Help me develop/refine my outdoor organic soil mix

[Dawn Patrol]

I've used this mix for a couple years now with good success, but I'm sure some of the organic gurus will see room for improvement and/or will be able to eliminate some redundancy of amendments.


I use this for all my outdoor potted plantings as well as for MJ and typically mix it in a wheelbarrow at approximately 3 cubic feet at a time. I rarely have time to let it “cook” before using it, but I usually apply ACT to everything at least once or twice a month.


My goal is to develop the lowest cost/best performing organic mix that I can with ingredients that are sourced locally as much as possible.


Here are the base components sourced from Home Depot and local nursery’s.

33% Organic potting mix

33% Large Perlite

33% Peat Moss


To each cubic foot of this base mix I add:


½ cup Blood Meal
1 cup Bone Meal
½ cup Nature's Essence SEP
1 cup Dolomite Lime
1 cup Diatamaceous Earth Food Grade
½ cup Hardwood Ash
2 cups Earthworm Castings
2 cups Rock Dust
1 cup Calcium Bentonite Clay Powder


This mix usually takes me from transplant to harvest without additional feeding, but if I feel it's necessary, I just use SEP and some molasses to feed.


My ACT brewer is 20 gallons and here is my recipe for a 16 gallon batch:


16 gallons of living water
2/3 cup SEP
4 cups EWC
4 cups of compost
1 cup unsulphured Molasses




So let's discuss – what would you change to the base mix, amendments or ACT mix?

 

[Sean Price]

I'd cut the perlite and add more compost\ewc. always add kelp if you can too.

 

[Bullfrog44]

ditto.

 

[mad librettist]

just wondering - why can't you grow in the ground? do they need to be mobile?

 

[chief bigsmoke]

replace the perlite mix with a ricehusk/peat mix. really, really cheap to source at a cattle feed shop. Also you should research the pros and cons of using bone/blood meals. Just my two cents. you can find more info on why in my current thread. Thanks

PS Kelp meal, greensand and benefical bacteria and fungi would be my additions to your recipe

 

[Scrappy4]

each cubic foot of this base mix I add:


½ cup Blood Meal
1 cup Bone Meal
½ cup Nature's Essence SEP
1 cup Dolomite Lime
1 cup Diatamaceous Earth Food Grade
½ cup Hardwood Ash
2 cups Earthworm Castings
2 cups Rock Dust
1 cup Calcium Bentonite Clay Powder

I'd lose the dolomite lime and replace with gypsum, and crab meal. Your mix looks to me a ph problem in waiting with rock dust, ash, bone meal, DE, and dolomite lime. Proper amounts of EWC/compost could help, but your light there too......scrappy

 

[growinthehills]

This might be a dumb question but what is SEP?
P.S. I agree with scrappy on pH and crab meal is always a bonus!

 

[Dawn Patrol]

I'd cut the perlite and add more compost\ewc. always add kelp if you can too.

I use that amount of perlite to avoid root rot when we get a lot of rain. I get fantastic root development and great drainage. When it's really dry I have to water a lot, but I haven't lost a plant to root issues for a couple of years now

just wondering - why can't you grow in the ground? do they need to be mobile?

Yes they need to be mobile, I veg in one spot with supplemental lighting to control the photoperiod and then flower in another spot

replace the perlite mix with a ricehusk/peat mix. really, really cheap to source at a cattle feed shop. Also you should research the pros and cons of using bone/blood meals. Just my two cents. you can find more info on why in my current thread. Thanks

Thanks CBS, I'll check it out

I'd lose the dolomite lime and replace with gypsum, and crab meal. Your mix looks to me a ph problem in waiting with rock dust, ash, bone meal, DE, and dolomite lime. Proper amounts of EWC/compost could help, but your light there too......scrappy

Scrappy, what pH issues do you see?

This might be a dumb question but what is SEP?
P.S. I agree with scrappy on pH and crab meal is always a bonus!

SEP is Seaweed Extract Powder, comparable to Maxibloom

 

[Dawn Patrol]

My goal is to develop the lowest cost/best performing organic mix that I can with ingredients that are sourced locally as much as possible.

A lot of the stuff you guys are suggesting is not available locally such as:
ricehusk/peat mix
greensand
crab meal
benefical bacteria and fungi

I'm in a very urban locale, but the whole "organic" movement is behind everywhere else it seems. It was just last spring that I was able to locally source EWC and I have to order almost everything on my amendment list except the bone meal, blood meal, dolomite lime and wood ash.

 

[chief bigsmoke]

Great work so far Dawn patrol. Nice job sourcing local EWC's. great find. I don't know what country your from but if your from the states a great place for cheap gear is bghydro. you can google them for more info. They have lots of cheap benee's and soil amendments. As well as a good selection of natural pest controls.

enjoy!

 

[Dawn Patrol]

Thanks for the tip CBS.

I guess what I really want to find out is if I am putting too much "stuff" in this mix. I've slowly worked up to this level of amendments and I get good results, but if I can spend less on this mix by cutting out some of the ingredients, that would be helpful.

 

[Coba]

I've used this mix for a couple years now with good success, but I'm sure some of the organic gurus will see room for improvement and/or will be able to eliminate some redundancy of amendments.


I use this for all my outdoor potted plantings as well as for MJ and typically mix it in a wheelbarrow at approximately 3 cubic feet at a time. I rarely have time to let it “cook” before using it, but I usually apply ACT to everything at least once or twice a month.


My goal is to develop the lowest cost/best performing organic mix that I can with ingredients that are sourced locally as much as possible.


Here are the base components sourced from Home Depot and local nursery’s.

33% Organic potting mix

33% Large Perlite

33% Peat Moss


To each cubic foot of this base mix I add:


½ cup Blood Meal
1 cup Bone Meal
½ cup Nature's Essence SEP
1 cup Dolomite Lime
1 cup Diatamaceous Earth Food Grade
½ cup Hardwood Ash
2 cups Earthworm Castings
2 cups Rock Dust
1 cup Calcium Bentonite Clay Powder


This mix usually takes me from transplant to harvest without additional feeding, but if I feel it's necessary, I just use SEP and some molasses to feed.


My ACT brewer is 20 gallons and here is my recipe for a 16 gallon batch:


16 gallons of living water
2/3 cup SEP
4 cups EWC
4 cups of compost
1 cup unsulphured Molasses




So let's discuss – what would you change to the base mix, amendments or ACT mix?

Heya Dawn Patrol,

I highlighted in red the amendments I wanted to ask you about...

How are these two working out for you so far? I'm concerned about the DE's water retention / absorbency... Is it a problem? Have you noticed any negative attributes from adding too much?.. how about too little?

I've found a product that has both DE @67% and Calcium Bentonite @33%... and they sell it right down the road, at the farm supply house.

I'm going to get it. I was just curious how other growers are doing with these two combined. thanks, and sorry for blowing you up with all the q's.

Coba

peace

 

[Dawn Patrol]

Wow, blast from the past! Thanks for resurrecting this thread Coba, I'm happy to answer your questions!

The DE I'm using is food grade and is a very fine powder so there is no issue with water retention. It is commonly used as an organic pesticide and my initial reason for adding it to the mix was to battle any root pests (nematodes specifically). In the past I've had pots that were severely damaged by nematodes that came from the ground the pots were sitting on. You can combat that with a plastic barrier under the pot, but in my area that can cause issues with the pots draining properly and mosquitos breeding in the water standing in the plastic.

While I have no concrete evidence that it is responsible for eliminating nematode issues, I have not encountered that problem since I have been adding it to my mix.

The clay amendment is also a very fine powder and was included simply to add some additional minerals that were possibly not contained in the rock dust.

Ultimately IMHO, the clay and the rock dust are the two ingredients that could be eliminated and you probably would not see much difference without them.

As far as the product you've sourced, it may work for you depending on how you intend to use it. I'm making the broad assumption that it is pellitized like kitty litter or oil dry. I would think as an in ground amendment it would be OK, but in containers, you would have to be very careful with your watering regimen. If you're growing outdoors in containers and you get significant heavy rainfall, it could hold too much moisture and cause root rot and other issues.

 

[Coba]

mosquitos are a bitch, I caught west nile virus 3 times this summer... lol

Yup the food grade fine powder that's what i'm talking about. It's like $13 for a 20# bag of it at tsc.

thanks DP...

 

[Granger2]

If that much perlite is working for you, I wouldn't change it. If it were me, I'd go with smaller perlite to distribute the air it holds more evenly. You've got an otherwise heavy mix, and I think you need the air it holds. I would cut back on the dolomite, especially if there's lime in your water. Replacing it with gypsum would IMO be an improvement. Gypsum gives you sulfates. -granger

 

[Dawn Patrol]

Granger - I'm outdoors and if I don't use that much perlite and I get a couple consecutive days of rain, I don't get enough drainage and I start to have root issues. I'm close enough that I can water at least twice a week and although sometimes they look like hell when I get to them, I haven't lost a girl or suffered significant damage from lack of water in a couple of years.

The wet/dry cycle is very inportant for strong root growth and toughening the plant so it works for me quite well for MJ as well as most other potted plants in my yard.

I've played around with the dolomite and it needs to stay. I water almost exclusively from a pond that is kept at a pH of 8.0 - 8.3 so the water is fairly hard and alkaline.

All in all not a scenario that anyone else would likely deal with but it works for me.

I'm curious, where do you source gypsum other than drywall?

 

[Coba]

DP

espoma's garden Gypsum is not on the shelves at the depot anymore... their "Soil Acidifier" is though, it's a mix of sulfur and gypsum to give you 30% sulur... sometimes I can find the garden gypsum at my local nursery too. gypsum is not aluminum sulfate tho.

Gypsum is a very soft sulfate mineral composed of calcium sulfate dihydrate

JIC you find calcium sulfate... that's gypsum too.

 

[Dawn Patrol]

Thanks Coba, I'll see if I can track some down and try it out. any idea what a good application rate is?

 

[SilverSurfer_OG]

Have you thought about adding char? It is great for all soils and adds seriously good benefits.

I have been cooking some up the past couple of weeks in my fireplace by using a large metal biscuit tin with tight fitting lid. Been using wood scraps from where i was sawing and chopping firewood.

It has some similar properties to perlite and would keep those roots from drowning too.



ps. Have a look at the thread in my sig for lots of excellent info

 

[Coba]

I've seen Orchid charcoal for planting orchids into. not sure if that would have the same effect.