PM halfway in flower, round 2

[sprinkl]

This is my fifth time growing indoors and the second one in a row that is being affected by PM.


400W HPS, 4 plants in soil, 1x1m tent, outtake fan, passive intake

My plants started having it a week ago, after I watered them a lot a few times.
They still have 3-4 weeks to go. It's spreading fast on two plants, C99hybrid and outdoor grapefruit by FMS. Fast Neville's haze and Kandy Kush x Skunk are mostly unaffected. Previous grow it spread really fast on the C99H I had, had to cut it early. Most of them had it bad in veg but a sulphur based spray got rid of it easily, then it returned in flower. Eventually all plants succumbed but none had to be cut early, frost leaves were mostly left alone and a tight trim removed all of it.

The only thing I did really different last two grows is I don't have an extra fan to blow air around. My intake is pretty powerful and causes the leaves to move, so I thought.
I've already got PM now and I don't think a fan will prevent it from spreading further. It might even increase it as the spores get blown around more.
I will install the fan again though as the environment now is obviously too PM friendly.
I already keep the watering to a minimum now but I'm afraid drying them out too much might make it worse.

Now, what I need to do with the two infected plants... If I had a bigger number of healthy plants I'd probably thrash them right away but in this situation it would cut my yield in half.
I've just been removing infected leaves until now but that doesn't stop the mold from spreading. As long as it is able to grow on the leaves it will.
So I will spray my plants against the mold. I want it to be organic and safe to consume, so I did some google searching. I read baking soda works because it makes the environment too basic for the PM to grow. Milk works or doesn't works, possibly due to the enzymes, the basicity or the calcium. I also read somewhere that the right micronutrients can help the plant defend itsself better.
I'm going to make a milk/calcium/kelp/water mix and spray it on the two plants that are infected. The other two seem to be pretty resistant, some spots here and there where they touch the infected ones. I'm thinking they don't need to be sprayed unless it's really needed.

- That was yesterday, I sprayed all four this morning after lights went out. I also added a bit of molasses and enzymes so it's a milk/calcium/kelp/molasses/enzymes/water mix. I'll repeat it in 2 or 3 days. I shook the plants as well as I could and installed the fan.
Is the fan thing a good idea, or will it make it worse?
Is the mix a good idea? Doesn't the basicity hurt the leaves? Won't the molasses make it more acidic?
Do I need to spray the plants with clean water afterwards? Immediately each time I spray or after a week, when I sprayed with the mix a few times?
Does anybody have experience with spraying milk mixes on their plants?

A lot of questions and rambling, but please help me, all input and ideas are welcome.
I really hope this works, this grow looked so promising a week ago!

 

[shredGnar]

I've never had the mildew but from what I hear Eagle 20 is the way to go..

 

[silver hawaiian]

At this point, I think almost everyone here would agree that Eagle20 is a no-no.

How bad is it? Photos would help...

What's your exhaust fan push? How many CFM? How big is the room? (cubic feet) You want to be exchanging that air 2x a minute, ..

What's humidity like? Lights on? Lights off? Big swings in RH can lead to the PM getting a foothold..

There are a lot of things you can do to keep it at bay, .. You're on-track with wanting to create an environment that's not conducive to the spores taking hold/living, usually via pH. That can be done with milk, baking soda, Greencure, pH up, ProTeKt, ..

IME, at this point, all you can do is manage it, .. Between runs, I'd wipe down everything imaginable with bleach water, and I'd also burn some sulfer in the space..

Photos would help, but that's about the best general advice I can give.. PM is a motherfucker.

 

[puff adder]

You can use hydrogen peroxide to spot spray any PM patches. You can use the 3% stuff you get at the store, put it in a spray bottle and spray away.

I got PM in flowering (actually had it in veg but didn't take it seriously) and what worked for me was the Zone/Saturator combo.

There's a thread here about it (it's a sticky I think, otherise do a search), it's safe to use halfway in flower. What worked for me was 3 to 5 sprayings a day apart, it works, but you need to do multiple sprayings closely spaced. Zone/Saturator, I think it was 2ml/gal Zone and Saturator at the recomended rate on the bottle (I think 240ml/gal) and spray everything heavily, then again every day or every other day 3 or 4 more times and that's what got the PM to recede for me.

 

[SeaMaiden]

OxiDate, you can dip with it. You can also dip using H2O2.

 

[Weird]

eagle20 is not appropriate this far into flower

from another thread i responded to

https://www.icmag.com/ic/showpost.php?p=5151149&postcount=9

those are good suggestions but you might need more than that to be successful

first

prune off infected leaves, put them into a bucket with high ph water as you cut them off so the spores are neutralized

second

if you can, take the plants out of the room, clean it top to bottom with 10% bleach

air conditioners, fans, filters, ducts and the like are places it my hide so make sure you do your best to clean them.

now I suggest a 3 phase approach to foliars and i will expalin what i use

first i use green cure. I have tried baking soda, peroxide, milk and dont feel they are ass effective. I also have used duthc master zone which is a chlorine type product. I found it burned the plants so I did not use it again.

i did find the maximum dose of green cure can turn the hairs on your plant brown, this may not happen at low dosages, but higher dosages also are better at eradication

you need to saturate them with the green cure

what the green cure is doing is raising the ph dramatically.

PM dies when it is exposed to high PH

be careful to cover your containers, rez, rootzone, etc because you dotn want high ph run off getting into your root zone

green cure is NOT SYSTEMIC so YOU MUST SATURATE THE WHOLE OF THE PLANT

this is were failure with green cure will mostly likely occur application

after "cleaning" the plants with green cure and letting them cycle a bit 16-24 hours i use something like serenade. Serenade is Bacillus subtilis which is effective but the source actually smells and makes the plant smell

i really liked hydro guard but it was replaced with aqua shield which is a better product

you can use it foliarly and use it in your feed an inoculate your rhizoshere with it. if its in your root system you are far less likely to get PM as it actually lends to plant disease resistance

now this folair is pretty benign to everything but the PM. I also add (2 ml) a small amount of sm-90 (not it will not kill benies)

there are some new products with the same and possibly better bacteria you might also want to consider

ACTINOVATE FUNGICIDE (Grey mold, Root Rot, Damping off, Powdery Mildew )
https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=239283

now even though its a bacterial foliar remember its at a PH that mildew can grow in

so folair 15 minutes before lights on wiht it after the green cure cycle so they arent saturated for a prolonged time

now for the third step, SILICA

yeah silica foliar is bad ass,

A) it boosts PH so you will be spraying them with high PH water which kills PM (which should be mostly eliminated at this point)

B) it increase the cell wall thickness so PM cant permeate the cell wall with its hyphea (sp*?)

C) its a good source of potassium so it will act as a P booster

you can continue silica foliars for a week or so as well as presenting bacteria to the root zone till the end of flower

I also scrubbed my intake with ozone to eliminate re exposure from an outside source

 

[sprinkl]

Ok thanks all for your input guys!
Made me a lot more confident that it might actually work
And it seemed to have! The worst plant seems mostly cured, the plant that got it in the first place got a bad second attack and the other two seem fully cured. A few days after the first application the mold seemed gone, just some bleached spots were it was.
I think I waited too long for the second spray(didn't have a moment to spray after lights went out) and completely shutting down the fan because it made too much noise wasn't a good idea either. I set it to a lower setting now, and sprayed again yesterday.
I was afraid that the milk would start smelling but the plants don't smell weird at all.
Still do you think I need to spray with clean water after the treatment - I think I'll spray once more - or not? I'm still worried that the spray might give off a different taste this late in flower.

Thanks!

 

[SeaMaiden]

If you do it, how about you simply dip/wash the plants at harvest? PM needs live plant tissues, not dead, so at harvest it's not an issue. I've done it using OxiDate. I've also done it using Greencure and that left a soapy flavor.

 

[badmf]

Sulfer burner will do it as well. SM is right lose it at the finish. GC has a nasty taste and effects burn imo. I use it Od as a regular.

 

[sprinkl]

I think some plants may be done in 2 weeks, I didn't think sulfurburners are an option during flower?
Getting rid of PM at harvest, and leave my plants untreated? PM keeps spreading and last grow it got really up close with my buds, had to trim really tight, had to throw some nugs away and the whole trimming session was just a pain in the ass, in the end you can't see difference between mold and trichomes...

Right now it seems to be gone on all my plants except my Outdoor Grapefruit. I'm gonna pull the infected leaves before I spray next time.

 

[badmf]

Tip; Use Sporicidin to kill spores after the grow then sterilize the room before starting again , obvious rh? Good Luck! I also use /////////green /cure but only make as much as you will use at one time it doesn't keep! As mentioned cover all areas and undersides including ducts and fan blades as spores will re-distribute and when conditions are right ...back again!

 

[420mike]

I use a product called Oxydate which is a concentrated hydrogen peroxide. It never fails.

 

[SeaMaiden]

Mike, I've seen it fail, and burn, once. Root aphid-infested plants that just could NOT fight off the PM. The OxiDate burned the shit out of the plants, too. Only that one time I experienced that.

 

[420mike]

Mike, I've seen it fail, and burn, once. Root aphid-infested plants that just could NOT fight off the PM. The OxiDate burned the shit out of the plants, too. Only that one time I experienced that.

WOW!! Never seen that. I am sure its possible though if the plant is in a weakened state.

 

[SeaMaiden]

Root aphids really fuck the grow. Those plants and the clones made from them never really recovered and failed to thrive.

 

[sprinkl]

Did i mention i had root bugs? Bunch of flying litlle critters, not as bad as i had it before though.
There definitely seems to be a connection. I also found out there were seriously wet walls in the room the tent was in, maybe that facilitated the moldgrowth as well.
Also the room was generally too cold, 16-18 degrees celcius.
Not a good grow, .45gpw and 3/4 plants showed nanners, all sterile tho, pollinated them my damn self by handling males.. Ugh.
Mold seemed to be in control after 2 decent sprays with milk, calcium and seaweed. Also outdoors this seemed to work well. Didnt seem to affect the final taste either.

 

[SeaMaiden]

It was when formerly ROCK SOLID genetics hermied on me that finally convinced me that those fungus gnats weren't fungus gnats, but were, in fact, root aphids.

 

[420mike]

Did i mention i had root bugs? Bunch of flying litlle critters, not as bad as i had it before though.
There definitely seems to be a connection. I also found out there were seriously wet walls in the room the tent was in, maybe that facilitated the moldgrowth as well.
Also the room was generally too cold, 16-18 degrees celcius.
Not a good grow, .45gpw and 3/4 plants showed nanners, all sterile tho, pollinated them my damn self by handling males.. Ugh.
Mold seemed to be in control after 2 decent sprays with milk, calcium and seaweed. Also outdoors this seemed to work well. Didnt seem to affect the final taste either.

Controlling that environment is key. PM and other pests and pathogens are just waiting for a chink in the environmental armor to get in and ruin your days.