Weird PH Rise. Help please.

[inreplyavalon]

Hiya folks. Been in Coco for a long long time. The only problem i have never had is a PH problem. Well that is no longer the case!

I am in 1 gallon containers of pure botanicare coco. Same coco i have always used. I am using a beneficial fungus called Met 52 which is grown on Rice which is added to the coco to combat root aphids. Every drop of water these plants get is ph'd to 5.8-6.0. Same as always.

What tipped me off is that the plants were locked up and overfed after feeding them .5 ec food a few times. I flushed them and they recovered and then a week later they were locked out again. Never seen anything like it when feeding at such a low strength. Checked my runoff PH and its around 7+ .

My theory is that the RICE mixed into the soil, is decomposing and raising the PH? Though i have no science to back that up. Anyone have any insights?

Cheers big ears

 

[Midnight]

If the rice mix is all you have changed then that is what is causing it. I'd re pot them into some coco that does not have the rice mix.

 

[dansbuds]

If the rice mix is the only variable that has changed .... then yeah i'd say ditch it & repot .

 

[inreplyavalon]

I hear you guys/girls. The issue is that i used the Rice/met52 last round with no issues. I have used a touch more this time though.

The stuff decomposes and i am wondering if anyone knows how decomposing organic matter in a medium such as coco, effects PH?

 

[bignugs]

I hear you guys/girls. The issue is that i used the Rice/met52 last round with no issues. I have used a touch more this time though.

The stuff decomposes and i am wondering if anyone knows how decomposing organic matter in a medium such as coco, effects PH?

I think the rice should be decomposed first and added to coco like compost. Now their are rice hulls that can be added at any time.
Weather this has anything to do with why your PH is rising, I don't know but, is possible.

 

[inreplyavalon]

I am stumped. I transplanted from 1 to 3 g containers and the PH is high again a few weeks later.

What Raises PH In Coco? What are some chemical reactions?

This is weird as all hell, I fed today with 5.0ph with a good solid 100% runoff, and the Ph out the bottom was 6.4. That makes me think the PH in the coco is in the 7's.

Thoughts folks?

 

[wildgrow]

Hmmm..? Truthfully, I really dont know much about coco (Im in dirt), but I think I would try flushing again and ph my runoff. I would probably do it 2 more times. If I didnt see ph lowering, then Id probably be screwed. Because I dont know much about coco. Hope it works out for you.

 

[PoopyTeaBags]

that or your letting your coco dry out causeing ph to raise as salts form. or your mix is not stable ph but if its what you alwasy used it should be that.

 

[PoopyTeaBags]

coco can be VERY picky on ph.. if your not monotoring the ph run off you can fuck yourself.. the pot will stick to a ph and itll be hard to change it... my advice is to flush with 500ppm water at 5.4 ph until the runoff is about 6.0 to 6.2.... you do this a couple times and you should be able to get the pot to stablize back at the 5.8 ph range.


ive fought this many times... it usually happens when i let the coco dry out and dont consitently monitor the runoff.. just keep on flushing at a semi low ph but still in range(no more then 5.4) and itll gradually come down... drying out and not enough runoff are the main reason this happens.

 

[firehound]

In the mean time do same with any coco your not using. Im no expert but its called resetting the medium. That way it will be ready when you need it.

 

[inreplyavalon]

Thanks for sharing your thoughts firehound and wildgrow. sharing is caring

coco can be VERY picky on ph.. if your not monotoring the ph run off you can fuck yourself.. the pot will stick to a ph and itll be hard to change it... my advice is to flush with 500ppm water at 5.4 ph until the runoff is about 6.0 to 6.2.... you do this a couple times and you should be able to get the pot to stablize back at the 5.8 ph range.


ive fought this many times... it usually happens when i let the coco dry out and dont consitently monitor the runoff.. just keep on flushing at a semi low ph but still in range(no more then 5.4) and itll gradually come down... drying out and not enough runoff are the main reason this happens.

Poopy thanks for sharing your thoughts. Its certainly possible that over the course of the 8 week veg they dried out a bit, and definitely are often watered to no runoff. Strange thing is i have been doing this for quite a while. I did recently switch back to PBP from GH flora, but never had the problem back when i used to use the PBP. Though things change and maybe i did have the problem back then and never noticed or diagnosed it.
For now i have been feeding with lots of runoff right around 5.0 ph and my runoff coming out is right around 6.1-6.2
Plants look decent but definitely struggling uptaking. Only on week 2 of flower so things may straighten out. Time will tell.

 

[firehound]

Keep on growin it.

 

[dansbuds]

This is weird !!! i had a salts build up problem from letting them sit in thier runoff & where my PPM's were in the 3000 range & higher ... my PH wasn't over 6.4 in any pot . i flushed till runoff was equal with what i was putting in & my plants came back & flourished after that . i'm not sure how to advize you on this problem . but i will be watching to see what you figure out . good luck man

 

[HueJass]

How's the met working for you? Don't you only use like a few grains of rice per gallon of coco? Maybe adding an enzyme if you aren't currently using one might help.

I saw under 5 RA's all winter in my space, but now that it is starting to warm up a bit I've seen 3 over the last couple of days. They are little basterids. I hate them.

 

[roll it large]

Thats wierd thats way off the coco's natural buffing ph of the medium are you using coco bales or bagged stuff

Its possible but coco does go out of date after 2 yrs and may be causing your problems mate

I will find the article for you and post it here


Peace

 

[bignugs]

For now i have been feeding with lots of runoff right around 5.0 ph and my runoff coming out is right around 6.1-6.2
Plants look decent but definitely struggling uptaking. Only on week 2 of flower so things may straighten out. Time will tell.

Runoff ph is not that acurate in my opinion but, a place to start. Checking the ph of the medium is more accurate.

Assuming the 6.1-6.2 runoff your getting is accurate then your at the top of the charts for locking out phosphorus. Not enough phosphorus can slow down flowering.
Sounds like this is what is happening and I would get the ph between 5.8-6.0....

 

[inreplyavalon]

WEIRDNESS CONTINUES

WEIRDNESS CONTINUES

So i decided after trying for a few weeks to lower my runoff PH number that i should take a proper medium test. So i dug out some coco and put it in a cup of distilled water. 1-4 ratio coco to water. I did this two separate times. Turns out that the PH reading in the "slurry" was 5.8 in one and 5.9 in the other. I then fed those same plants with 5.8 PH'd food and the runoff PH was 6.5. My best guess why is as follows. I have been trying to lower the PH runoff for at least two weeks and have been feeding at 5.0 PH to try and bring the PH down.
Maybe a nutrient that is only available at a high PH was being locked out due to my feeding at 5.0. When i water heavily to runoff and measure the PH, maybe that locked out nutrient is coming out the bottom and effecting the runoff PH? Any chance this is possible?



My plants have seemed to really get worse the last couple days. I am done monitoring the runoff and will just be sure i am feeding at 5.8 and let it play out how it wants to. Unless someone hops in this thread and gives me a better idea of what is going on. I'll definitely update as to my progress, but i am on week 3.5 and have way more yellow than i should.

Have a good one y'all.

Thanks Dansbuds, nice to see you around.

Huejass- i am using a combo of Merit and the Met52. Something is working. I struggled with aphids for half a year and it was not until i discovered them that i was able to grow furry roots again.

Roll it large- I just read on a bag of loose botanicare cocogro to find the expiration date stamped on package. I inspected the entire thing and could not find a date anywhere.

bignugs you are correct about the inaccuracy of runoff readings. See above where i detail my finding.

 

[inreplyavalon]

IGNORE YOUR RUNOFF PH. I swear i learned that many mons ago but guess i forgot...DOH! Or never had high runoff. In either case, when i fed below my standard 5.7-6.0, with the intention of raising the runoff PH, i ended up depriving my plants of nutrients.
After seeing their health deteriorate i stuck some coco from a pot and put it into a cup full of distilled water and then measured the pH a fewminutes later. 5.9
So i started feeding them 5.8 PH, ignoring the runoff, and now have a healthy garden in the middle of week 5.

Thanks and have a lovely life

 

[Mountain High]

Good to hear it's all dialed in now.