Large unidentified worm or larve

[RockyMountainHi]

I was poking around and saw something move on top on my rockwool cube - then I looked closer and saw a BUNCH of em.

BIG! Much bigger than fungus gnat larve - I'm guessing about 3/16 to 1/4-inch (5-7 mm or so) Clearly visable with bad eyes. Clear to white-ish body, black head. green matter visable thru gut

Also found a few root aphids. -

The plants look - decent, I thought something not good, is happening. I was applying earthworm casting tea, which seemed to help all of them.

Judging from the number of them in 2 cubes, the plants are not stressed - yet.

they seem to be eating the alge on top on the blocks, I can't find any other blocks with them, everybody got the EW casting tea.



.

 

[Kush Technician]

Something about the thick green algae tells me you are watering too much or something. Shouldn't have algae like that on the (top of?) cubes. Don't know what the bug is, unless its fungus gnat larvae, which can be up to 1/4" long. Your description of the worm sounds like a fungus gnat larva. Perhaps let your cubes dry out a little and see if that reduces the worm population.

 

[Kush Technician]

also, you say not gnat larvae, but 1/4" is small. Are you being accurate with the size? Maybe it's more like 1/2" because fungus gnat larvae for sure can be 1/4", which again, is quite small.

 

[RockyMountainHi]

Hiya K T,, Thanks fer stoppin in,,

I flushed the 2 problem children with 125 deg. F, which fixed the root aphids and the "worm" problems for the time being. That usually knocks the shit out of large populations but it gets the benificials too. It also means I don't have acces to a fresh peek.

The two problem children are re-veg plants that I lost the mothers. So they have been in process about a year probably. Both are coming back to veg state from flowering. The only time I've been sucessful re-vegging.

I'm leaning towards benificials - but with a few RA's found - it's time to identify and annilate the vermin.

 

[medicalmj]

I was poking around and saw something move on top on my rockwool cube - then I looked closer and saw a BUNCH of em.

BIG! Much bigger than fungus gnat larve - I'm guessing about 3/16 to 1/4-inch (5-7 mm or so) Clearly visable with bad eyes. Clear to white-ish body, black head. green matter visable thru gut

Also found a few root aphids. -

The plants look - decent, I thought something not good, is happening. I was applying earthworm casting tea, which seemed to help all of them.

Judging from the number of them in 2 cubes, the plants are not stressed - yet.

they seem to be eating the alge on top on the blocks, I can't find any other blocks with them, everybody got the EW casting tea.



[URL=https://www.icmag.com/ic/picture.php?albumid=40399&pictureid=956107&thumb=1]View Image[/url] .
[URL=https://www.icmag.com/ic/picture.php?albumid=40399&pictureid=956106&thumb=1]View Image[/url]

Its is plump for a FG, but the black head is pretty indicative of a FG.

More concerning is the RAs you mentioned. Are you sure you have RAs?

RAs: Six legs and dual exhaust tubes on the back side, usually dark in color.

Harmless mites: 8 legs, and very small, translucent whitesh. Almost impossible to see w naked eye.

 

[RockyMountainHi]

I was thinking Fungus Gnat larve were smaller, and the plants are looking good, so it must be early infestation.

I am also finding the ocasional root aphid. I have had repeat outbreaks this year - I'm hoping the change in season will stop the cycle - I'm pretty sure they are coming in from outdoors. I have Botaniguard for flowering and Imid for veg.

I tried 125 F flush on a couple test plants last week, and the plants didn't seem to mind at all. As bad as they hate 90 F air temp , - roots, not near as picky. I've seen 115 flush here - found a study online that documented 125 deg as very effective. I can't argue.

I'm getting better at this - finding problems before the plants hit the skids. (t y karma genie)


I didn't have a Root Aphid issue until I bought 10 new blocks for seed starts.
Is it possible to get them from new blocks?
Wouldn't rockwool be sterile - mostly, ?

I've been microwaving the blocks after harvest, tried boiling water flush but that leads to moldy smells as the blocks dry. That is why I tried Worm Casting Tea, micro heard replacments.

Bout time to go do my rounds.

I'll b back, and thanks for the helps!

 

[Kush Technician]

Bayer Tree and shrub at about 200 ppm seems to kill the RA. I would get a No Pest strip for any fliers hanging out nearby, just in case. The NPS may kill whatever the worm is also.

 

[PoopyTeaBags]

1/4inch with a black head says fungus gnat larva to me..

 

[medicalmj]

Whats your definition of a root aphid?

 

[SeaMaiden]

Ugh, the only difference in definitions should be species. No...?

Hiya K T,, Thanks fer stoppin in,,

I flushed the 2 problem children with 125 deg. F, which fixed the root aphids and the "worm" problems for the time being. That usually knocks the shit out of large populations but it gets the benificials too. It also means I don't have acces to a fresh peek.

The two problem children are re-veg plants that I lost the mothers. So they have been in process about a year probably. Both are coming back to veg state from flowering. The only time I've been sucessful re-vegging.

I'm leaning towards benificials - but with a few RA's found - it's time to identify and annilate the vermin.

Would you mind elaborating on how you did that? Are you treating surrounding areas to ensure all female flyers have been eradicated as well? Cabbage aphids do the same thing, I've learned this year (become female flyers that get everywhere), but at least I'm getting some cauliflower, even if I do have to soak it in saltwater to get rid of the aphids.

Its is plump for a FG, but the black head is pretty indicative of a FG.

More concerning is the RAs you mentioned. Are you sure you have RAs?

RAs: Six legs and dual exhaust tubes on the back side, usually dark in color.

Harmless mites: 8 legs, and very small, translucent whitesh. Almost impossible to see w naked eye.

If not a FG, then some other 'maggot' is what I'm thinking. RAs look a lot like the same kinds of aphids you get on the top-sides (above ground) parts of many plants, but they're a lot smaller.

If he's been chasing phantom deficiencies, the plants can't fight off other pathogens, then I'd go at them like they're RAs in any event.

Rocky, are you simply passing the hot water through the media, or are you allowing the pot to sit in hot water? What I've read (Phylloxera Tx in grape stocks, anecdotal reports via pers. exp.) requires an exposure time of around 5mins for a 100% kill rate.

I found that, in order to ensure a 100% kill rate of the female flyers, I had to go pretty nuclear in the entire growing area and surrounds. I used chemicals, would prefer not to, will probably use steam if the problem presents again, instead (now that I have my Shark!). I sprayed fixtures, electrical outlets, equipment, shelves, floors, ceilings, nooks, crannies, up someone's ass, up the frogs' ass, EVERYWHERE. Hated it, but it got the job done with respect to complete elimination of the RA problem.

 

[RockyMountainHi]

1/4inch with a black head says fungus gnat larva to me..

I should have know, it couldnt be good bugs - I'm going to say they are Fungus Gnats and be safe and smart.

Glad the plants are not as stressed as I was

Whats your definition of a root aphid?

Root aphids and Fungus gnats are two different critters. I got some of both atm

Would you mind elaborating on how you did that? Are you treating surrounding areas to ensure all female flyers have been eradicated as well? Cabbage aphids do the same thing, I've learned this year (become female flyers that get everywhere), but at least I'm getting some cauliflower, even if I do have to soak it in saltwater to get rid of the aphids.

For root aphids - fliers develop when the population has saturated its home - you can have a bad assed outbreak and no fliers.

Flyers are bassically pregnate with prego babies - if I understand correctly so when they find a new home - they arrive knocked up.




Now the rinse-- I'm in rockwool cubes so I put the plant on top on 3 cubes and poor about 1/2 a gallon of 125 deg f. water slowley thru the block. The water flows - quite rapidly. I use a laser thermometer and the top of the second block is usually over 118 deg. --- so far - I haven't lost any plants - but I have one that is questionable.

I didn't think the plants could take that kind of abuse, but roots is different.

Soil would be a freakin mess.

 

[Neo 420]

Are you reusing rock wool?

As far as having algae on rock wool cubes are normal. I used to cover my cubes when I used RW.

 

[medicalmj]

If not a FG, then some other 'maggot' is what I'm thinking. RAs look a lot like the same kinds of aphids you get on the top-sides (above ground) parts of many plants, but they're a lot smaller.

Yeah, they are they same creature, lil smaller and much more damaging. Also, I should clarify that the exhaust tubes are dark brown/blackish while the body is usually an off white to yellowish color and sometimes little darker.

Root aphids and Fungus gnats are two different critters. I got some of both atm

Yes, two different animals, both cause damage, but the RAs as we know are harder to eliminate. But if you use Imid, you'll kill em both.

Once their gone, its important to monitor your room. Sticky cards are an alarm, not a method for elimination. I put those and a container w sugar, vinegar, wine and beer out w plastic wrap poked w small hole in it to know when the FGs are around. Then I take action!

 

[SeaMaiden]

I should have know, it couldnt be good bugs - I'm going to say they are Fungus Gnats and be safe and smart.

Glad the plants are not as stressed as I was







Root aphids and Fungus gnats are two different critters. I got some of both atm





For root aphids - fliers develop when the population has saturated its home - you can have a bad assed outbreak and no fliers.

Flyers are bassically pregnate with prego babies - if I understand correctly so when they find a new home - they arrive knocked up.




Now the rinse-- I'm in rockwool cubes so I put the plant on top on 3 cubes and poor about 1/2 a gallon of 125 deg f. water slowley thru the block. The water flows - quite rapidly. I use a laser thermometer and the top of the second block is usually over 118 deg. --- so far - I haven't lost any plants - but I have one that is questionable.

I didn't think the plants could take that kind of abuse, but roots is different.

Soil would be a freakin mess.

Would you mind terribly trying something, if you have a plant you're willing to experiment with (read: sacrifice)? Would you mind trying a dunk instead of a flush with hot water? And would you try it with water that's a bit cooler, perhaps in the 115*F range (too hot to grow yogurt, but hopefully cool enough to allow the plant to live through a 5min dunk)? I eliminated my RAs, but I have to be proactive and learn better how to deal with them BEFORE they hit again, not after, and hot water is not only cheaper, it's simpler, can be acquired IMMEDIATELY (unlike, say, Met52 that many folks have turned to), and would absolutely qualify for an organic program.

Dunking would possibly prevent the mess you're thinking of here, and I can see some soilless media, such as coir if it's not too fine, being alright with the method as long as some care is taken.

MUCH MUCH MUCH appreciated, sharing this information with us. Thank you.

 

[medicalmj]

Ugh, the only difference in definitions should be species. No...?


Would you mind elaborating on how you did that? Are you treating surrounding areas to ensure all female flyers have been eradicated as well? Cabbage aphids do the same thing, I've learned this year (become female flyers that get everywhere), but at least I'm getting some cauliflower, even if I do have to soak it in saltwater to get rid of the aphids.



If not a FG, then some other 'maggot' is what I'm thinking. RAs look a lot like the same kinds of aphids you get on the top-sides (above ground) parts of many plants, but they're a lot smaller.

If he's been chasing phantom deficiencies, the plants can't fight off other pathogens, then I'd go at them like they're RAs in any event.

Rocky, are you simply passing the hot water through the media, or are you allowing the pot to sit in hot water? What I've read (Phylloxera Tx in grape stocks, anecdotal reports via pers. exp.) requires an exposure time of around 5mins for a 100% kill rate.

I found that, in order to ensure a 100% kill rate of the female flyers, I had to go pretty nuclear in the entire growing area and surrounds. I used chemicals, would prefer not to, will probably use steam if the problem presents again, instead (now that I have my Shark!). I sprayed fixtures, electrical outlets, equipment, shelves, floors, ceilings, nooks, crannies, up someone's ass, up the frogs' ass, EVERYWHERE. Hated it, but it got the job done with respect to complete elimination of the RA problem.

Would you mind terribly trying something, if you have a plant you're willing to experiment with (read: sacrifice)? Would you mind trying a dunk instead of a flush with hot water? And would you try it with water that's a bit cooler, perhaps in the 115*F range (too hot to grow yogurt, but hopefully cool enough to allow the plant to live through a 5min dunk)? I eliminated my RAs, but I have to be proactive and learn better how to deal with them BEFORE they hit again, not after, and hot water is not only cheaper, it's simpler, can be acquired IMMEDIATELY (unlike, say, Met52 that many folks have turned to), and would absolutely qualify for an organic program.

Dunking would possibly prevent the mess you're thinking of here, and I can see some soilless media, such as coir if it's not too fine, being alright with the method as long as some care is taken.

MUCH MUCH MUCH appreciated, sharing this information with us. Thank you.

A dunk should work and not kill em, as my buddy who works in a commercial (non-cannabis) nursery said that infected (w endo-nematodes) could be placed in a nylon sack (onion bag) and placed directly in to a large (to keep temp stable) pot of water for x minutes/seconds (I'll need exact get time) and then dip and stick.

I have a couple decent sized plants in RW that I was gonna pitch. Suppose I could do one at 125 and see if she lives...

 

[RockyMountainHi]

I tried the dunk and soak,, the problem I see with dunk and soaking,, is getting that central temprature elevated. The water is hot when it touches the surface but as it soaks in, it cools, so getting the temps up at the core of the rootzone never happens; so there is a happy core of critters still snug as a bug in a rootball. With the flush - I don't stop till the top of the second block registers 120 or above, so I'm pretty sure we have at least 120 top to bottom and side to side. Plus with the stacked blocks under the plant - it drains quickly.

I was also microwaving my blocks at harvest, and that seemed to get mineral buildup;
now I have been trying dip in boiling water - which started the blocks to get a mold-mildew smell - which led to the earthworm casting tea. To replace the micro herd.

I'm bustin my ass, keeping the girls happy lately but - for the most part, it's working.

I scoped all the plants that had the larve- nothing.

Can't find any R/A's either.

Debaiting - probobly should dose the veg girls with Imid for the R/A's, not sure if that's the best choice for F/G.......

Identify the enemy THEN choose your weapon. Multiple weapons is a good thing.



Hopefully - the winter season will break the cycle - if they finally die off, they were coming in from outside - If I get another outbreak - it's from indoors.

 

[RockyMountainHi]

Bayer Tree and shrub at about 200 ppm seems to kill the RA. I would get a No Pest strip for any fliers hanging out nearby, just in case. The NPS may kill whatever the worm is also.

Bayer tree n shrub as several addirional ingredients, plus a feeding - and it raises hell with the girls. And they lowered the amount of Imidiclor…… recently.

No Pest Strips won't get worm things in the roots and they really don't go after root aphids or fungus gnats flyers. Plus the active ingredient is a mighty fine nerotoxin. Just hanging one in the garden for kicks,,,, I gotta pass on that idea and we will try to convince you if ya hang out. LOL

 

[medicalmj]

Bayer tree n shrub as several addirional ingredients, plus a feeding - and it raises hell with the girls. And they lowered the amount of Imidiclor…… recently.

No Pest Strips won't get worm things in the roots and they really don't go after root aphids or fungus gnats flyers. Plus the active ingredient is a mighty fine nerotoxin. Just hanging one in the garden for kicks,,,, I gotta pass on that idea and we will try to convince you if ya hang out. LOL

I found some stuff a produce/nursery place that had 22% Imid! Only $45 for a qt. No other crap in it either. So check around. Here's what I bought. And it will kill insects, and their larvae.

http://www.domyownpestcontrol.com/msds/ImidaPro_2SC_Bklet__label.pdf

 

[vukman]

check this guy out on ebay.....I buy from him and he'll ship to Canada if that is an issue for anyone...
http://www.ebay.ca/itm/Criterion-75...227?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item416c4b6f2b

 

[SeaMaiden]

I tried the dunk and soak,, the problem I see with dunk and soaking,, is getting that central temprature elevated. The water is hot when it touches the surface but as it soaks in, it cools, so getting the temps up at the core of the rootzone never happens; so there is a happy core of critters still snug as a bug in a rootball. With the flush - I don't stop till the top of the second block registers 120 or above, so I'm pretty sure we have at least 120 top to bottom and side to side. Plus with the stacked blocks under the plant - it drains quickly.

Aha! Ok, now that's an aspect I hadn't considered--the mass of the pot + roots, etc, cooling the water column too much. Thank you for sharing this observation.

I was also microwaving my blocks at harvest, and that seemed to get mineral buildup;
now I have been trying dip in boiling water - which started the blocks to get a mold-mildew smell - which led to the earthworm casting tea. To replace the micro herd.

I'm bustin my ass, keeping the girls happy lately but - for the most part, it's working.

I scoped all the plants that had the larve- nothing.

Can't find any R/A's either.

Debaiting - probobly should dose the veg girls with Imid for the R/A's, not sure if that's the best choice for F/G.......

Identify the enemy THEN choose your weapon. Multiple weapons is a good thing.



Hopefully - the winter season will break the cycle - if they finally die off, they were coming in from outside - If I get another outbreak - it's from indoors.

Wow, you have really been chasing these little sons of bitches down. I appreciate the information you've shared. I assume you're familiar with Met52 for inoculation of media, perhaps even tried it already and found not such good results..?

I actually found relief using Spectracide with Triazicide, and part of the reason why I chose that after getting no relief from the Bayer product was because of its PHI of 21 days. Good GOD it stunk, and it killed everything in my basement. But it worked, was the final death knell.