What do you ph to?
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D
DHF
You must be using a smaller rez St3ve for ph to rise that fast over such a short period cuz larger rez`s with more volume buffer ph fluctuation and it`s not good ta chase ph every 2 days Bro.......Getchas a bigger holdin tank....it`ll make yas happy......but.....
What most folks don`t realize is that ph drift is "paramount" in importance for the plants to absorb micro`s and macro`s at different levels as they eat their nutes....
I`ve preached this from the time Heath taught me that as the plants eat , ppm`s drop and ph rises gradually in that circadian rythym of the plants suckin juice , usin it , and transpiring it out ftw with perfect environment and rootzone management.....so....
I always set my big ass rez`s in fast hydro with krusty`s and ebb and flow buckets @ 5.2 and swapped rez`s out when they got to lil over 6 a week later with dialed results.....
I`ve said this till I`m blue in the face that nuthin`s written in stone with coco and yas gotta develop and learn the rules to grow and prosper as in no 2 samples are the same and`ll haveta be diagnosed indvidually and not across the board.....
Calcium deficiencies show up as brown spots on the affected fanleaves compared to white spots that indicate the dreaded borg/spidermite affliction.....
Magnesium deficiencies show up as yellowing interveinal chlorosis , and although I took care of my plants with 1/2 tapwater , 1/2 R/O and 5 ml cal/mag plus , I was still just rolling the dice cuz I ran chem nutes and liquid cal/mag for insurance and coco`s cation exchange capacity....
I ran silicablast and never had a potassium deficiency from coco`s ability to hold onto K during flower , and only found out why recently as it`s not very well known , or rather I didn`t know.....anyways...
As plants eat their nutes in a recirculating system , ppm`s go down and ph rises gradually in a dialed setup.....bet on it....
Peace....DHF....
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I shoot for 6.0-6.5 never higher than 6.8. I also did a lot lower 5.5-6.0 for a long time, mostly due to using the earth juice line and saw a lot of deficiencies. My range seems to be the sweet spot for my line.
This is a great discussion. I'm wondering about the lower ph ranges in Coco myself , and voila here this is.
I'm wondering if I can use my hose to water plants in the backyard. Its rainwater that has been filtered with a 10 and 5 micron cotton filter, then thru a carbon filter, then UV sterilized. Comes out at 5.2 Ph.
Can I use it to water or flush without Ph adjustment?
When I do Pure coco or coco/perlite. I use 2 formulas.
One, I use Pureblend Pro at 15ml/gal with 5m MagiCal from Technaflora. Ph'd to 6.0..
Two I use the "recipe" 6ml Flora Micro 9ml Flora Bloom.I use the Kool bloom powder and follow the recipe. Ph'd 5.8-6.0 depending.
I'm wondering if I can use my hose to water plants in the backyard. Its rainwater that has been filtered with a 10 and 5 micron cotton filter, then thru a carbon filter, then UV sterilized. Comes out at 5.2 Ph.
Can I use it to water or flush without Ph adjustment?
When I do Pure coco or coco/perlite. I use 2 formulas.
One, I use Pureblend Pro at 15ml/gal with 5m MagiCal from Technaflora. Ph'd to 6.0..
Two I use the "recipe" 6ml Flora Micro 9ml Flora Bloom.I use the Kool bloom powder and follow the recipe. Ph'd 5.8-6.0 depending.
S
SeaMaiden
Wow, I have never bothered performing more filtration on the rainwater than rough mechanical. I used rainwater to the same success as RO/DI, and in fact I liked it better since all I had to do was collect it and pump it over. Mine was always in the 6 range, so I just used it as it was and pH'd down for coir feeds.
i think its good to fluctuate for maximum absorbtion of nutrients. i ph from 5.6 to 6. and flush at 6.7
Its more for the catchment tank. The filters are clogged with green slime and bacteria within 2-3 weeks. The landowner is not gonna replace the tank, way too expensive.I either filter it or move, with filters being the cheapest easiest way.
Me too usually. But this water here is 5.2 Ph.. A little low I feel.
I'm always adding ph up.Is a fact that we have acidic rain from the volcano. I'm gonna try hauling water from the pumping station, see how that works on a plant.
Word up.. Try 5.6 to 6.2 usually in the range of 5.8 to 6.2 and drift it... one day 5.8 next time 6.0 etc..
All you running at higher than 6.2 will really be surprised to see consistent meds pumping out... Then again.. I love all you that fuck around with your own ideas and screw what the experts like canna think and recommend. and PPM's at over a 1000.. love that tooo!!! hahahahahahahaha hahaha..
anyone ever wonder.... or even know... that canna changed their own recs from 5.5 to 6.2 to 5.8 to 6.2..
Wonder why?? maybe they just figured it was time to freshen up the web site.. and put some new things on it...
All you running at higher than 6.2 will really be surprised to see consistent meds pumping out... Then again.. I love all you that fuck around with your own ideas and screw what the experts like canna think and recommend. and PPM's at over a 1000.. love that tooo!!! hahahahahahahaha hahaha..
anyone ever wonder.... or even know... that canna changed their own recs from 5.5 to 6.2 to 5.8 to 6.2..
Wonder why?? maybe they just figured it was time to freshen up the web site.. and put some new things on it...
S
SeaMaiden
Instead of pH up, how about you drop a little dolomitic lime into the water column? You could also use crushed coral for this, it will achieve essentially the same thing--alkalinity (resistance to pH shift via carbonate action/reaction).
By "it must be laid down in plant tissues from the start" do you mean it is VIP to give the new coco several flushes with full strength mix of coco nutes ?
Very interesting info on the pH swing idea, now I want to try using some different pH- doses and see how they go with 5.8 then 6.0 or 6.2, also thanks to the people suggesting slightly higher pH in Bloom, also well worth checking out.
maybe they were not selling enough ph up/ ph down??
S
SeaMaiden
I don't use full strength, I go very, very low with the vegetative phase nutrients, and try to fill as many available sites as possible with Ca/Mg, several times the normal feeding dosage at least. Of course, this *is* because I use a coir that is not pre-charged (Botanicare 5kg bales).
It's important to remember that available Ca must be laid down from the get-go, and continuing, no matter what media is being used. In soil I amend early on and because it's rock dust, it takes a while for it all to be used up. It's generally re-amended annually in that form. In coir I pre-charge and alternate feedings of Ca and Mg. It was by doing this that I learned to tell the difference between Ca- and Mg-.
I'm going to try the higher pH in bloom, as well as allowing RH to drop lower than I typically like to during bloom as well.
It's important to remember that available Ca must be laid down from the get-go, and continuing, no matter what media is being used. In soil I amend early on and because it's rock dust, it takes a while for it all to be used up. It's generally re-amended annually in that form. In coir I pre-charge and alternate feedings of Ca and Mg. It was by doing this that I learned to tell the difference between Ca- and Mg-.
I'm going to try the higher pH in bloom, as well as allowing RH to drop lower than I typically like to during bloom as well.
nickdiaz209
Member
5.8-6.0
SeaMaiden, are you saying put dolomite in the catchment tank? I get all my water from the roof runoff. It goes to a 2500 gallon catchment tank, then pumped through the filters to the faucets. If I can put dolomite lime in the tank, I might consider doing so.
OR
Are you saying in my 4 gallon bucket of water put dolomite lime? I have done that before, then watered on the plants.
Can you go further with this thought please. I have plants that seem to want a low fertilizer charge, yet need Ca/Mg. Why is this?
A
ak-51
100% coco medium, blumat drippers
6.0-6.1
6.0-6.1
S
SeaMaiden
First, good on you for making use of all that water! That is our goal here at home, we're figuring it can easily add up to 20,000gals or so during a typical winter.
Catchment tank or mixing bucket is either/or, but I personally would lean towards only adding it when and where you need it, because you'll have to filter it very well to get that CaMg(CO3)2 back out.
While dolomitic lime isn't immediately soluble, it does go into solution. This is why it's used in aquatics for those organisms that require higher pH values such as African cichlids and saltwater animals (African rift lake pH values are typically above 8, with Lake Victoria hitting into the 9s, saltwater is typically around 8.2-8.4), so it keeps the water buffered up. It also gives Ca to hermatypic (reef building) organisms.
When I first began growing in coir I did a lot of reading and querying. During that time I was told that coir has the propensity to essentially ADSORB Ca and Mg, and so in order to prevent those minerals from first being adsorbed by the coir instead of being readily available to the plants, one should basically load up the coir's adsorption sites with Ca and Mg. That leaves what you're feeding as available to the plants.
Now! I haven't teased apart Ca from Mg in loading up coir, I just use a Cal-Mag product most often, but next time I have to expand a bale I think I'm going to try using *just* Ca and see what happens. I say this because I have separated out the Ca and Mg from feeds and have observed that most plants are in fact Ca whores, NOT Ca/Mg whores. Also, because Mg- is so easily corrected, it seems to me that it might be better to load up those sites with the far less easily translocated Ca.
Does that make sense?
I also want to point out that DHF is one of the people who has spent the most time advising me, and whose advice has proved the most valuable with specific regard to indoor coco coir cultivation methods.
Everyone yelling out numbers without any reference to what type of nute/supplement/additive mix they're using.
You guys realize that's not helpful, right? LOL
All you can basically get from this thread is....
"Depending on your nutes, plants and personal setup".... "Your 'optimal' starting pH can range anywhere from 5.5 to 6.5."
So... your milage may vary.
Stay Safe!
Rolling on my first grow and comparing pre and post feed / water PPM / PH levels but couldn't figure out why my PH was consistently rising. This answered that question, thanks!
I started at 5.8 using dyna grow nutes and a combo of rain / tap water. I'm using hempy buckets, so when I water/feed, I collect a sample of the runoff to compare PPM's / PH, and the PH is always higher than the 5.8 that I use to feed/water.
Since the PH is going to rise in the coco anyway, I figured I might as well go lower on the initial PH to 5.5 to give the plants more of a chance to suck up those nutes that are available at those lower levels. Even at 5.5 PH, runoff still shows up at the 6.1 or higher PH levels.
Plants don't seem to have a problem with the lower starting PH, so we'll see.
