Immune to the Black Widow?

[Smokin' Chopper]

Maybe not immune, but "resistant" even? (I'll make all this short.)

I'm reluctant to post this for many reasons really, but the shit sure as hell strikes me as odd. In short, you'd have to know me, and my other resistances/immunities to really follow the "other worldly, shit just don't effect me" thing. With that said....

A few days ago, I noticed a bite on my left knee cap. I passed it off as something that would heal... after all, that which doesn't kill me... you get the idea of my typical mindset.

Several days later and its very swollen, difficult to walk, limping is noticible. The wife convinces me to consult "my family physician". For the record, this lady was an actual P.D. way back in the day, but she's first person I'd go to especially for a gun shot wound, and it doesn't cost me much more than a favor.

She's P.H.d material for sure, has all the documents to prove, but retired, and just wanting a life of peace. So there you have it, I didn't go to a hospital or currently "active" doc.

Without telling her where exactly I work, what kind of arachnids I'm subjected to on a regular basis, she blurts out. "Could be something poisonous like various wasps, bees, black widow......" That last one caught my attention. I've played with these in my work place. Plus they're the only thing that could crawl on my skin and go unnoticed. Don't know why, but these things don't creep me out nearly as much as a wolf spider, (also in my work place, and no where near poisonous) and I believe one could crawl up my leg that far unnoticed and bite me. They're stealthy, believe me.

Here's the kicker... I grew up in a Southern state, and about age 7 I was playing around some styrofoam coolers, and revealed a widow colony... yes odd if you know the habits of a widow...., but without noticing I was bitten by two different widows. I passed out, a coma came over me, by all rights I was probably dying. My dad took me to the hospital, a quick retrace of steps and he knew what illed me, and they essentially resurrected my ass. I lived happily, or thereabouts, ever after....

Now I get this bite and the doc relates it to a widow.... Granted I find myself almost mystically drawn to these creatures, and yet I'm highly arachniphobic. Resistant? Immune? I don't know if I buy that. This morning I was using a cane for assistance in walking, after draining some pressure off the knee (yes I'll spare you the details) I'm walking somewhat normal again, but never once did I feel sick to my stomach or head like I did with my first experience with these creatures.

I now feel it needful to say I've been stung by many varieties of bees, wasps, hornets, scorpions, etc. But never really been so far off balance as I was when my first contact with widows occured.

So what I'm asking you, the reader, is.... could it be possible that I really have developed somekind of resistance/immunity with the black widow spider?

Granted and as mentioned I've recieved various insect bites in latter years, and never really been affected so much as a tiny bump and some minor discomfort in the general area of the bite/sting. But how in the hell does someone develope a resistance or near immunity to one of man kinds' most deadly of species?

Bear with me, a little kind, and some whiskey have prompted this blog/posting. Otherwise I feel great though walking with a slight limp, and perplexed by the possibilies that have been suggested already. Strange shit man....


SC

 

[Smokin' Chopper]

Here I am on a computer... a virtual library of information at my fingertips and I forget this very point....


Thank you JJ. Though I'm still in a bit of disbelief that something as such could happen from only one experience I shouldn't be so easy to dismiss it.

My wife brought up a good point... when I was initally bitten many years ago, what was the cure? If they injected me with an anti-venon, (I was out of it so I wouldn't know), was that something that could have caused or aided in antibodies being created? Damn if that's not a Spider-Man like feeling. LOL

Back on a serious note though, I do know that the various genuses of the widow family yeild differing degrees of toxicity in poisons. Example, a male has less venom than a female, a juvenile (correct season for one too), has less.... and so on. I truly think the adult female widow is a beautiful creature. She commands respect, and intrigue. And I believe if I were bitten by one, I'd feel much more than just swelling on the knee (in this case the affected area).

There's still a great deal of disbelief for me. My doc is a great person, and she knows here stuff... the probability is that this was a spider. The odds are in my given area it was either a wolf spider, or widow, as other species are just not as venomous or prevalent. But a wolf spider bite would be much more like that of a bee sting, small swelling in a general area, maybe some itching, and go on without a bother.

I think by this time I've still over analyzing the whole thing, so I just need to take the wife's advice and rest. LOL.

Nite all!


SC

 

[Sheriff Bart]

yes it seems possible that you built an immunity to those toxins
but many spiders/bugs could be the cause, not just black widow...

i aint a fan of spiders either but i liek that they eat other bugs...if i find one in the house, i collect it up and bring it to where some of my indoor plants are so it can hang out in a better environment with some bugs....i've seen a few spiders hang out around a cacti of mine for over a week, then he disappeared, lol!

 

[Relapse]

I don't pretend to know anything about Black Widows, I've seen enough to not really care to ever see them again, but don't know anything about their poison.

Is your post asking why you didn't go into a coma again? Is it possible that since you were bitten by two when you were a small child that the effect of the poison would have had a much greater effect on you than one bite would now that you are a grow adult?

 

[_angst_]

I think you're just older and better equipped at dealing with the toxin. A sting from a spider to a little child will put a higher % of blood/toxin ratio than a bite to an adult.

 

[PhenoMenal]

Australia has a sister of your widow - the Redback Spider, which is even more deadly, but because of anti-venom there are hardly any fatalities anymore

 

[lockheedmartin]

fucking wow

 

[Verite]

Its a toxin, not a virus. The only way to build immunity from it would be long term exposure to doses that dont kill you. Same way they make antivenom, by exposing an animal to small amounts of venom and blood harvesting the antibodies.

Viruses like chicken pox are the only ones I know of that you can build those kinds of true immunity from.

The black widow gets a bad rap since its a rather aggressive spider as the species goes, attacking a close moving object before establishing exactly what it is, etc. Its said its cousin the brown widow can produce a bite with twice the toxicity and has an orange hourglass marking.

 

[ToKEN]

^^^^mmmmmm, protein...

 

[Sammet]

Sorry to say this but I doubt you were bitten by a Black Widow. I've just done some reading on it and although not all bites are fatal, there would be some pretty serious side effects from the neurotoxins they have in their venom:

Latrodectism is the clinical syndrome caused by the neurotoxic venom, here's the symptoms from wikipedia:

Exacerbation phase

During the first 24 hours after a bite:

* Severe pain in muscle groups local to the bite.
* Muscle cramping, primarily in the abdomen, back and thighs.
* Headache, dizziness, tremors, salivation, diaphoresis (excessive sweating), nausea and vomiting.
* Anxiety, fatigue, insomnia.
* Lacrimation (tearing of the eyes).
* Migratory arthralgia (joint pain).
* Tachycardia (rapid heart beat), bradycardia (very slow heart beat), restlessness, hypertension (elevated blood pressure), Tachypnea (hyperventilation).

In some rare and extreme cases, severe complications can arise:

* Spontaneous abortion, preterm labor
* Priapism
* Acute renal failure (failing of kidney function).
* Myocarditis, rhabdomyolysis, paralysis.
* Shock, coma, and death.

Symptoms that may be present at or near the wound:

* Rash, slight erythema (redness of skin), Piloerection (goose bumps).
* Mild edema (swelling due to excess fluid).
* Lesion or mild infection (rare).

Dissipation phase

During the first 1 to 3 days after the bite:

* Symptoms start to decline.

Residual phase

During the following weeks or months:

* Muscle spasm, tingling, nervousness and weakness.



You can't maintain an immunity to a venom without periodic injections of venom (approx. every 21days) just like Verite said, so chances are:

A - It wasn't a black widow bite
B - If it was, you'd experience the symptoms above and probably would have gone to hospital rather than a local "doctor"

I'm not sure but is this doctor you mentioned an MD or a PHD? Because there's a big difference I can tell you, and I never went to medical school

So no worries, just in the future don't try any death defeating black widow juggling to impress the wife

 

[drunkenstoner]

cool pic verite , is that egg sacks or prey , anyways it looks like little mines like from minesweeper

 

[PhenoMenal]

They're egg sacks

 

[Smokin' Chopper]

* Severe pain in muscle groups local to the bite.

Definitely had this one.

* Muscle cramping, primarily in the abdomen, back and thighs.

Some of this falls back into the "history" of knowing me and how I seem to react to things. Some things simply go unnoticed, but I did feel rather tight this week.

* Headache, dizziness, tremors, salivation, diaphoresis (excessive sweating), nausea and vomiting.

I had a headache and experienced mild dizziness which I dismissed as mild cold symptoms residual from my kid who'd been sort of ill this week.

* Anxiety, fatigue, insomnia.

I also dismissed these symptoms simply due to the stresses the wife and I have been dealing with this month.

* Lacrimation (tearing of the eyes).

Very common in my workplace around the various chemicals. I have a hyper sensitive olfactory system lol. This week I could swear I smelled cigarette smoke in the flammable storage room.... we deduced it was possibly somehow coming in through an evac vent.

* Migratory arthralgia (joint pain).

Also rather common with me on a normal basis, but my knee experienced quite a bit more than normal.

* Tachycardia (rapid heart beat), bradycardia (very slow heart beat), restlessness, hypertension (elevated blood pressure), Tachypnea (hyperventilation).

Probably also unnoticed as I can control my heart rate with thought. Knowing my history with strange things would involve much training I've been through, so its highly possible I experienced a number of these and simply dismissed them.

I'll never really know what caused my knee to react this way, but as was mentioned above, as soon as widow was mentioned I knew it had to be something with some pretty good toxins to make that kind of effect on my body. Several years ago I was stung by a scorpion (not native in my area, but very native to the area I was in), and only experienced what I could describe as fire under the skin. The following day, only minor swelling in the affected area much like a bee sting, and two to three days later, healed.

Symptoms that may be present at or near the wound:

* Rash, slight erythema (redness of skin), Piloerection (goose bumps).
* Mild edema (swelling due to excess fluid).
* Lesion or mild infection (rare).

Definitely the swelling and excess fluid. I'll spare the details, but I drained a bit more this morning and its looking and feeling much better now.

You can't maintain an immunity to a venom without periodic injections of venom (approx. every 21days) just like Verite said, so chances are:

I knew it had to be something like that, and that's the main reason I was kind of skeptical myself that such a thing could occur. I still have to entertain the thought of perhaps a juvenile widow. Weaker and its the right season for them to be around. Late spring we'll start to notice adult forms there.

I'm not sure but is this doctor you mentioned an MD or a PHD? Because there's a big difference I can tell you, and I never went to medical school

That's a great question, I'd have to ask her sometime. I know what hospital she used to work at, and I trust her judgement is all.

So no worries, just in the future don't try any death defeating black widow juggling to impress the wife

No doubt LOL. Not sure why widows don't creep me out like other spiders, they're beautiful and fun to watch, but I like to draw an imaginary fence between them and myself. They can do their thing and I'll go do mine.

Maybe if I get the chance this spring I'll try to grab some pics of these to post up in here.

Thanks again everyone, as usual, you guys rule x 2.


SC

 

[thcglory]

I had the Catapult when growing up

 

[supermanlives]

your just a bit tougher than the average joe. i got stung by scorpians in florida. felt like i drank too much coffee and my hand swelled up like a baseball glove .

 

[Skinny Leaf]

If you are not shooting silk webbing from your wrists you are probably not immune.

How do these threads get drug back up?