Lowest cloning temp.

[downtoearth]

What is the lowest temperature you can have the exposed leaves at while cloning provided the water temperature in the cloner is at 70? Want to place the cloner in the garage for this cloning run but unsure. It get's in the 40's at night and the 50's during the day. Thanks all.

 

[dubwise]

using a heating pad with a thermostat will help but it may not help out enough. you may need to get the ambient temps up a bit as well.

 

[downtoearth]

The water temp. will be maintained at 70 F. by an aquarium heater (it's cold in the garage). But the leaves not so much.

 

[ozman]

Well I have the same sorta problem,when it gets cold if the heat isnt on it gets cold in the chamber quickly.
Do you run your lights during the night time?How long is your lights on for?I run mine 24/7 it helps with the nite time temps.I also have a little heater in my cloner to keep the water warm,I also think the radiant heat will add some heat to the chamber.Keep the air moving in the cloner with a stone or whatever you use,keep your heater working and if you dont run you lights 24/7 try changing the times to lights on at night.
If that does not help,then you will have to figure out some other heat source to warm it up.
Good Luck.

 

[dubwise]

oops. sorry

 

[downtoearth]

The water temps are fine. It's the temperature outside of the cloner that concerns me. How low can it go or does anybody know? Hey, I rhyme

 

[mowood3479]

60.. and it took a week longer than at 73. ez cloner 45 site

 

[mowood3479]

40s and 50s sounds too cold. why not try one cut in it and see how it does for a night or two.. id imagine not very well tho but i could be wronng

 

[OrganicBuds]

I clone in my garage all the time at low temps, no problems for me. However I don't use a cloner, I just stick them in some soil and wait a week or two.

 

[DHF]

I clone in my garage all the time at low temps, no problems for me. However I don't use a cloner, I just stick them in some soil and wait a week or two.

You know......Pot`ll root in a glass of water sittin in the kitchen windowsill.......but.....

Rootin cuts expediently , efficiently , and on a consistent basis takes an elevated rootzone as well as ambient temps environment with low light wattage to encourage rootgrowth instead of foliage growth ftw.....

My best results came from 80 degree temps and 80 % humidity with plain ass 40 watt shoplights while snippin fanleaves in half to promote said rootgrowth instead of foliage once roots actually start springing forth from the submerged stems......that said.......

If yas go with undercurrent`s DTE and even if yas stick with the aeroflo setup , you WILL haveta dial that garage environment and keep temps lights on and lights off within a 10 degree variable to sustain consistent dialed results once everything`s online , up and runnin.....and...

Guaranteed.......some plants`ll root in a rock , but most of the elite and polyhybrid varieties run these days will fall over dead within a matter of days if not sooner with colder ambient temps , even IF yas got temps in the cloner at 70.....don`t get me wrong.....

Like Organicbuds stated , he roots with dirt in a coldass garage , and I`d haveta say he`s the exception and most certainly not the rule for consistent rooting week to week , month to month , on a yearly basis......bet on it......Hell.......

I rooted cuts with damn near 100% usin 50/50 verm/perl mixes in 16 oz red solo cups for over a decade , and then with clear solo cups usin a coco mix that showed me the picks of the litter roots developing sooner than the others to get em under the T-5`s faster to pre-veg for the next decade....and.........in a cloner elevated solution temps haveta be watched for gunk forming so be wary of cloners working run after run without thorough sterilizing and frequent cleanings.....but....

80 degrees and 80% RH worked for me for well on 20 yrs of indoor croppin , so good luck and......

Holler if I can help.......

Peace....DHF..............

 

[downtoearth]

Much thanks

Much thanks

Thanks DHF and the rest of you guys. I think I'll find an alternative way to run the clones on this run.

 

[highonmt]

just chuck a little radiant heater on a thermostat in next to um. You could throw a tarp around them as well. Keeps temps nice and steady and the plants love the radiant heat. Plus they are cheap.
HM

 

[OrganicBuds]

You know......Pot`ll root in a glass of water sittin in the kitchen windowsill.......but.....

Rootin cuts expediently , efficiently , and on a consistent basis takes an elevated rootzone as well as ambient temps environment with low light wattage to encourage rootgrowth instead of foliage growth ftw.....

I would agree that using soil or rapid rooters would not root as fast as a cloner, but much more reliable IMO. When I say "soil" I am talking 1 part fox farm, 1 part perlite, 1 part coco and one part EWC. I can root just about anything in that mix with 99% success for over 15 years now. I always get roots within 14 days, regardless of the strain.

With that said, I have used cloners in the past and they are FAST! However, if you don't clean them excessively then they will kill more plants in that one tray than I have lost in 15 years with my method.

 

[dubwise]

Not trying to jack the thread...but I do feel this is applicable and may help me and others if we can get a solid answer.....FWIW-I've been cloning in a dome with rooters for several years and each year when it gets cold outside my cloning program suffers. Id like to do the perlite/vermiculite in solo cup deal, but I need some help. Would it be best to place the solo cups on top off a heating pad (regulated to 75-80F) or leave the pad off and rely on the ambient temps in the room? This morning the veg room was 72F and it should top out today at 77F. I'd love to get away from the dome, but cuttings in cups in just the medium has never worked for me...For this particular issue, can we agree that an ambient temp needs to be 70+? I feel like if the room temps are past 70, then it matters very little which cloning method you employ....if this is true, then what should the rH be? How much variance can be allowed with this variable? Again, didn't mean to jack the thread, simply trying to learn, contribute and succeed.
Merry Christmas!

 

[OrganicBuds]

I did forget to add I live in nor cal and my temps never drop below 40, and almost never below 50 in my garage. That may make a difference.

Dubwise - I would use the heat mat. Does yours have a thermostat wire that reads the temps? Those are the best heating pads, and when I use mine I just put the thermostat in a cup with soil about half way down. That way it reads what the root temps of the other cups with plants in them.

 

[trichrider]

put cloner in box put heat mat in bottom put cloner on top set at 76.
plain water and a quick dip in rooting gel.
i can do three or four runs with cuttings before having to clean my cloner, not that that is best, i'm just lazy. do check the water to determine whether or not algae is started...when i don't get roots in ten days then i know the water is in need of change.
hydrogen peroxide everything and away you go.

ambient temps are 60* also no need to trim leaves as they are the energy source for root growth.
RH also 60*

 

[Mate Dave]

I could strike cannabis outdoors in winter in England by bringing them inside every day.

Let me know how low you try to make the temps and what success rates you get, Hardier plants will help specific ones tolerant to the cold climates.

Basic frost protection is all that is required, In reality I personally would get a HOTBOX Heat Mat, the one made for Zimbabwe with the lower wattage, then sit trays or pots/cups on that.

You will need a couple of lights or a mover to maintain an efficient use of space when using a mat as the base for the veg area.

There is no better bottom heat control available anywhere period.

You don't need to maintain a wet bulb temp, all that is required is to keep the cutting turgid.

 

[DHF]

I asked Dubwise after his pm to me to post his issues in the thread so as to help all up their cut rooting game since it`s such a weak link in the chain for folks tryin to keep the ball rollin and produce consistently......and.....

The reason the cloning game is such a weak link is directly because of so many varied opinions on how to do it......why ?......Cuz everybody`s method works......till it don`t and then it`s back up and punt.......

Folks try new products and rooting concoctions , and it works for a while........till it don`t and again......They try new things and products once again to get backta where they hoped to stay from the get....but.....

The truth of the matter is that elevated environment as in temps and humidity with LOW LIGHT is the key to consistent results......so....that said.......

Gotta respectfully disagree with everything you posted Trichrider regardless of your previous results with yer cloner.....why ?.....cuz yas were creating a microclimate in a box and not taking into consideration the fact if the box was gone , there`d be all those ambient lower temps to deal with and root cuts in temps waaaay too low across the board.....

Dub......With verm/perl solo cups yas sit em all on a tray with holes in the bottom for drainage as well as wicking up weak juice solution as the medium drys out and promotes aerated rootzone for roots to spring forth.....

Coco`s the same way , and all yas gotta do is saturate the medium and squeeze out all excess water , then stick a hole and set the cut.....press the medium down and around the stems and leave em be.......

I only went to my setups once a week , so when I got there some of the cuts would be droopin , but some would be thriving , so I filled the bottom tray with maybe 1/4" of ph adjusted weak nutrient solution ftw , and that`s how I went about taking the best of the best for the crop rotations and the rest went to the compost pile......the reason ?.......

By the time I got back the next week it was evident which one`s were the keepers and the rest got culled.........Bottom line......

80 degrees and 80% RH with cheapass T-8`s raised above the cuts instead of down on em till fully rooted rules the day , and in all my yrs Trichrider.......

There`s never been any reference to the small ass foliage left on a cut above ground "providing the energy to produce roots" , but rather the drying out and elevated rootzone as well as ambient temps causing the cambium/sp ?/ layers on the submerged cutting producing callousing , root bumps , and then lateral feeder and tap roots FROM the drying out and moistness factor...and...photosynthesis has all but nothing to do with rooting cuts I assure yas.......and.....

No 2 cuts root the same.....period.......and only the strong survive.....so.....Before I went to clear coco cups to root in , I waited to see new foliage growth in the red solo cups before putting "fully rooted cuts" under the T-5`s for pre-veg........IOW.....

With all the original cuts leaves snipped in half to in fact " assist " not hinder root production , WHEN new foliage appeared on the plantlets , I knew they were rooted enough to move on to the next phase of their cycle.........anyways.......

Many ways ta skin a mule........but.....consistent results are what matters....Summer AND Winter ... yr round.........

My 2 cents from all those yrs.........DHF..............

 

[Mate Dave]

Tonight I have done 200 clones in jiffy 7's plain tap water no hormones using the basil and nodal method.

Look them up and how to do them properly in a good propagation book, they're skilled techniques. Cloning is babyshit simple. I throw 50 pellets at a time into a 10ltr bucket of water, wait an hour, place the pellets into the trays that jiffy provide to enhance performance, next I select the plant material and make the individual cuts and place cuttings one at a time into a pellet at no point do I ever squeeze the pellet to allow moisture to escape. I simply firm in the cutting to get a bond between the cambium layer and the pellet.

This works 100% of the time if you good, no faffing about, quick and reliable as fuck and I done all the ways going.

I get Dreadlock roots that usually fill out over the full seed trays in a tangle, I then root prune them to increase the amount of roots given by the plant in the plug.

Very very high plant density’s can be achieved and maintained in this style.

Maintaining mothers is where it gets tricky and space is the answer to that.

Environment environment environment.

I've tested ALL commonly available substrates a nursery would need in controlled test environments to give me insight into which media suited which environment best and what media suited a particular cutting method.

In conclusion domes are not an essential part of propagation. Plant Material is.

The ideal environment allows minimal water loss from plant materials, allowing adequate light penetration for photosynthesis, supplying warmth and drainage to a media with the correct acidity/alkalinity reaction allowing an atmospheric balance between the temperature of the air and the moisture level of the media to maintain humidity.

Key environmental factors above and below plant propagation materials contribute to the success of both seeds and vegetative propagation as such they need to function correctly, an understanding of how they function helps carry out proper maintenance of both environments.

These environments can be broken down into separate areas of control;

They are the aerial environment and the environment of the medium.

The aerial environment can be broken down into factors such as, temperature, humidity, light transmission and gaseous balance, whereas, the medium environment covers the temperature, moisture status, aeration and the acidity/alkalinity reaction of the media.

Controlling the aerial environment involves maintaining the dew point, which is the temperature at which water vapour, in a volume of humid air, is at a constant barometric pressure and will condense into liquid water.

This water vapour cools around the leaves of cutting and plants. Moisture loss from the leaves is eliminated, encouraging healthy root growth and the leaf surface remains dry preventing moulds.

This environment can be achieved by using self regulating thermostats that keep the temperature in the optimum range for maximum water holding capabilities.

Furthermore, manual operation of a correct watering procedure, implemented with strategic opening of the polythene covers, ensures optimum maintenance of the environment allowing gaseous exchange to take place limiting evaporation and reducing transpiration.

At a high temperature, water vapour pressure deficit is usually high and Relative humidity consequently low and vice verse.

Controlling the media environment is firstly reliant on control of the aerial environment because a too humid or moist conditions increase the chances of infection in the plants.

Temperature needs to be controlled on a daily basis to compliment the fluctuation of the climate and to assist in maintaining a wet and dry cycle to control aeration through correct watering.

This can be done by checking the weight of the propagation container.

Controlling the acidity/alkalinity reaction of the media is done prior to propagation, choosing a suitable substrate to the particular needs of the plant.

If further assistance is required you can supplement the water supply and pre-charge the medium with controlled fertigation with pH suited to that particular plant type.

The least expensive method to maintain environment conditions is to keep the grow space dry when going into the night when the temperature drops.

These is no better performance than a mist bench performance in my opinion.

Once you control the "dew point" its very productive.

Any plugs including rock-wool are slow and expensive and inferior on many levels compared to Coco-Peat or Perlite which have various applications in propagation techniques.

You real know your shit DHF, always helping folk out, Good to have you around.

Merry Christmas & a Happy New Year all,

Good luck with the strike rates.

I will add that I often keep cuttings in sealed bags, rooted and un-rooted in a fridge for up to a month just because, and they grow/root fine, I like to grow it fresh to order myself.

Overview

To achieve great strike rates in cutting propagation, you need;
• Clean tools.
• Good quality, active cutting material.
• Good hygiene practice & aftercare procedures.
• Good growing media, correct alkalinity/acidity.
• Ideal environment - Low stress, correct root-zone temperature, transpiration evaporation limited.


To create ‘Warm bottoms and Cool tops’ requires a careful watch over cooling
and humidification.

 

[dubwise]

thanks DHF & Dave! Very informative and helpful.