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Angel Raich, Cancer Patient, Kicked Out Of Hospital For Using Medical Marijuana

Weird

3rd-Eye Jedi
Veteran
all i can say is wtf

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/03/14/angel-raich_n_1342586.html

Angel Raich is busy dying. The famous marijuana activist -- who took the federal government to the Supreme Court of the United States for the right to use medical cannabis -- was, earlier this year diagnosed with an inoperable terminal brain tumor, a condition that causes frequent seizures as well as constant pain and headaches.



Told by her doctors at the University of California-San Francisco that she should prepare to die, that's what Raich, 46, is doing, one day at a time -- with purpose as well as dignity.



Except for Monday night, when she was summarily removed from the hospital at UCSF's Parnassus campus for using marijuana, according to NBC Bay Area -- which showed up for an interview that was cut short when Raich had a seizure and had to be rushed to a (different) hospital.


Now might be a good time to mention UCSF also happens to be one of the nation's teaching hospitals that researches marijuana's efficacy in treating cancer and pain.



Raich has lived with her brain tumor for some time, but earlier this year she was diagnosed with radiation necrosis, a complication from radiotherapy.



Details are scant, but it appears Raich was at UCSF for tests and was using marijuana via a vaporizer at the Parnassus campus when someone -- a doctor or a pharmacist -- took offense, and told Raich that they'd "call the Feds" unless she stopped using marijuana.


"The pharmacist said, you can't use cannabis in this hospital," Raich told the television station. "That's a death sentence."
Berkeley-based Dr. Frank Lucido, Raich's primary care physician, says that Raich needs to use marijuana every two waking hours, and denying her the drug amounts to "malpractice," according to a statement on Raich's website. "Angel will suffer imminent harm without access to cannabis."



Television viewers saw exactly what Lucido is talking about, as Raich suffered a seizure during her brief interview with NBC. Raich was then taken to St. Mary's Hospital on Stanyan Street, according to NBC.



In a statement, UCSF said that their hospital is "a smoke-free campus and this includes medical marijuana."
"Any particles from vapor and odor could have an impact on other patients and hospital employees," the statement read. "Under federal and state law, a physician is at legal risk related to any activity that could be construed as prescribing medical marijuana to a patient."
Raich gained national fame as the medical marijuana patient who took the federal government to the United States Supreme Court for the right to use medical marijuana. Her husband at the time, Oakland-based attorney Robert Raich, was one of the attorneys who argued that state law should supplant federal law, and that seriously ill Californians such as Raich have rights under the Constitution to use marijuana for medical purposes.



The Rehnquist Court disagreed, with the majority saying that the Commerce Clause gives Congress the right to ban marijuana for medical use, state law be damned. Justices Sandra Day O'Connor and Clarence Thomas joined Rehnquist, who died later that year, in supporting Raich.


Raich sued the government after DEA agents raided in 2002 a Butte County residence that housed six pot plants that provided Raich with her medicine.


It's worth mentioning that Raich is currently involved in yet another Supreme Court case, though not one you might expect. Raich filed an amicus brief in support of the lawsuit filed by the state of Florida which seeks to overturn Obamacare. Oral arguments in that case, Florida v. United States Department of Health and Human Services, are scheduled to begin later this month.



Details on Raich's current condition, and exactly what happened at UCSF were not available as of Tuesday. We'll update this post as soon as we know more.
Take a look at a video report of Raich's situation below, courtesy of NBC Bay Area:
 

jd4083

Active member
Veteran
"Any particles from vapor and odor could have an impact on other patients and hospital employees," the statement read. "Under federal and state law, a physician is at legal risk related to any activity that could be construed as prescribing medical marijuana to a patient."

Sounds fair to me... At the risk of sounding callous, it doesn't matter how bad off she is, that does not give her the right to blow smoke (or vapor, in this case) in a hospital. That is utterly ridiculous and it's this kind of bullshit apologist crap that makes people in the real world look at our little "movement" and laugh...
 

Weird

3rd-Eye Jedi
Veteran
i debate that

i see it as evident bias

cannabis is less toxic than water and these were vapors, but even so

if her vaporizer posed a risk was was she simply not asked to discontinue it instead of being kicked out?

she wasn't breaking law, if she is a sanctioned medical patient, she was exercising her right to use medicine, which was medically granted

the same professionals that gave her the right to use the medicine punished her for using it

she is not qualified to be a physician, so she is trusting them

its not outrageous for a dying cancer patient to want to use their choice of medicine especially when its legal

but i still think the pharmacist has no clinical evidence that the vapor is dangerous to others

and imho that is fear based propaganda used to justify the abuse of a person who was "following" dr's orders
 

jd4083

Active member
Veteran
i debate that

i see it as evident bias

cannabis is less toxic than water and these were vapors, but even so

if her vaporizer posed a risk was was she simply not asked to discontinue it instead of being kicked out?

she wasn't breaking law, if she is a sanctioned medical patient, she was exercising her right to use medicine, which was medically granted

the same professionals that gave her the right to use the medicine punished her for using it

she is not qualified to be a physician, so she is trusting them

its not outrageous for a dying cancer patient to want to use their choice of medicine especially when its legal

but i still think the pharmacist has no clinical evidence that the vapor is dangerous to others

and imho that is fear based propaganda used to justify the abuse of a person who was "following" dr's orders

I appreciate your position here but I don't agree. Firing up some herb in a hospital is just absurd, whether it was vapor or not, and regardless of how innocuous it may or may not be. I am quite sure that had they not "kicked her out" the hospital and perhaps the doctors themselves would have faced some pretty serious liability.

We can agree to disagree. I see it from her perspective (well, as much as I can without having been through what she has anyways) and I don't really blame her for seeking relief, but the way that it was done was pretty dumb, frankly. Just my $.02, thank you for actually responding in an adult manner instead of mudslinging like most others here would have in that scenario...it is much appreciated.
 

Weird

3rd-Eye Jedi
Veteran
i want to argue the second hand vapor based on the fact that i don't believe it to have toxins but then I had to consider all things aside even if the vapor is lacking any toxins could second hand vapor still be active

could some one get a contact high from it?

idk food for thought, but I still think there should have been an alternative to her being ejected from the hospital

apparently her husband is a lawyer, so there may have been a strategy behind it as well

we will see what happens only time will tell
 

jd4083

Active member
Veteran
i want to argue the second hand vapor based on the fact that i don't believe it to have toxins but then I had to consider all things aside even if the vapor is lacking any toxins could second hand vapor still be active

could some one get a contact high from it?

idk food for thought, but I still think there should have been an alternative to her being ejected from the hospital

apparently her husband is a lawyer, so there may have been a strategy behind it as well

we will see what happens only time will tell

I would agree that any harmful effects to others in the hospital would likely be negligible, but then, I'm not a doctor and I don't have any data to support that...totally conjecture on my part. As for the vapor still being active and possibly getting somebody a "contact buzz," I also don't know about that for sure, so I won't even comment.

I'm pretty sure that the legal issue was the one the hospital had in mind, not the health issue.
 

pearlemae

May your race always be in your favor
Veteran
My oldest bro has been diagnosed with a virulent form of leukemia brought on by radiation therapy for a different cancer three years ago. Most cancer patients in hospitals undergoing chemo have zero immunity to out side germs or substances. He wasn't even allowed live flowers in his room, much less smoke or vapors. What we did was have him eat a veg glycerin oil. Smoking in the hosp may affect many more people than her. I have to side with the hosp on this one.
 

Weird

3rd-Eye Jedi
Veteran
My oldest bro has been diagnosed with a virulent form of leukemia brought on by radiation therapy for a different cancer three years ago. Most cancer patients in hospitals undergoing chemo have zero immunity to out side germs or substances. He wasn't even allowed live flowers in his room, much less smoke or vapors. What we did was have him eat a veg glycerin oil. Smoking in the hosp may affect many more people than her. I have to side with the hosp on this one.

every picture tells a story don't it

a valid perspective that i cant argue that thanks for the contribution

since its a legal med they in the course of her treatment they may still have obligations as such

interesting her doctors did not blow the whistle but a pharmacist

too many details are unclear

did she do it with the intention to cause liability so she could legally assert her rights for future cannabis users?

not to contaminate others but to have safe access to medicine while in a public facility

maybe she just wanted to alleviate a lil suffering from the brain tumor and didnt want medicines that alter her wherewithal

i was my mother proxy and caretaker when she was dying of pancreatic cancer, at the end she was on alto of opiates

the woman i knew and loved died died well before the cancer took thanks to those drugs so i feel very strongly in regards to having pot as an accessible alternative

but not another persons expense
 

softyellowlight

Active member
What a completely fucking ridiculous strawman, "second-hand vapor." So instead of evicting her from what's supposed to be a place of healing, where they could have simply said "Okay, go do that outside of the building," they decided to institute a policy of torture directly in opposition to the Hippocratic oath? Man, if you're siding with exactly what the hospital did, I _really_ cannot understand your thought process.

This is a heartbreaking story. I'm so glad I'm fortunate enough to be able to work and make money to donate to the ACLU.
 
G

guest8905

I hope and assume someone with a huge heart will take her in and give her the dignity she deserves at this time in her life.
 

jd4083

Active member
Veteran
What a completely fucking ridiculous strawman, "second-hand vapor." So instead of evicting her from what's supposed to be a place of healing, where they could have simply said "Okay, go do that outside of the building," they decided to institute a policy of torture directly in opposition to the Hippocratic oath? Man, if you're siding with exactly what the hospital did, I _really_ cannot understand your thought process.

This is a heartbreaking story. I'm so glad I'm fortunate enough to be able to work and make money to donate to the ACLU.

Not sure if you're speaking directly to me, as I'm the only person thus far in the thread to say anything that even remotely resembles "siding with the hospital," but once again...devil's advocate here. I'm looking at it from both sides based upon the information presented here and I'm simply saying that I can understand the hospital's position because, to a layman, I can certainly see the liability aspect there.

Also...not to add insult to injury, but what you described is not at all a "strawman" argument.
 

softyellowlight

Active member
I understand you're playing devil's advocate. I should have been clear I'm upset at the hospital's specific actions, not in you putting voice to what they've done. But no, I don't actually believe second-hand smoke/vapor can be any more dangerous than the smog we already deal with outdoors.

But how is positing harm from second-hand whatever not a strawman?
 
S

SeaMaiden

I disagree with the hospital's position here.

First, it's a teaching hospital. I expect such a hospital to automatically be more open and receptive to methods of treatment outside the norm.

Second, this particular hospital is supposed to be known for their advocacy of cannabis. She was offered no alternative as a condition to remain in the hospital for the required testing other than complete and total abstinence.

Third, there are ways to mitigate issues with combustion-based methods of ingestion (she may not be able to easily hold anything down, or perhaps she's like me and doesn't find the same kind of relief, or quickness of relief, with any kind of edible), such as seclusion or sequestration, having the ingestion occur out of doors (re-read their smoking policy, it's inclusive of all spaces, irrespective of air flow) and filtration.

It is my opinion that in this instance the hospital has failed. It is time their policy be adjusted so that others in her position and condition may find merciful relief.
 

trichrider

Kiss My Ring
Veteran
a teaching hospital advocating advancement or at the least acceptance of medical marijuana should have wards dedicated to that purpose...with students learning the truth about our wonderous cannabis plant.
of course this would be counterproductive to them continuing the poisoning of seriously ill or terminal patients with chemo and radiation...and bottom line.
"First Do No Harm" seems a forgotten ethos.
 

nugghead

Member
She was vaping, not combusting. Plenty of medications are delivered as vapor in the hospital, albuterol being the most common, but there are many others. Hospitals have very sophisticated ventilation and scrubber systems; they have negative pressure rooms, rooms to isolate people who are peeing and/or exhaling radioactive material, and many other ways of containment. If they had seen fit to, they could easily have found a way that she receive her medication.

Those of you who are saying that it's 'absurd' for a medical patient to have their medical mj in the hospital: recall what a hospital is for, it's a place for sick people to receive their treatments. If you really believe the stuff is medication, it has to be available where sick people can get it. Hospitals normally go to great lengths to ensure that patients can get their usual medications while hospitalized.
 

FRIENDinDEED

A FRIEND WITH WEED IS A . . .
Veteran
Quote:
"Any particles from vapor and odor could have an impact on other patients and hospital employees," the statement read. "Under federal and state law, a physician is at legal risk related to any activity that could be construed as prescribing medical marijuana to a patient."

Sounds fair to me... At the risk of sounding callous, it doesn't matter how bad off she is, that does not give her the right to blow smoke (or vapor, in this case) in a hospital. That is utterly ridiculous and it's this kind of bullshit apologist crap that makes people in the real world look at our little "movement" and laugh...

i have to agree aswell, there are other ppl to consider when your in a hospital. from this point of view if you cant think about the other ppl that are in the hospital that could be directly affected by what you do then it just gonna have to be one of those " it is what it is" situations.

patients on O2, respiratory patients and many if not any others could be affected by that environment. knowing what we know about cannabis, even at the laymans level, we all know that she could have dosed her self in a timely manner with edibles, there was no need to burn or vaporize anything.

if it were one of my patients in the next bed i would have said something as well since its not fair to the other person to be in that environment.

i was a PCA/PCT now im studying to become a RN. as a pca i would have told her out that the hospital would frown on such a thing and ask her to think about the other ppl in the room. as a RN you have an unsworn duty to defend your patients so i know i would have been even more animate about it. but whether it was the pharmacist or someone else, anyone would have said something to either the patient about vaporizing and would have warned someone else in charge about it.

having to already deal with the asshats that want to come to the hospital and smoke cigs in the rooms/bathrooms (which will baffle me to no end how someone could think to do that at all) vaping, within the hospital, just is not a good idea overall.

when you go to the hospital youll be met with a barrage of medications. ive always opted out of them and went home to medicate with my cannabis and other homeopathic methods and plants
 
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FRIENDinDEED

A FRIEND WITH WEED IS A . . .
Veteran
i used to work in a teaching hospital and none of it works the way you would think. first off, the way "we" cannabis advocates see the world is somewhat of a utopian view of things which is understandable considering that what we do is seen in such a discontented light.

if it were a hospital that sought to teach the advancements of homeopathic medicines and homeopathic medical practices then it would be feasible to question why would someone be kicked out of the facility for utilizing something as homeopathic as cannabis but that can never be the case pertaining to the teaching hospitals of today that are concerned with the advancement of "modern medicine practices".

yes an individual doctor in the privacy of their own office can prescribe medicinal cannabis to his/her patients but, unless there is a case that i dont know about, (think about it) has anyone ever gone to a "hospital" to see their physician about getting a script for Medical marijuana?

those of you who are saying that it was "fucked up" and "how could a place for healing do that" your not thinking about things in their proper perspectives. is a hospital a place for healing? sure it is BUT just not the homeopathic way. hospitals, or more so modern medicine, relies upon drugs, prognosis, diagnosis and modern treatments as the tools for a "healing environment." most of us INCLUDING MYSELF would love to see a patient be able to get a private room during a hospital stay and utilize cannabis however they would see fit to medicate and alleviate symptoms of ailments. think about how long it took "modern medicine", more appropriately western medicine, to recognize the healing capabilities of acupuncture? modern medicine has and will continue to debunk any if not all of the advantages of homeopathic medicines AND their practices. just recently have you been able to see a trickle of doctors knowledgeable about homeopathic medicine and are willing to let you "treat yourself" while under their care but thank god they exist! so word to the wise: choose your physicians wisely!!

modern medicine has no place for cannabis, so "you" have to take it upon yourself to medicate yourself as you see fit to do so. if you as me i know i wouldnt be able to stay in a hospital for too long and wouldnt want to. these drugs dont actually heal anything the most they do is alleviate pain or the symptoms that an ailment or sickness may cause and we need not go over the multiple business games that the hospitals are but they still are what they are and its people who are looking for a environment to get better in and one of the things is a pathogen/carcinogen free environment or as free as can possibly be.

they kicked her out because they are afraid of liability plain simple end of story and ANY hospital is/ will do the same thing. its fucked up but thats what its gonna be for anyone, so you may not think so, but your not running the hospital so you and i can think what we want until cannabis is legalized.

IMO because of cancer she has to live a certain life style and she has chosen to utilize cannabis to medicate herself, god bless her and more power to her. she should just go get checked up regularly so the doc's can use the machines to see whats going on and then go home. thats what i do and thats not gonna change. all i rely on my doctor to do is diagnose and let me know whats going on, what i need to do to alleviate or heal and THAT IS ALL!!!! i take the prescriptions, go home and start searching like a mad man for homeopathic methods that i can use to achieve the same goals and IMO thats all that modern medicine can do for me, just let me know what wrong and what i can do to heal it, outside of that, i personally have sworn off of script meds.

all that is to say a great lady once told me to " realize where you are in time and place" and i never knew that such a simple statement could be so impactful in my life. she knew where she was and she knew she was taking a chance with what she was doing when she decided to vape some meds

right thing wrong place
 
L

longearedfriend

touchy subject...

it's something that needs to be researched and debated, and it needs to be done now..

I truly believe that mmj can help sick people and offer them a better quality of life..

touchy subject...
 
S

SeaMaiden

Friend, I understand your points, they're well made, but I still disagree with many of them. Especially after learning that a local hospital (I'm in California, almost directly east of SF, in an area that could be called California's Bible Belt--in other words, it's very 420-unfriendly here) offered cannabis in smokable form to the dying father of a coworker of my husband recently. He refused due to the stigma and passed from his pancreatic cancer just a week later.

This is *not* a teaching hospital in any way, shape or form, and they offered a dying man who wasn't even aware of the properties of cannabis the opportunity to be afforded some small relief, while IN the hospital.

And in your line of work and studies, you have to know that many cancer patients (my folks, both in the health industry, one a radiologist the other a registered dietitian with specialties, call them chemo/radiation victims, not patients) cannot ingest much, especially rich, high fat or high sugar foods without experiencing problems. You have to know that for many patients ingestion is difficult to titrate, may be ineffective as compared to vaporizing, or not as quick-acting.

I disagree that it's not possible for the hospital to make allowances for a patient in Ms. Raich's position and health condition. She could have been moved to a different area, she could have been taken outdoors, she could have been offered something other than complete and total abstinence from something that provides her relief during her hospital stay. I was stunned to learn that my local hospital offered a non-MMJ patient cannabis, and I'm PROUD OF THEM for doing it.

I respect everyone's opinions, but in this instance I disagree on the points made.
 

Shcrews

DO WHO YOU BE
Veteran
i remember reading about Angel Raich 10 years ago, now she's back in the news, busted for weed again!

Silly woman, why can't you just take your pills like a good little slave?

why can't we all just take our pills, like good little slaves?
 
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