No Dolomite Lime, Greensand or SRP was used. Or Azomite." https://www.icmag.com/ic/showpost.php?p=5216612&postcount=42

Haha, are those the British Imperial Units in their prime? If you really have to do conversions like that in your head while baking a really large chocolate cake I would not bake very many large chocolate cakes. Ever...

Haha, I don't know if that made sense. This bubblish stuff got the best of my sanity, haha

Out

 

[RanchoDeluxe]

My advice is to follow Coot's recipe as closely as you can. If you can't source one or two of the amendments, just let us know and we can figure out something that will work well for ya.

Take a look at Coot's mix and Gascanstan's mix. Coot's mix has less amendments than Stan's. So anywhere in between is good.

Coot's mix may need a tea or two or a topdress...depends on strain/size of container etc. Haven't tried Stan's mix out yet, I think he mentioned it's usually water-only.

I would go with a MINIMUM of 5gal for containers...bigger is better. If you can slap 4 - 30gal smartpots in there then do it. You're 1000w HPS can easily have a 5x5 footprint.

Good Luck
RD

 

[unklemike]

I could follow a number of recipes which is fine, and can order most amendments. My biggest problems are at this time of year in my area there is no one selling anything but bagged compost or bagged ewc ect . I have a stock pile of leaves and other components ready to assemble a hot compost pile when it warms up a bit. There is municipal compost in my area but that shit scares me for anything that is going to be consumed . What do you recommend i do in the mix as far as ewc, compost and soil conditioners? I can buy bags or ewc, compost or gh ancient forest hummus but are those all in vein?

 

[Greenheart]

Haha, are those the British Imperial Units in their prime? If you really have to do conversions like that in your head while baking a really large chocolate cake I would not bake very many large chocolate cakes. Ever...

Haha, I don't know if that made sense. This bubblish stuff got the best of my sanity, haha

Out

If you need 6.3 tablespoons it could be handy know that a tsp is your .3 or when comparing mixes when one guy is talking tbls and the other cups. I found it helpful anyhow but then again I am not a baker or candlestick maker.

 

[al-k-mist]

It is helpful to many people.
I can do all of those in my head, but you dont know how many times my ol lady has asked how many oz is half a cup? (4, just like last time!). its so imperative to know this stuff.
no matter if one follows metric, like most of the world...or the us system, whatever its called...someone else uses the other, as Greenheart says. someones formula uses the opposite(well, i read a lot of teks, formulas, and recipes when im not working).
and now i forgot what else I was going to mention...damn.

 

[vonforne]

I lived in Europe and America........use a conversion chart for your measurements. lol It is that easy. You can also use gram measurements and weigh the material to be used.

You do not have to go by anyones mix. Use the base materials and go from there. Just use you head about the materials. Use what is available locally. Look at my mix here in America and then look at my mix in the EU. Both produce great plants but were very different in their respective make up.

Find what is local. It is a part of the learning curve.

V

 

[unklemike]

Thanks

I'm thinking I'm going to go with a 20 gallon base mix of peat, bagged ewc, gh ancient forest and pertlite. As far as the amendments I was thinking of doing vons recommendations and aim for 2 tsp per gallon in total of a blend of the amendments including liming agents and minerals that I mentioned earlier in the thread. If there is anything I should do differently let me know. Thanks