Possible Nitrogen Deficiency? pic

[Indoor Odor]

Thank, for taking the time to look. Plants are:
Blue Crack, J1, Sour grapes
13 days into flower
20 gal grow bags
Sunshine #4 mix
Fox farm nutes- grow big, Tiger bloom, Big bloom
Run off- Ph-6.3 ppm-1750 EC- 3500 us
Day time temps are getting high in the low 90's
Day time humidity 40%
Plants are about 6-8 feet tall from rim of pot
all three pics are of same plant

I believe I have a Nitrogen deficiency. Should I just add some Fox Farm Grow Big to the mix? I would think that with a ppm that high the plant would have plenty of nitrogen. Had this problem last run also. Interested in your opinion. Thanks

 

[Indoor Odor]

How long has this problem been going on?
Noticed about 1 week ago.
What STRAIN are you growing?
Blue Crack, J1, Sour Grapes.
What was the establishing technique? (seed or clone?)
Clones.
What is the age of your plants?
5 months 13 days.
How long have they been in the soil mixture they are in now?
6 weeks.
Were they in the same mixture when they were seedlings/smaller plant? If not, what mixture were they in before?
Yes the same mixture.
How Tall are the plants?
6- 8 ft from rim of pot.
What PHASE (seedling, vegetative or flower) are the plants in?
Flower
What Technique are you using? (SOG, SCROG etc)
NA
What size pots are you using? (Include how many subjects to pot)
20 gal grow bags.
What substrate/medium are you using? What brand of soil mixture are you using?(percentage of perlite, vermiculite...etc?)
sunshine # 4.
What brand Nutrient's are you using?
Fox farm.
How much of each nutrient are you using with how much
water? *Knowing the brand is very helpful*
3/4 cup Big Bloom, 1/2 cup Tiger bloom about 200ppm
How often are you feeding?
Watering about every 4 days. Fertilize every other watering
If flowering, when did you switch over to using Bloom nutrients?
First week.
What order are you mixing your nutrients? (example: veg nutes 1st, bloom 2nd ect)
Big Bloom, Tiger Bloom, Ph.
What is the TDS/EC/PPM of your nutrients used?
EC is 300, PPM 150.
What is the pH of the "RUN-OFF"?6.3.
How often are you testing pH/ppm/EC/TDS?
Every water and checking runoff every time.
What method of pH test was administered? Using Strips? pH pen?
Hanna 3 in 1 meter, ph tape, truncheon meter.
How often are you watering?
Every 4 days.
When was your last feeding and how often are you feeding?
today and 4 days ago. Feed with every other watering
What size bulb are you using?
Green House = Sunshine
How old is your bulbs?
N/A.
What is the distance to the canopy?
N/A.
What is your RH Factor? (Relative Humidity)
40-55%
What is the canopy temperature?
high of 90
What is the Day/Night Temp? (Include fluctuation range)
80-90 at day, and 60-70 at night.
What is the current Air Flow? (cfm etc.)
Thousands, several blowers and fans.
Is the fan blowing directly at plants?
Osciltating
Is the grow substrate constantly wet or moist?
No,.
Is your water HARD or SOFT?
Water is normal for all standards.
What water are you using? Reverse Osmosis (RO)? Tap?
Bottled? Well water? Distilled? Mineral Water?
Tap, bubbled for dechlorination
If using tap water, what is the ppm/EC/TDS of the water right out of the tap?(Only if you have a tds pen)
75 ppm.
If using RO,Distilled,mineral water, what is the ppm/EC/TDS without any additives?(Only if you have a tds pen)
Not using that.
Are you using water from a water softener?
No.
Has plant been recently pruned, cloned or pinched?
No.
Have any pest chemicals been used? If so what and when?
Yes, Azamax and a three in one oil for mites and mildew. Every 7 days
Are plant's infected with pest's?
A couple spidermites.

 

[RanchoDeluxe]

Dude, your plants are fairly dark green and I see some burnt tips. The problem is not occuring at the bottom of the plant first. The first part means it ain't N. The second part means it's not NPor K. Your plants actually look pretty good. Bare with me as I am an organic grower. Seems to me like you are likely lacking Mg and Ca. Your original tap ppm is very low. Use a cal/mag product and see what happens in a couple weeks. Next time you could add two tbs of dolomite lime to that sunshine mix and that would take care of cal/mag. Think about going organic and you can throw away that pH meter too!

 

[SeaMaiden]

Potassium appears to be the problem.

 

[RubeGoldberg]

you're feeding it a pretty complete set of nutrients, measure the pH of your runoff, you're probably a little locked out

 

[thefanfx]

hey m8

cut these leaves off , you don't need big leaves at the bottom , actually it's normal all these do die in some moment

i can see as well many of these bottom leaves are totally down looking which can be sign of over-watering or not enough watering it depends

some edges are brown which can be a symptom of burn ... do not feed them each time with nutrition , use once pure water and once nutrition mixture to avoid burns and overfeeding

but basically you have to help the plant to get rid of all these bottom leaves , they are heavy and there is no reason to keep them

 

[vukman]

What thefanfx is saying is what is very commonly practiced especially in flowering. It is the ever infamous 'lollypopping'...I just like to think I'm lifting the girls hem lines up a bit and giving them all mini skirts...

Including a pic of my grow so you can get a visual of what we are talking about.....

Cutting them up higher might even be better. All depends how much light is getting through. If the leaves are not getting light, they aren't doing much........

Good Luck

 

[TribalSeeds]

Hey dude, those are massive plants for little stems like that. It seems like there is something serious going on there. You cant be deficient using 1750ppm. Im going to suggest you flush and then cut your feed in half for a couple of days and see how it goes. 1750ppm is extreme. I just went through the same thing with plants that looked like they wanted more and more food until they overdosed. I cut back the feed in half and they are much darker now.
Get yourself some silica to toughen up those stems so that you can support some bud

 

[Indoor Odor]

Thank you very much guys. I appreciate you all taking the time to help me with your opinions.

RanchoDeluxe:I did add dolomite lime to the mix. Leaves are dark green but the tips are not burnt. Plant seems to be slowly drawing nutes from lower fan leaves.

SeaMaiden: I thought potassium might be the problem but I am giving it plenty of Fox Farm Big Bloom and Tiger Bloom.

thefanfx: I am usually with you on the pulling off lower fan leaves and "lollipopping". I have had experience with larger plants pulling nutes out of the lower fan leaves and the plant being just fine. Problem is, I have some smaller plants about 3 1/2 feet tall in 10 gallon pots that are showing some of the same problems.

vukman: Thanks for the pic, Those plants look nice, I am using a green house so I do have a lot more room to flower out those lower branches than I would indoor.

TribalSeeds: I think you have the best advice, The plants are rather large, I didn't have room to flower those on the last run so the vegged under fluorescent light for like 4 months. By the time I put them into flower they were almost 6 feet tall but spindly because of the weak lights. My best guess is that I have overdone the nutes and now the salt is built up so much that it is locking out nutes and the plant is taking them from lower leaves. I do use Protekt for silica.

Again, Thank you all for the help. More pics to today.

 

[cyat]

nute burn

 

[Indoor Odor]

Ok, Im at day 20 into flower and here are the updated pics. I did a flush with plain water ph 6.8 three days ago. They seem to be getting worse. I would love to hear your opinions. Thanks

 

[Indoor Odor]

three more pics

 

[Indoor Odor]

three more pics[URL=https://www.icmag.com/ic/picture.php?albumid=39101&pictureid=926958&thumb=1]View Image[/url] [URL=https://www.icmag.com/ic/picture.php?albumid=39101&pictureid=926959&thumb=1]View Image[/url] [URL=https://www.icmag.com/ic/picture.php?albumid=39101&pictureid=926960&thumb=1]View Image[/url]

You will notice that the plant does not have burnt tips but does show some yellow leaves on the bottom. If it was nute burn wouldn't the tips be burnt?

 

[TribalSeeds]

It seems like the top is fine and youre only noticing this on the bottom of the plant? Is it spreading? Removing the stuff at the bottom might make it easier for you to tell whats going on there.
Have you fed them since flushing? I would stick to a lighter E.C/PPM. Is the runoff still 1750ish?
The bottom of the plant would be the oldest and 8ft is a long way from the light. Ive never seen a 6 month old leaf... Im not sure they're supposed to last that long.

 

[TribalSeeds]

You will notice that the plant does not have burnt tips but does show some yellow leaves on the bottom. If it was nute burn wouldn't the tips be burnt?

Its possible to lock out other nutes with a toxicity without ever displaying tip burn.

 

[Rolldaddy]

You might be getting lockout with ppm's so high. Flush with 25 percent nutes instead of ph'ed water alone

 

[mudvaynefan]

First off, when my plants used to look like that, I was letting salt buildup, and not adjusting ph correctly. I grow my soil at 5.8-6, and I would never go to 6.8.

If I were you, I would get some Fox Farm Big Bloom, or make your own EWC tea. Water well, but do not drown your plants with it. Then the next 2 waterings should be water ph down to 5.8 or so, with CA MAG at 2tsp per gallon.


Once you have done that, which will take a week or so, you can then feed with your NPK of choice, but I would start half - 3/4 strength, but always have CA MAG in there, 2tsp per gallon. Good Luck.

 

[TribalSeeds]

You might be getting lockout with ppm's so high. Flush with 25 percent nutes instead of ph'ed water alone

What is the TDS/EC/PPM of your nutrients used?
EC is 300, PPM 150.

Im still unclear as to what "EC 300" is... But it sounds like a very light feed.

 

[Dnice]

flushing water should not be ph'ed. if you think its getting better by flushing then i'd say flush it again with just ro water. spray them with nutes water your giving - absorbs faster. also, try to balance your nutes if your not consistanly follow'ing a certain feedling chart.

 

[BongToke]

that looks like lockout to me I would maybe bump up the N on one of em and see if it makes her better or worse . Also i would top dress with dolomite lime to ensure the soil ph is balanced. I use up to 2 tbls/gallon of soil

Is your ph meter accurate? thats screwed me up before

like suggested before I would use some EWC tea good stuff cant really over do it either

Do you have other plants or are these everything and they all look like this?