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Single light vs multiple light source

Greenheart

Active member
Veteran
You are over stressing this imo. The plant will take advantage of any light given to it. Even Halogen and Mercury vapor with a bunch of floro's if that is all you got to work with. At some point efficiency comes into play. Which I believe is your conundrum.

If you are just in it for yourself go with the gut and have fun. If you are trying to make a living off of this go with what is proven and experiment when you have the funds.

Intensity is a consideration I cannot believe otherwise. The lower leaves may look shaded to the human eye but nm wavelengths that comprise light spectrums will penetrate to varied depths according to wavelength and amount of energy level used in the generation of them.

Is the extra wattage a waste if it gives you intensity in the spectrum you want?

If 1 ballast makes a slight hum will 3 ballast's be louder? Honestly my mags are silent and the 1000w is about to see a 3rd year of action for my $400 original investment on the build your own kit I assembled. Even tag in the extra $100 I spent on a new bulb this year and it is still alot cheaper than spending all my time, money and risk tracking down bags.

To give you food for thought my first setup consisted of 1200W of floros in a 3.5' x 3.5' showerstall in my master bathroom using box fans and emergency blankets for reflection on the stall door and ceiling. Held in place by duct tape and a hot glue gun. It worked. I got great nugs. I thought this isn't so hard. The wife liked the nugs so much she decided the 3.5'x7' closet was worth sacrificing so I could keep up with our needs. Tax time rolled around and I convinced her that the drop in the powerbill would be worth it if I invested in a "real" light instead of all those halogens, twisties, and t8's I had managed to accumulate to give that closet what it needed. Look thru my taboo lighting album for the proof if you like. We all get our start somewhere. This should be a fun experience with self reward and gratification. Don't obsess and stress it unless of course that is your thing life.
 
Words of wisdom, Greenheart. To me, lighting is very important and worth stressing over. I personally really like CMH and electronic/digital ballasts, so it is worth it to me to go out of my "way" to set that up. I'm getting really nice flower production from 2 abused autoflowers since I put them under the CMH. Another thing about CMH is the white light... Any light leaks in the tent appear to be nothing more than a desk lamp in the bedroom from outside, not the orange glow of a possible grow lamp.

This is part personal and part extra on the side, so I need good production but I also want a good quality product. That being said, I've spent my time researching nutrients, etc. and am pretty good at growing and knowing what the plants need. I just want to make sure that my lighting arrangement is up to the task.

All in all, I don't want to waste money on things that do not work; since I have limited experience with indoor growing of plants. I am really liking what this one 250w cmh is doing and I've read and seen pictures of what other people are doing with 300-400w of CMH and it's impressive to me.

I was laid off a few months back and now I spend a lot of time banging my head against the wall. It's no wonder I'm stressing over this shit lol.

I've pretty much decided to test this out. On one side of the tent I will have a 250w HPS on digital ballast along with a 250w CMH.
On the other side it'll be the 3 bulb 150w on eHID ballasts in single reflector. Gonna see which side does better and then go from there. Won't know unless I do it.

I guess the real way to test it out would be all CMH on one side and MH then HPS on the other side. Maybe I'll end up going that route.
 

pip313

Member
Sorry bro but I agree with greenheart you are over stressing light source. You would be better off getting the standard hps 400w and using your time and money on nutrient knowledge and equipment.

Strain choice is going to make a difference light source not as much as far as weight. Healthy plants high yield strain.
 
Sorry bro but I agree with greenheart you are over stressing light source. You would be better off getting the standard hps 400w and using your time and money on nutrient knowledge and equipment.

Strain choice is going to make a difference light source not as much as far as weight. Healthy plants high yield strain.

Not so true with CMH from what I've read. It seems that Sativa's like the light from CMH more than Indica's... Supposedly anyway.

I got nutrients down, no worries there.

I'm gonna do a comparison like I said. See if I get better yields under all CMH or with MH/HPS. It's the same strains, same nutes, so it should be a good comparison. I GOTS TO KNOW, YO!! lol
 

Greenheart

Active member
Veteran
Sounds like a fun side by side. Casting my vote now on the 250hps+250cmh setup yielding higher and the 3x150cmh having better quality all other factors being equal.
 

Jnugg

Active member
Veteran
Are the plants clones from the same mom or seed plant of one strain?

If they are cuts from one mom then the experiment will let you know,but if seed with a bunch of differing phenotypes,your experiment will be no good.
 

pip313

Member
Side by sides are always fun to watch. I love scientific tests and a side by side counts for me. But yea tests invalid unless same exact clones and conditions are used besides the light. You top one you top both you feed one you feed the other unless the plants really show that they don't wanna be f'ed with.

Edit:
Honestly thinking about it your test won't really count. From experience stretch alone will be so different that growing would have to be tailored to the grow. Topping or not, when to feed and a bunch of other stuff won't be the same. You honestly would need a few side by sides to know for sure as you won't know what will happen till you do it once and you kinda change the grow around that.

CMH veg and flower I'm kinda jealous the resin production and such short plants. Sure dont miss the sunburn though the uv these things put off is no joke.
 
They're from seed for the first go and then after that it'll be all cuttings in a perpetual type setup. Scrog, no topping. They'll get the same nutes and treatment on both sides. First setup will be off because the one side will be 1 Critical Sensi Star and 1 NL Blue... The other side is both Critical Sensi.

So after first run I'll be doing cuttings of the Critical. I want to get that strain dialed in over the next 6mo.

Either way, it's going to cost $100 total for digital HPS ballast and bulb... Not like I am going out of my way or spending undue money to test this out.

On a side note, the flowers on my auto AK's are starting to look ridiculous with tons of resin. They're liking the CMH.
 

pip313

Member
Scrog might help but honestly it's a guess. They will fill the screens different. I can see the cmh taking a week or two longer to fill the screen with tighter internodes. Feed a dirt plant when it's not hungry a few times and the test will end right there. You could do hydro and top of with clean water and dump and change every week or two depending on res size and plan thirst. Ooh even better rdwc with one resivoror.
 

Jnugg

Active member
Veteran
Make sure you use cuts from only ONE keeper mom of the critical or any strain...gotta all be the same pheno & cut from ONE mom.


To the poster above me...soil is a lot more forgiving & easier than hydroponics.In hydro things happen so fast and depending on system and how often you're able to be around the grow,things can fuck up real quick and the crop might turn out a total failure if you can't get things back on the up & up quick enough.

One thing I've learned about nutes in my 16 years of growing is that less = more-let the plant(s) tell you what they want and when they want it.With soil feed less and more often (paying attention to runoff pH and EC every watering) or feed more less often (again paying attention to runoff pH & EC).I usually feed,water,feed but it's all strain/pheno/environment/medium/growing style/method dependent.
 

pip313

Member
Your test is not valid. Period. Can't have 2 variables and you do. Plant growth in veg and plant growth in flower. You have to test them seperate. Who knows you may be recommending hps for veg and cmh for flower.

Stretch to fill the screen and tight flowers.

Edit:
I'm not trying to discourage you from testing just letting you know the issues I see with the test and stressing that doing one test would be cheating yourself. Too many variables.

I would veg let's say 6 plants under 2 screens in both rooms, switch one screen with the other in flower. You would have a veg from both bulbs under both bulbs doing three tests at once. Test would count too as the screen would be exactly 1/2 of the room and symmetrical.
 
Your test is not valid. Period. Can't have 2 variables and you do. Plant growth in veg and plant growth in flower. You have to test them seperate. Who knows you may be recommending hps for veg and cmh for flower.

Stretch to fill the screen and tight flowers.

Edit:
I'm not trying to discourage you from testing just letting you know the issues I see with the test and stressing that doing one test would be cheating yourself. Too many variables.

I would veg let's say 6 plants under 2 screens in both rooms, switch one screen with the other in flower. You would have a veg from both bulbs under both bulbs doing three tests at once. Test would count too as the screen would be exactly 1/2 of the room and symmetrical.

Um... OK, the tent is divided in to 2 sections, so they stay in the same spot from start to finish. I'm already using RDWC, not soil.

That being SAID... One side will be a mix of CMH and HPS the other all CMH. From veg to flower all in the same spot under the same lights under the same fucking conditions! Only variable is the lighting and of course as Jnugg pointed out the phenotype. HOWEVER that is only for the first cycle, after that it'll be ALL CUTTINGS from a Critical mother.


I find hydro to be easier than soil. It's easier to check nutrient levels and pH and to adjust/change things immediately. I've grown watermelons, cantaloupes and strawberries (transplanted from soil to flood and drain hydro) outdoors. I started my AK47 autoflowers in RDWC hydro but since they are not my main goal I transplanted them to soil to finish out. They're doing effin' great thus far.


 

Greenheart

Active member
Veteran
I really think overall it will be the way to go myself. The wattage is a bit higher as well as individual bulb intensity. It will be interesting to see if the pure cmh side finishes later or has a better resin achievement or quality of stone.

Did you ever consider 2 x 250 cmh?

*as for the side by side validity. My own take says keep size the same, take cuts all from same mother, scrog on both sides for example, keep food levels optimal in each side. If the lighting makes a difference on uptake share that note. You are seeing which lighting is more efficient and that means keeping the individual bulbs in their own sweet spots (X inches away) I don't see any harm in that. You seem to have a gardening thumb already and a good idea of what you want to do. When you assemble it all and start setting up chairs give me a shout I would like to get a good seat for the show.
 
I wish I could do 2x 250w cmh, but then I'd have to use mag ballasts. Not gonna spend another $300 on an Accendo digital 250w ballast. That's why I'm pushing to try the 3x 150W CMH because the ballasts are electronic PSMH and are easy to get and only cost $80/ea. Personally, I think 450w of CMH in a 3x3' scrog would work pretty damn well. Check out the pics of the Auto AK47's

I just potted an NL Blue Fem seedling in a 3.75" netpot with hydroton and got the RDWC going. I'll start a grow log tonight or tomorrow. Super busy today.

 

pip313

Member
No man it's not the same fucking conditions. You can't compare fairly two flowers grown with different veg lights when your testing flowering lights. If you honestly think a test with 2 variables is valid relearn the scientific method. Different phenos make the test not real, different size and shape plants going into flower is no different. Yes I get your screening them but they will not fill the screen even, from experience the lights affect the plant growth in veg too much.

Your saying you want know what produces more weight in flower but your planning on testing them as both veg and flower. Unless I really misunderstand and your testing them as all around bulbs and not strictly what produces more in JUST flower.
 
No man it's not the same fucking conditions. You can't compare fairly two flowers grown with different veg lights when your testing flowering lights. If you honestly think a test with 2 variables is valid relearn the scientific method. Different phenos make the test not real, different size and shape plants going into flower is no different. Yes I get your screening them but they will not fill the screen even, from experience the lights affect the plant growth in veg too much.

Your saying you want know what produces more weight in flower but your planning on testing them as both veg and flower. Unless I really misunderstand and your testing them as all around bulbs and not strictly what produces more in JUST flower.

You done?
 
Circumstances changed so I decided to go an easier route and pick up a 600w digital ballast with a larger AC hood and I'll stuff both the 250w cmh and 150w cmh and the 600w mh/hps in the one hood which will be centered over a 3'x6' table with 4 scrog plants. We'll see how this turns out.
 

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