What's new
  • Happy Birthday ICMag! Been 20 years since Gypsy Nirvana created the forum! We are celebrating with a 4/20 Giveaway and by launching a new Patreon tier called "420club". You can read more here.
  • Important notice: ICMag's T.O.U. has been updated. Please review it here. For your convenience, it is also available in the main forum menu, under 'Quick Links"!

My shot at V-SOG

Species8472

Member
*EDIT: FYI, this turned into a Soilgrow with Blumats in a Donut-Setup


Synopsis
:woohoo:
600 W bare bulb in the center of a hexagon. Six DIY-racks with three levels each, a 60 cms wide dutch leach tray on every shelf. Irrigation via drip system, DTW.






What I want to do
Well, simply stated, I want to shrink the bobbleracks down to dimensions that will work with my miserable, single 600 W bulb,
while keeping the option to go all manly and hang in a second bulb once I have it all dialed in.

Here is what I came up with so far:
Six racks, each 60 cm [23.62”] wide, form a hexagon with an internal diameter of about 120 cm [47.25”].So, the plants would
be about 60 cm [23.62”] away from the bulb when they get planted into the trays. The mandatory fan on the floor below the
bulb blows the heat up & away.

The trays would be filled with Coco, with a layer of hydroton underneath for better drainage.
Irrigation would be implemented with a drip system quite like bobbleheads – assuming that I got it right what he did there.
The water would be pumped up from a reservoir to the top of the racks in a 1” PE-Tube to a T-fitting piece, forming a full circle
above the racks.
On the side of every rack a tube goes down to the lowest level, with a capillary tube to the side on every level.
The idea is to use drip valves to humidify the trays as evenly as possible. The leach trays are equipped with 10 mm drain tubes
on the backside, which would allow me to water with a run off.

Mayor Questions, if this is, at all, a viable way to skin a mule:

Genetics: I just recently selected two mums from a pack of Critical Mass by Mr. Nice Seeds. The first one is a Indica-Type Pheno,
the other one has a more stretchy appearance. CM yes/no?

Size of the pump: I can’t seem to find a formula to work out what would be optimal. Any hints?
There’s a voice in the back of my mind yelling that bobble uses a 500 gal pump…
I never used PE-Watering Systems before, how much pressure is “too much” and will possibly blow up the fittings? The drip valves
I have in mind start watering at 0.5 bar and stop if the pressure falls below 0.2 bar.

Drippers: More drippers equal a more even humidification – 2, 3, 4 per 60 cm tray?

Plantcount: With a single bulb in, I would assume that it would be good to use 3 levels of the racks, so it would be
3 levels x 6 racks = 18 leach trays 60 cm each. My guess would be to put 2 or 3 rooted cutlings in every tray and switch to 12/12
with nearly no veg time at all. I know that plant numbers dictate the yield here,
but how many do you guys think I can throw in without having them fight to the death for root space and light?

I am aware that there are lots of other things to address, but I think that these are the basic that should be planned out before I start building /buying stuff. :tumbleweed:
 
D

DaveTheNewbie

i dont know much about much of this, but one thing i can say about pumps :

get a big pump. it cant be too big. it can be too small.
if your pushing too much water you can make an offtake near the pump with a valve to regulate how much water goes up the pipe. And an offtake becomes a method of keeping the water moving in the res/tank.
Plus pumps dont just have a rating of how much water they move, they also have a rating of head (how high they can move water). And since you have to move alot of water up a long way (top of the rack) your going to want a decent pump. I believe Bobble uses a monster sized pump :)
 
D

DHF

A single 600 with stacked racks is doomed from the get unless everything that`s not green`s covered in reflectix/orca/prodex , and it seems like you`re cross da pond my buddy huh ?........so.....

Heath`s racks as well as mine were angled toward the stacked bulbs to prevent "back hackin" of the plants where lumen penetration wouldn`t get to on bookshelf type grows or stadium staggered back setups......and......

A single hung 600 bare bulb won`t carry much sideways lumen penetration up and down with 3 levels you`re talkin bout runnin , but hey......

This is the Vert section and....... Some folks gotta fuck up ta find out what don`t work so they`ll figure out sooner or later due to their stubbornness what does work even if they were told upfront what actually did work........that said......

Still waitin on certain rack returns....but.....

Heath ran 2-600`s side by side in a 4 x 6' walk in cooler type thingy with like 87 seeds on 2 shelves with fully rooted cuts to fill in the canopy and pulled lil over 4 lbs per run with increased plant numbers......IOW.......

Sky`s the limit with bare bulbs butchas gotta know their limitations so as to exploit and dial em.......

Peace....DHF....:ying:......
 

Species8472

Member
I see your point, DHF.
So to speak... with my 600 single bulb, I might get much better results if I just keep things to my 4 x 4 tent, set up 8 ladies in 3 gal pots around it, and get some wire fence with a 30" diameter around the bulb?

Thanks a lot for the input.
 
D

DaveTheNewbie

I see your point, DHF.
So to speak... with my 600 single bulb, I might get much better results if I just keep things to my 4 x 4 tent, set up 8 ladies in 3 gal pots around it, and get some wire fence with a 30" diameter around the bulb?

Thanks a lot for the input.

its a hell of a lot easier :)
 

Species8472

Member
Ok, so I'm going for it in this enviroment:

600 W single bare bulb
huge-ass fan underneath
8 Ladies in 3 gal pots
Blumats

I already had the Blumats lying around, so it's going to be my first vert plus my first run with Blumats in soil. Yay! :)

The girls are currently vegging in the tent under 5 x 36 W Flouros. I've set up an electric heater, a mist-fogger normally used for terrariums, both hooked up to a controller. They get 20 - 23 °C and 70% Humidity all day and night now, and are sitting in 1.75 gal pots. The tallest one is 10" high now.

Im wondering when to transplant them to their final 3 gal pots and how tall they should be before i make the switch.
 

Species8472

Member
I forgot to mention the strain:
It's "King Kong" from Dr. Underground. I have never seen it before anywhere - I know what they say about curiosity, but well... I'm nosy.
 

bobblehead

Active member
Veteran
Synopsis :woohoo:
600 W bare bulb in the center of a hexagon. Six DIY-racks with three levels each, a 60 cms wide dutch leach tray on every shelf. Irrigation via drip system, DTW.


[URL=https://imageshack.us/a/img255/3747/img4701p.jpg]View Image[/URL]



What I want to do
Well, simply stated, I want to shrink the bobbleracks down to dimensions that will work with my miserable, single 600 W bulb,
while keeping the option to go all manly and hang in a second bulb once I have it all dialed in.

Here is what I came up with so far:
Six racks, each 60 cm [23.62”] wide, form a hexagon with an internal diameter of about 120 cm [47.25”].So, the plants would
be about 60 cm [23.62”] away from the bulb when they get planted into the trays. The mandatory fan on the floor below the
bulb blows the heat up & away.

The trays would be filled with Coco, with a layer of hydroton underneath for better drainage.
Irrigation would be implemented with a drip system quite like bobbleheads – assuming that I got it right what he did there.
The water would be pumped up from a reservoir to the top of the racks in a 1” PE-Tube to a T-fitting piece, forming a full circle
above the racks.
On the side of every rack a tube goes down to the lowest level, with a capillary tube to the side on every level.
The idea is to use drip valves to humidify the trays as evenly as possible. The leach trays are equipped with 10 mm drain tubes
on the backside, which would allow me to water with a run off.

Mayor Questions, if this is, at all, a viable way to skin a mule:

Genetics: I just recently selected two mums from a pack of Critical Mass by Mr. Nice Seeds. The first one is a Indica-Type Pheno,
the other one has a more stretchy appearance. CM yes/no?

Size of the pump: I can’t seem to find a formula to work out what would be optimal. Any hints?
There’s a voice in the back of my mind yelling that bobble uses a 500 gal pump…
I never used PE-Watering Systems before, how much pressure is “too much” and will possibly blow up the fittings? The drip valves
I have in mind start watering at 0.5 bar and stop if the pressure falls below 0.2 bar.

Drippers: More drippers equal a more even humidification – 2, 3, 4 per 60 cm tray?

Plantcount: With a single bulb in, I would assume that it would be good to use 3 levels of the racks, so it would be
3 levels x 6 racks = 18 leach trays 60 cm each. My guess would be to put 2 or 3 rooted cutlings in every tray and switch to 12/12
with nearly no veg time at all. I know that plant numbers dictate the yield here,
but how many do you guys think I can throw in without having them fight to the death for root space and light?

I am aware that there are lots of other things to address, but I think that these are the basic that should be planned out before I start building /buying stuff. :tumbleweed:

ha ha... Are you sure you want to go down this rabbit hole? Cause we can do it... but its not easy, and I hope you're gonna be around at least every other day to get it dialed in. I've been struggling with mine for a long time now. It finally works, and I just have to get healthy plants in... but only visiting 1x a week it's taken me almost 2 years. I couldn't even come up with clones to fill the room for the longest time.

I'll tell you what else... My feed isn't exactly even. You've seen the micro-sprinklers, right? I started off feeding them with gravity pressure from solenoids, but I didn't have enough pressure to feed all 48 drip tubes coming off 3/4" PVC. I dropped a 500gph pump in my elevated reservoir to increase the pressure... and now all 48 drip tubes get feed, but some plants get more feed than the rest. You can adjust individual feed lines, but every time you do that, you change to pressure to all the lines a little.

Blumats are cool if you're around to learn them... I wouldn't set them up and walk away for a week. I had crazy issues with them in a remote grow. I don't think you're growing remote though... Otherwise I would feed recirculating, so that you can drain the runoff from the plants that get too much feed, and give the plants up top the extra feed time they need. That's part of being greedy and having so many levels I guess... 4 levels probably wouldn't have as many pressure issues. The more plants you add, the more complicated things get.

If I had it to do over... I would build 4 shelves of stacked beds, fed recirculating or blumats... but blumats are tricky too cause you have to get the head pressure right... and how do you stack plants to the ceiling and still keep lots of pressure when the plants on the bottom are sucking juice?

Oh yeah, and the base of your racks is too narrow. Mine are shelves screwed into the OSB walls. Wheels are nice, but you need a wider base or they'll just fall over. Maybe you planned on hinging them so they're all connected though... So many possibilities... Lots of problems to overtake.

Good luck whatever you do... It looks like you've been paying attention and hopefully you learned from my mistakes.
 
D

DHF

Ok, so I'm going for it in this enviroment:

600 W single bare bulb
huge-ass fan underneath
8 Ladies in 3 gal pots
Blumats

I already had the Blumats lying around, so it's going to be my first vert plus my first run with Blumats in soil. Yay! :)

The girls are currently vegging in the tent under 5 x 36 W Flouros. I've set up an electric heater, a mist-fogger normally used for terrariums, both hooked up to a controller. They get 20 - 23 °C and 70% Humidity all day and night now, and are sitting in 1.75 gal pots. The tallest one is 10" high now.

Im wondering when to transplant them to their final 3 gal pots and how tall they should be before i make the switch.
Another weed donut/crop circle FTW.....and.....

No big ass fan required beneath , but rather a small muffin fan on it`s lowest setting to simply create a gentle "column" of air to assist the exhaust/scrubber combo in getting rid of excess heat and smell........and lastly.....

Major air exchange twice per minute`s your friend as well......anyways.....

Good luck Bro...

Peace....DHF.....:ying:.....
 

Species8472

Member
ha ha... Are you sure you want to go down this rabbit hole?
I will - but I will skip the racks until I can afford a place to grow that is not where I live.
Not far away, but, you know... just not in my damn house.

No big ass fan required beneath ,
I just read about smaller fans under neath -> lower temps in the tent in another thread.
To think that how healthy my plants look since I followed your advice to dial things in,
I will start looking for a smaller fan ASAP.

So here we go with the donut:

That's the bare tent & stuff I will use.


These are the ladies today. The tallest ones are well above 10" (40 cm) high, I think I am going to flip them to 12/12 tomorrow. It's my first time with this strain, and the only description I have ever come across with was "Indica-dominant Strain with a Sativa-type Structure", whatever the hell this means. However, I'm quite scared that if I wait longer, they will blow up my tent.

They are already in 3 gal Pots (11 liter), I think it would be a good idea to put in the blumats tommorow and just make the switch to bloom. I got the Maxi-Tropf-Blumats, by the way.

Input more than welcome, as always.
 
D

DHF

Canopy management is everything with smaller grow areas and bare bulbs hangin Bro......so....less vegtime strain dependent in that small an area with perfect dialed environment......but....

As long as yas don`t top em , and then trim/prune/shape the plants sideways to keep em from growin into each other by end of stretch and competing for light and environment , all should do well..........

Looks good so far........Good luck and holler if I can help....

Peace....DHF......:ying:....
 

highcane

New member
Wish you the best with your set-up.I have a question for you,DHF,bobble,or anyone who can help.What strain would work in this setup or really simular(growing in coco with 3 liter bottles or 6 liter buckets with 2 1k bulbs hung vertically covering a square that's 5 1/2 ft tall with a five foot diameter) and can produce a plant that can finish no more than 24" and yield around 3/4 to a Oz of premium smoke in 63 days or less?Any replies are greatly appreciated if the OP doesn't mind.
 

Species8472

Member
Any replies are greatly appreciated if the OP doesn't mind.

I don't mind, but I am far too inexperienced to give you a detailed answer myself. For all I know, any sativa/indica hybrid should do the trick for you in a vert setup. You will want a strain that is more stretch-happy than an indica, because your canopy is on the side. Taller plant = more room for big buds. My suggestion would be to find a straindatabase online and do a bit of research. I think you will have no trouble finding a high-yielding hybrid.

Coincidence: First day of flowering on 420. :)



Again, sorry for the external hoster. My postcount will be higher one day.
 

Species8472

Member
It's getting crowded in my cabinet, and I couldn't be any happier about it. :dance013: Pics upfront:





They seem to be a little overwatered ("razors" on the leafs), but I'm still learning the blumats. Those basterds gave me a really hard time, but I have them working now.

The ladies don't show deficiencies. I've fed them with Canna Nutrients, on a very light schedule.They got pure Water throughout the veg, with very little fertilizer just uring the last week before the flip - I am using BioBizz LightMix Soil, which is preloaded for up to 4 weeks.

One of the plants really suffered from root damage, that's the dwarf on the mid-right. The little basterd clutched his roots so tight to the pot, I had to cut the pot to pieces when I transplanted it.

Tallest plant is 80 cm tall now. I have a feeling that stretch will soon be over, and I'm thinking about taking cutlings and reveg those when I start the pruning. Any thoughts?
 

Species8472

Member
My face when I tell my brother about going vert:


He's the only one that knows about my clandestine garden.
Wise man told me that the best security measure is not to talk about it.
 
Top