First time grower, growing in coco and ready to flower

[classV]

Greetings, ICmag Coco Growers.

I am a first time grower, currently vegging a Nirvana Northern Lights Grow in Coco. I have 3 plants that are just over 6 weeks old, and a straggler who is just over 5 weeks old, all grown from seed. The plants are 13, 14, 15, and 8 inches tall respectively, growing in Canna Coco and hand water/fed with GH nutes according to their schedule with modifications in strength, and PH’d to 5.8. I water by hand. My ventilation is very good and temps are also very good. Low humidity was a chronic problem, but is getting better. All four plants are in 2 gallon smart pots where they will finish. It has been an adventure for sure, with lots of Noobe mistakes, but the plants have proven more resilient than the skills of the grower.

The grow is in a DR90, which is 3x3x6 under a 400w MH lamp, with a 400w HPS ready to go for flowering. Moving into flowering, I would sure appreciate some guidance from experienced growers. I have a couple of questions, and hope someone will take the time to answer:

1) All four plants show strong Indica characteristics. Any thoughts on the notion that Indicas double in size as opposed to Satives tripling? I have read conflicting accounts on height gain in Indicas. Keep in mind these plants have been topped once, and I do not plant to employ any further modification on them.

2) I have read that flushing, an extended dark period at the switch, and other techniques are useful for flowering. Any opinions or tips for a noobe on the matter of lighting and nute schedules for when I flip these girls to 12/12? Keep in mind I am using GH nutes and can use either a 400w MH or HSP at any time during flower. I’m currently feeding at about 1.0 EC with 2ml/gal of CalMag added in. That includes my well water that comes in at about < 0.05 EC. I am using the 3 part Flora Series nutes, and though I have read about the 6/9 method, for this first grow I thinking I should not make a major change in the schedule, but I’m open to suggestions for that and for additives during flower.

Many thanks, and I’m really glad to have found a thread for Coco that appears to be very active. Below are current pics of my garden.

 

[Morcheeba*]

ive never grown that strain but Indicas are a more compact plant where Sativas will grow taller w/more stretch and a longer flower time.

until you grow it you dont know how much stretch a given plant will have and that is why you search out the best pheno's in a pack/s of seeds.

just change them to 12/12 no dark period but i would flush them of any remaining nutes for the last 14 days of 12/12.


peace

 

[classV]

Thanks, Morcheeba. What are your thoughts on additives for flower? I see that many folks recommend Epson salts at some point down the road. What about the stuff that is supposed to enchance bud production? Is any of that stuff worth looking in too?

 

[OPT]

you wont need the Grow bottle anymore really, micro and bloom will suffice the rest of the way through.

Since you dont know how much they will stretch etc, just watch them and tie them down as needed to get an even canopy, or if others start to really outstretch the others, you can put the shorter ones on elevated stands to get them even with the rest also.

When i was running GH nutes, i used kool bloom powder towards the later half of flowering following Rezdogs recoomendations with good results.

Are flower enhancers needed? They help but are NOT REQUIRED.

Just make sure your getting clones of these before you switch, if possible, in case you find a keeper mother.

And i've never started the dark period off with additional darkness, i'd stick with 12/12 from the start.

OPT

 

[classV]

Many thanks, OPT. I don't have a place to keep a mother. I have only the one grow tent and one lamp for now. I often read where experienced growers mention taking cuttings, so I risk a stupid question: If I only have the one grow area and he one lamp... is there a trick to preserving cuttings? Revegging or something?

Also, I have read that some people use MH for the first week of flowering to reduce stretch. Any opinions on that? I have both MH and HSP bulbs and I've been vegging with the MH.

 

[classV]

I saw a message on my profile that the pics I attached were not showing in my post. I can see them in the original, but just in case I am re-posting them from my album. Let me know if they do not show up.

 

[Morcheeba*]

you should stick w/the basic nute's you have on this run...they are looking healthy.

some strains are heavy feders on Mg and epsom salt is used or if you use r/o water you may need to add Mg.

i use tap water and it has enough Mg for the strains im running so others are better at explaining how much to use.

i use GH Maxibloom @ 1 tsp / gal h2o from rooted clones thru flower. if i see a need for more N before the flip i will ad a bit of GH Maxigrow.

@ 4 days prior to a 2wk flush i add 1/2 tsp GH Koolbloom.

a few times in veg i will add Silica to help strenghten the stems and help build a better root mass but i try and keep it simple.


peace

 

[BrownThumb]

Lookin' good there ClassV. On the clone thing, it's easy. I use a 23 watt cfl or something like that hanging inside a box for my clones. I have had one in this little box for 3 months so far, but several others have come and gone or have joined the older clone I mention in the box. The older clone is actually a clone of the original monster clone. It got too big for the little box (like 11"x 10" x 6") so I clipped a limb, rooted that and then culled the original. Now I have a smaller clone in the same solo cup. They have mini solo cups that are even smaller, therefore better for guys like you and I. Clones are the way to go for a number of reasons, but production and knowing what your product will be like when finished are probably the main benefits.

I am just starting to use MaxiBloom myself and expect excellent results based on all of the positive feedback I have read. The price is right in comparison to the flora series, but Jacks Pro is supposed to kick-ass and there are others as well. If cost is the main consideration, I hear Jacks is the way.

 

[classV]

Thanks for the comments and tips guys. I really appreciate it. Before I lit the fires on this project, I did a lot of reading, and took note that the first grow is a little daunting. I have found that to be true in my case, and after a rocky start, ( and one major blunder) I'm nervous moving into flower. I'd like to veg a bit longer and dial in a little more, but verticle space in my grow tent is limited to 6 feet. I do have five more seeds to play with, and I think I'll follow up on your tip, BrownThumb, for keeping and handling clones on the next grow. I never thought of keep a clone under a CFL. That's pretty trick.

On the nutes... thanks for the imput Morcheeba. I do not use RO, but my well water is very soft, ( > .05 EC ) and I found I needed to supplement with calmag. I also underfed a bit, erring on the side of caution, and just now got them back up to speed. Not real confident in my grasp of how my plants are responding to nutes, and I'm only now beginning to grasp the concept of ratios. As you pointed out, I think sticking with the GH for the duration makes the most sense. I'd prefer to veg a bit longer and gain some more confidence with the feeding, but as I said above to BrownThumb... I am concerned about my vertical space, so I need to drive on to flower and let the chips fall. If I can, I'd like to avoid tying them down, etc... I kind of have my hands full as it is with this learning curve, but hey... I'll do what I have to do to bring this thing home.

Do you guys have any thoughts on continuing with the MH lamp for the first week or two of flower to limit the stretch? I have seen this suggested in reading through the forums. I have an HPS ready to go, so I have the option.

Thanks again for taking the time to comment.

 

[HighBurn8]

Hey class V, plants look good. I just got done with a run using GH micro & bloom in secret jardin tents...
I included my feeding regimen in there as well.

here's the link...https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=248920

 

[classV]

Wow! Nice job, HighBurn. I'm impressed!

I'm using the Flora Series, on their three part schedule. Experienced growers have made it so clear in their posts that less is more, that I am currently feeding at 1.0 EC and running off anywhere from .89 to .95. That's including 2 ml/gal of calmag. Maybe a little low? I feed every watering with 20-25% runoff, and they seem to be doing okay. I know it's all strain dependent, and environment plays a role. Having never even grown a tomato before, let alone MJ, I have no reference point for what they should look like when they are healthy. Pics of successful grows help. but you know how it is... no substitute for seeing, touching, and smelling the real article.

Right now I'm considering whether to start the Flower Cycle with MH. Been reading that it might help keep the stretch in check. The strain is Nirvana NL, but since I have I no first hand knowledge of the strain, I want to make sure I don't out grow the tent!

Thanks for commenting man, and sharing the link to your grow. That's inspiring!

 

[OPT]

You could use a MH during first 2 weeks....i agree it helps with stretch if your tight on head room.

Cuttings only need the smallest amount of light, if you can find a way that'd be great, because otherwise you might find a super keeper then have to cross your fingers on trying to Reveg it successfully.

And! make sure you have no light leaks during flowering! Would suck if those turned hermy on you, but it can happen!

OPT

 

[classV]

Thanks for your thoughts OPT. I think I will do the MH for the 2 week stretch. I was leaning heavily that way, but it sure helps to have somebody who has "been-there-done-that" weigh in with an opinion.

Understood on the light leaks. The Jardin I have is eaten up with pin hole light leaks along some of the seams, but my ace in the hole is a dark area of my basement and absolute control of access. I plan to double down by having my "Day cycle run between 6am and 6pm. At this point I intend to give myself every advantage I can.

Thanks for the advice and concern about the cuttings. I know you are right, but to be honest, I'm still one step behind this thing getting the nutrients dialed in and keeping the four plants I have on my hands moving forward. You guys have made an impression on me about the cuttings though. Before you guys weighed in, I had simply assumed I'd need another tent and HID to properly make that happen. It never entered my empty head that a decent box and a CFL would do the trick. I'll be ready for that on my next run.

 

[BrownThumb]

Cuttings only need the smallest amount of light, if you can find a way that'd be great, because otherwise you might find a super keeper then have to cross your fingers on trying to Reveg it successfully.

OPT

That is about the only way I take clones (during flower, usually late in flower...). You end up w/ Monster clones after a month to a month and half, depending on your cloning skills and environment. It takes that long to root them and revert to veg, but once they do...look out! You are worrying about stretch...I have plants in mid bloom right now (Afghan) that are monster clones that have more than doubled in size and are still stretching just a little. So the biggest of these is now over 4' and was flowered at maybe 18"...so I guess it has stretched even more than I thought, close to triple now. That's the another good thing about cloning, you know about how much a pheno. will stretch, so you know exactly when you need to drop the light cycle. BTW, I run my flower space at 14 lit, 10 dark for alleged extra potency.

The approach of taking clones late in flower is obviously harder than taking them during veg, but if you're space limited, it's the best way to go, because you don't create a need for more space until just before flowering finishes, which is nearly ideal for space challenged types. You also know if it will flower well or be an air-budder among other things about the pheno. The fact that they have to revert back to veg buys you time since the plants don't do shit for weeks and stay the same size. You know you have joy once it has rooted and sat around for weeks and notice some new growth. Patience and environment are the secrets to cloning, IMO. I am relatively new to it, but kill very few cuttings now. I did just kill a male by sticking him on my main LED where he got too hot and cooked...had I not put it there, it would have made it I am sure. Didn't need them genetics anyway..>LOL<.. It was a volunteer from my first run of the Afghan. A seed fell out of one of the buds and popped up so i ran it just to see what it was...

Anyway, I hope all of my rambling helps you figure it out.

 

[Morcheeba*]

all my clones are rooted under multiple 24w cfl's..........not sure which one but its a more blue light.

i try and avoid a re-veg on an entire plant b/c i harvest my plants at the end of the harvest window, when trichs are mostly amber...........just my liking.

i try and limit taking clones in 12/12 after wk3 but have done it later w/success and i just got done cloning 3 strains im running from seed and in 7 days the clones will be rooted and ill flip the plants and note any males to cull or save and once all females finished flowering ill chose which pheno of each strain i want to keep.........ill run all clones a 2nd run to make sure im choosing the best pheno then the female pheno's not wanted will be killed.

as you can imagine it pushes my plant count up doing seed runs but its worth it.


i dont think using mh during the stretch will be a problem but w/6' height you should be fine. the worst case you end up like me, im flowering a 100% sativa from seed and my female went in at just under 2' and it exploded and is over 6' and bent over along the top of my tent........i have a 5'x5'x7' tent on its side so 5' max height....not good for a 6' plant but i know what to expect now.

no fear, just do it.


peace

 

[BrownThumb]

You want 6500K (blue) for clones/vegging. I have a 2nd box 14" x 14" x 18" approx. that I move the clones into for veg before I move them to their final resting place. For clones, anything will work, but since I start seedlings w/ the clones, blue is the best way to go. I use a 105 watt 6500K CFL to power the veg box and it works really well, even with veggies, as long as you move the plants that can't take constant light out before they start to revolt (tomato plants hate constant light AFTER the seedling stage and will become chlorotic quickly. 14 hours is the ideal day length for toms, but peppers can take constant light, although 20 hours is the best for those.....). What were we talking about?

 

[classV]

Anyway, I hope all of my rambling helps you figure it out.

What you call "rambling" I call education. Thanks, man. For taking the time to share what you have learned. You've given some interesting things to think about.

 

[classV]

You want 6500K (blue) for clones/vegging. I have a 2nd box 14" x 14" x 18" approx. that I move the clones into for veg before I move them to their final resting place.

That's a tight space. Do you keep a mother, or do you have system for cycling the clones between that box and your main grow space?

 

[classV]

the worst case you end up like me, im flowering a 100% sativa from seed and my female went in at just under 2' and it exploded and is over 6' and bent over along the top of my tent........i have a 5'x5'x7' tent on its side so 5' max height....not good for a 6' plant but i know what to expect now.

Holy cow... how do you manage the light hood in all of that? I'm running an HID hood, so it alone takes up nearly a foot when I crank it up to the top of the tent. Sounds like you are pretty handy with a rope, man!

I hope my topped, Indica girls stay short and stout. I never was very good with knots!

 

[BrownThumb]

That's a tight space. Do you keep a mother, or do you have system for cycling the clones between that box and your main grow space?

I have 2 little boxes and then 2x2' in my closet for flowering. Cuttings and/or seedlings sit in the smallest box w/ 23 watt cfl. I think that box is maybe 11inches, by 10 inches by maybe 6 inches.... It's small. Once I want to veg them, I move them into a larger cardboard box that I taped up and reinforced to hold a 105 watt 6500K cfl mounted through what would normally be the bottom of the box. They can get maybe 12-14" at most in the veg cardboard box, it's 14" x 14" by about just enough to grow plants maybe 12-14". That's it. The expensive part is the 105 watt cfl at 25 or 30 bucks. The 23 watt bulb is what, maybe 2 or 3 bucks? The veg box is actually the shipping box for my clone bucket that I don't really use. The flower room packs about 4 or 500 watts of LED. I am looking forward to doing a run using that main LED for veg..it should be pretty freakish compared to what i get w/ the cfl approach, but the system does work, if you want to call my cheap-ass ways a system. I call it being poor. I plan on getting a tent or two at some point when i can afford it.

In regards to mothers, I actually already explained that in post 14 where I talk about taking cuts in late flower, yadda, yadda, blah, blah, blah. Read through that again and you should have a pretty complete picture of what's up w/my approach. There are some pluses in regards to minimal space usage when doing the late flower cuts, but you can be penalized if you f-it up and delay the cuttings from rooting or vegging and are not fully utilizing your flowering space. The other thing about doing the monster cuts is the freakish growth you get from monster clones as opposed to regular clones taken during the veg. phase. I started out by taking more cuts than I needed thinking I would probably kill most of them, but I don't know, all of the sudden most of them started taking and I had too many. Really, it's like the less you focus on it, the easier it becomes. Tap water, maybe a little rooting compound, rock wool, coir, whatever, proper temps, patience and faith in the lord. Not too dry, not too wet, not too hot, not too cold....