New to Ebb&Flow setup in Basement...res temps to cold?

[budelight]

Hi all.

I have some clones i made from my last grow, had 4 females but all these clones are off 1 plant that had the best structure. Rooted clones took a while but once i got them rooted they started to grow like mad men!

After about 2 weeks i moved them to my new ebb/flow setup. This is the first time i am using it out. since the grow is in my basement and very stelth i have it inside a cabinet and it is very small.

The pump turns on 3 times a day (plants are under 24/0 light) and have been starting to look sickly. Dont have any veg nutes yet so i have been using AN Sensi Bloom A+B @ 1/2 strength with a light does of voodoo juice to help the roots get established.

i FIMed them while they were in the aero garden which i have never tried before, not sure if it plays a factor, however the water in the res gets VERY cold, it almost feels like ice water. I read somewhere that the pump motor will use the water to cool down the pump...ie warming up the water... but i dont think it provides enough help so i purchased a "Hydor 7.5 W Mini Aquarium Heater " online, should receive early this week.

Also note, when i moved the clones to this new ebb/flow setup from the aero garden they went from being under 1 dual 32w shop light to inside the box with 1x55w cool bulb and 1x55w warm bulb.

Does anyone have any experience with this happening to plants? I don't know if it is a nutrient deficiency, water temp, water schedule, or environment change.

Thanks in advance,
Budelight

 

[resinryder]

I'm gonna say a few things that may upset you but please don't take it personal. I am not 1 to beat around the bush ok.I want to see you grow great plants.
Never start a grow unless you have everything ready for it.Not being ready makes the plants suffer and waste your time chasing a plant that ain't gonna happen right for ya. For example-
-nutes,
-additives
-meters(ec/ppm, and a ph meter)
-ph up and down,
-carbon filter- OVER SIZED ONES ARE THE BEST!!!a must to keep your stealth just that. As a grower you become adjusted to the smell. Others that visit and those outside your spot will know it and be able to follow it to your house.
-Proper lighting. Personally I don't believe you have enough but have seen people do nice work with smaller lights.
Ok, lets get to it.
-Cut your lights to 18 hours on/6 hours off. Now that they are on your tray they need the down time.
- Get your veg nutes. The plants look starved and like they have a lockout of some sort going on.
-Can you list your ph and ppm/ec level?
-And it looks like just the grow rocks are the medium right?
-How long is your flood time? In that setup it shouldn't flood more than a couple of minutes. Much longer than that and you'll end up with root rot or other problems.
-Get your veg nutes. The bloom nutes aren't gonna do what you want right now.
-Keep your ph in the 5.5 to 5.9 range for the setup you're running. That's the best range for hydro for your plants to get what they need.
-PPM's at this point should be between 600 to 800. 800 on the high end if they can handle it but I think you need to be around the 600-650 range then go up.
-Use a calmag type product. Pumps pull iron out in the res. Calmag products have a bit of iron as do most quality nute lines. Most nute lines don't put enough calcium and magnesium in their nutes that's why they make that calmag supplement.
-Water temp-I like 70 to 78 degrees f although I do have temps higher than that sometimes. But i don't have problems with it so I deal with it.. Holds oxygen and keeps the pathogens away. To cold and you have problems.
****If you are going to use the heater, put it in a small glass dish of some sort. Heaters have been known to melt plastic reservoirs.And the glass won't react with anything.

 

[krunchbubble]

I'm gonna say a few things that may upset you but please don't take it personal. I am not 1 to beat around the bush ok.I want to see you grow great plants.
Never start a grow unless you have everything ready for it.Not being ready makes the plants suffer and waste your time chasing a plant that ain't gonna happen right for ya. For example-
-nutes,
-additives
-meters(ec/ppm, and a ph meter)
-ph up and down,
-carbon filter-a must to keep your stealth just that. As a grower you become adjusted to the smell. Others that visit and those outside your spot will know it and be able to follow it to your house.
-Proper lighting. Personally I don't believe you have enough but have seen people do nice work with smaller lights.
Ok, lets get to it.
-Cut your lights to 18 hours on/6 hours off. Now that they are on your tray they need the down time.
- Get your veg nutes. The plants look starved and like they have a lockout of some sort going on.
-Can you list your ph and ppm/ec level?
-And it looks like just the grow rocks are the medium right?
-How long is your flood time? In that setup it shouldn't flood more than a couple of minutes. Much longer than that and you'll end up with root rot or other problems.
-Get your veg nutes. The bloom nutes aren't gonna do what you want right now.
-Keep your ph in the 5.5 to 5.9 range for the setup you're running. That's the best range for hydro for your plants to get what they need.
-PPM's at this point should be between 600 to 800. 800 on the high end if they can handle it but I think you need to be around the 600-650 range then go up.
-Use a calmag type product. Pumps pull iron out in the res. Calmag products have a bit of iron as do most quality nute lines. Most nute lines don't put enough calcium and magnesium in their nutes that's why they make that calmag supplement.
-Water temp-I like 70 to 78 degrees f although I do have temps higher than that sometimes. But i don't have problems with it so I deal with it.. Holds oxygen and keeps the pathogens away. To cold and you have problems.
****If you are going to use the heater, put it in a small glass dish of some sort. Heaters have been known to melt plastic reservoirs.And the glass won't react with anything.

i like you ResinRider.....

 

[resinryder]

I like you too Krunch. Good to see ya brother.

 

[Classy@Home]

Great post RR...

Submerge a pyrex flask in the res, and put the heater in it...

Def not too cool on res temps, below 66 is counter productive - too warm promotes snot, rot, and "smoke-me-not"...

 

[GrowForIt]

budelight I wouldn't get too concerned about res temp being too cold unless it's in the 50s, it looks like you have multiple things going on. To me those plants looked stressed and o2/nute starved from the change from the aero garden to flood and drain. Your roots were accustomed to the old environment now they have to get used to the new one, I say if you dig around them you'll see some of the old roots are dying off, and it's going to take a bit for them to grow new ones. I've seen plants look like that when being changed from a shallow flooding tray to a deeper flooding tray.

How warm is the area where the plants are? A cool res is ok but a cold root zone will cause problems like that as well.

Your flood height looks way too high, if your transplanting into f&d you only want the nutes to cover the roots not the stem.

If they were my plants I'd remove some of the lower leaves to reduce the demand on the root system, drop the flood level or raise the plant so only the roots get covered with nutes, change the flood frequency to twice a day as long as it isn't too hot in there (above 85) and keep the nutes mild until they start to recover.

Work on getting some veg nutes, a bag of maxi grow is around $13 and will last a small grow for ever. Not sure how the sensi bloom will work for veg I've never used it.

Good Luck
GFI

 

[budelight]

Dear resinryder - Nutes: used them for 1 run in soil I really need to get into Lucas formula, what brand do you recomend? water is from dehumidifyer.
Additives: none right now.
Meters: none right now.
Ph: nothing yet.
Carbon filter: all set and ready for action.
Lighting: i didnt want to overpower them until they were healthier.
Light Schedule: i just turned it down, should i change the water pump to match the lights? if so then 3 in lights OR 1 at start of light cycle, 1 in middle, 1 at end? i will leave for now.
Veg nutes: getting monday, how do i cure a lockout?.
Ph&PPM/EC: dont have the meters, trying to save money, whats the cheapest option?.
Growrocks: yes, cloned in 1x1 rockwool cubes.
Flood Time: 15 minutes is what my timer only allows, that good?
Veg Nutes & PPM: i know, you are soooooo right!.
Ph: i will someday .
Cal-Mag: gotit! what brand?.
Water Temp: heater should be coming sometime this week! great tip, thank you.

krunchbubble - He is like my total savior right now. Can you say "Better than a Mentor?" you are all great, thank you for being a part of all this!

Classy@Home - I dont plan to get a thermoter for the res, How do i know if its too warm? I need to prevernt snot, rot, and "smoke-me-not" before i get it, what should i do?

GrowForIt - I hope you have been doing well, i see that your ladies are! Still trying to find small enough smart-pots for my setup, i love how you use them to hold your gro-rocks and it makes your table look so clean and im still curios about if they promote healthier plants by drying out the roots.

Res Temps: it is probably around 50, might be less. Will be ended real soon, getting heater this week. My basement is typically cold and it would not surprise me if there was temps that low to cause a cold root zone. There is 1 layer of gro-rocks over the top of the 1x1 rockwool cubes i rooted in, what i have done is remove a 1 inch spacer on my drain side so the table floods MUCH less now only about the bottom 3/4 inch floods, should do me much better THANK YOU!.

It is deffinatly not over 85 in there, 2 times a day for how long (is 15 minutes not doable?) and what corolation with my lights being on 16/8?

Getting veg nutes tomorrow after work, i plan to try out lucas formula, are you recommending maxi bloom for this also?

Good to see you again! Good luck to you as well, thanks!

Cheers All!
Budelight

PS> i brought some purple kush back from Harbor Side Oakland and also a 1/2 nug of Jack'd Strawberry Diesel and let me say = This shit is the dankest danky danking nug i have ever seen. Props to the grower who use his magical setup/knowledge/love produce her. Thank you

 

[resinryder]

Dear resinryder - Nutes: used them for 1 run in soil I really need to get into Lucas formula, what brand do you recomend? water is from dehumidifyer.
Additives: none right now.
Meters: none right now.
Ph: nothing yet.
Carbon filter: all set and ready for action.
Lighting: i didnt want to overpower them until they were healthier.
Light Schedule: i just turned it down, should i change the water pump to match the lights? if so then 3 in lights OR 1 at start of light cycle, 1 in middle, 1 at end? i will leave for now.
Veg nutes: getting monday, how do i cure a lockout?.
Ph&PPM/EC: dont have the meters, trying to save money, whats the cheapest option?.
Growrocks: yes, cloned in 1x1 rockwool cubes.
Flood Time: 15 minue is what my timer only allows, when i changed the light time i also installed my new Digital timer, set to 5 minutes, that good?
Veg Nutes & PPM: i know, you are soooooo right!.
Ph: i will someday .
Cal-Mag: gotit! what brand?.
Water Temp: heater should be coming sometime this week! great tip, thank you.

what brand do you recomend?
I use Flora Nove veg and bloom nutes. I add to this-CalMag(botanicare brand) and Floralicious Plus(it's a bit pricey but at 1ml/gallon it last a long, long time)
Maxi Grow and Maxi Bloom are really good powdered nutes to use when learning a hydro system. You really need to get the Floralicious to go with it tho. Ask the sales person if they have any small sample bottle of it you could try. Tell em you are thinking about using it and would like to see if it makes a difference in your setup.

Meters: none right now.
Ph: nothing yet.
Here's the deal. when adding nutrients and additives to your water, it will usually bottom out your ph to the 4.3-5.5 range. If you don't have the correct ph range you wold be doing your plants or yourself any good. You'll end up with burnt, locked out plants like the ones you have in your first post. If you're gonna run hydro you really need some way to measure your ph and ppms.

Lighting: i didnt want to overpower them until they were healthier.
Light Schedule: i just turned it down, should i change the water pump to match the lights? if so then 3 in lights OR 1 at start of light cycle, 1 in middle, 1 at end? i will leave for now.

You won't over power them. So don't worry about that. Flood cycles-I flood 1 hour before lights on. Every 4 hours after that, then once 1 hour after lights off. Been doing this for 10 years with no problems and massive grows.

Ph&PPM/EC: dont have the meters, trying to save money, whats the cheapest option?.
You can use ph paper strips to check ph but look on line for a cheap meter. Do the same for the ppm meter. Cheap meters are better than no meter at all and are a must in hydro. The ph and ppms can change on a daily basis depending on a wide range of factors.

Cal-Mag: gotit! what brand?
Any brand will do. If you already have it you're good to go with that.

Flood Time: 15 minue is what my timer only allows, when i changed the light time i also installed my new Digital timer, set to 5 minutes, that good?
A digital timer like you got is the best for flood times.
Here's how to figure out how long to set the pump timer for. Turn on the pump and see how long it takes the water level to EITHER reach the over flow spout OR the come half way up your medium.
Once it reaches 1 or the other of those 2 points let it run for another minute and turn it off. That's all it needs. Set your timer for the amount of time it took. later into the grow, if it need a bit more, add another minute to it. Simple really. If you have an adjustable over flow you can remove a section or 2 to get the height you need the table to start draining.
***Like GrowForIt mentioned in his post, you don't want the stem to get wet when you flood. Not at all really because you'll get stem rot.

Get some Clearx= This is a flushing solution that pulls out salts buildup from your plants and medium. Use it once a month. You won't regret it!!! The may have samples of that too. With your small setup nutes and additives will last a while.

 

[GrowForIt]

The roots don't dry out inside the pot, only once they emerge out of the the pot are they "air pruned". The pots create an incredible fibrous root system. Every plant I've harvested from the smart parts have had an incredibly healthy root system. But they are also a pain in the ass, algae becomes a serious problem with them, and they are a pain to clean, and you only get a couple of grows out of them before they need replaces. The older they get the worse the algae problem because the material gets fuzzy.

Yea if it's that cold in they're the root zone is going to stay cold and wet, plants don't grow well under those conditions. Is there anyway to get the temps up into the 70? Even by adding some extra light can generate heat.

Flood length should be only long enough to flood to the desired height and circulate the nutrients a little bit. This will depend on how long it takes your pump to fill your tray, take that time and add another minute or so to it.

I run my veg lights 24/0 but, with an 18/6 schedule I'd flood that tray 2 hours after lights on and 12 hours later. In an ideal setup you would flood your tray and wait for your plants to get thirsty and droop, you take this time and flood one hour before the droop. But you would need a consistent environment and plant uptake.

I don't use the lucas formula, I feed the plants what they will eat, I always start out low and wait for the plants to start to show a pale green before feeding them stronger. If the plants are very dark green you are feeding them too much, if they are a light yellow green they are hungry, if the leaves are a nice green color and soft to the touch they are in the right spot for their age and lighting. If those are clones they will need the near the same nutrient strength the mother planted handled when she was flowering.

I use maxi grow for veg and maxi bloom for flower the maxi series is a good nutrient and it's cheap, it will work well for you as long as you don't over do it.

Get your environment right is very important, got to get that temp up or you will only have problems.

Good luck
GFI

 

[budelight]

Not awake enough to answer, here are 2 pics from after i made the changes above.

Thank you Both!
Budelight

 

[budelight]

resinryder - I have switched over to tap water from dehumidifyer water after getting my last electric bill!!!

-I Purchased Maxi Bloom per your recombination and will be using 7g / gal (or about 1 tsp). the new lady at the hydro store "Grams" told me she had a sample at home and to come back in to get it from her (shes off wednesday and thursday.

-I purchased THIS ph meter and THIS ppm meter on sunday and should have before the end of this week, thank you for giving me good reason to spend $15 on each of then will be a worthy investment in myself!!!

-Water Schedule = 1 hour before lights on, every 4 hours durring lights on, and 1 hour after lights off. I will have to compare this to GrowForIt's recomended schedule, figure out which is more efficient and which promotes healthier plants in my setup. Thank you both.

-I learned that my pump resets the digital timer every time i try to turn it on, so i have to be sticking to my 15 minute fill times now, however since i lowered the drain by removing the 1 inch spacer, its more like a NFT since the table only floods about 1/2 inch. Seems to be working Much Better!

-Cal-Mag = "gotit" as a figure of speech meaning i understand. After being in the hydro store today and speaking with "Grams", i learned that with the Maxi Bloom, there is plenty of Calcium, Magnesium, and Iron in the nutrients, do you still recommend me add additional? Remember i going for KISS with Lucas Formula

-Flood Timer = as stated above, the timer resets every time the pump trys to kick on, its rated for 15Amps so im not sure whats happening, but it doesnt work. Keeping the pump on a 15 minute timer until i can figure it out.

-Clearex (botanicare)= I bought this at the store also, however i must be too stoned as i dont understand the proper directions on using it with my ebb & flow table. EDIT: so after using the handy-dandy search feature, i found resinryder's explination of how to use Clearex from back in 2006. Here it is!

GrowForIt - Your grows still make me drool! need to get me some small smart pots (which also help with training....

-I got the heater in the mail today so i will be installing shortly in a pyrex dish (good idea!)

-Flood Length = unfortunately at the current time i am forced to keep it at 15 minutes because my digital timer resets every-time the pump should come on.... stupid cheep products.

-Water Schedule = 2 hour after lights on and 12 hours after that. I will have to compare this to resinryder's recomended schedule, figure out which is more efficient and which promotes healthier plants in my setup. Thank you both.

-Lucas = I hear you and very much wish i had the experience to feel out my plants like that. I believe Lucas is a simple way for a beginner to get a good idea of how their strains respond to a healthy dose of nutrients and I plan to adjust as needed.

-Maxi = yes indeed, this is what i walked out with in my hands Hopefully i have enough tact to grow some plants like yours finally!!

On another note, i incorectly set my pump timer last night when i was 1/2 asleep taking those pictures at 1am. i left the pump running for 8 hours, then off for 15 minutes, then on for 8, then off for 15 min, then on for 8. The funny thing is that the plants look slightly better today then they did yesterday. Fixing regardless.

Thank you both for your help with getting my training wheels off! I will pay it forward for sure.

Cheers,
Budelight

 

[darkhorse]

a lot of my so called friends are going to loose crops this winter, newbies didnt help me out after i got busted no smoke or nothing off them, they have just started growing by them selves and i used to help out with some of their problems and give them free smoke.
we will see how many of them think about putting a heater in the room or rez, temps are minus one here the now.
one guy when he started i gave him a carbon filter and it sat in the middle of the room
went around a week later and it was still in the same place attached to nothing,no fans or ducting, thought it would just magicly suck the bad odour out just sitting there!
so im giving them no pointers this time they can look things up themselves, sorry rant over,lol.

 

[resinryder]

"Cal-Mag = "gotit" as a figure of speech meaning i understand. After being in the hydro store today and speaking with "Grams", i learned that with the Maxi Bloom, there is plenty of Calcium, Magnesium, and Iron in the nutrients, do you still recommend me add additional? Remember i going for KISS with Lucas Formula"


Dude forget the Lucas formula. You'll have to eventually make tweaks to it and that means reading your plants and knowing what their needs are. That comes with experience and you don't have that yet. Just being honest.
If you have these 3 additives you'll never have to worry about what your plants are doing.
The additives I use are-
-CalMag-Use all the way from veg to bloom. Keep in mind that calmag needs can be strain dependent. You may not need it in veg on some but will on others. Plants usually require more in bloom.
-Floralicious Plus-ask hydro lady if she has a sample bottle of it. It's expensive but last a long time. The sample bottle will last you a while in your small res. Use it at 1ml/gallon. this stuff is the shit!!! Use all the way from veg to bloom.
-Kool Bloom(for later on into bloom. Blows your buds up!!) use just from week5 of bloom until you begin your final flush.
The hydro lady in not correct. It does contain Calcium, Magnesium, and Iron, BUT not enough to grow what you're gonna grow. If theirs or any one else's primary nutrient line contained enough of those elements they wouldn't be making a Calmag supplement to compliment their nutrient. It's that simple.
DO NOT USE THE 7 GRAMS THE BOTTLE RECOMMENDS. That may be find for tomatoes and shit but it may be to strong a dose for your plants. A general rule of thumb is to use a 1/4 of what's recommended on the package and go from there. Wait until you get the ppm meter so you know EXACTLY what you are feeding them.
Keep in mind that when you add the additives and nutes to your water the ph will probably go down really low. So adjust the ph after everything is added.
Do it like this- Add any additives you're going to use, such as calmag for example, then add the primary nutrient last, in your case it's the maxi Bloom. You may have to adjust the ph during the maxi Bloom addition. When adding the maxi bloom, the ph may go down below your target ph range but your target ppm range hasn't been reached yet. After you have reached the ppm you want and adjust the ph up to where you want it, all of a sudden your ppm's are much higher than you want. At this point you'll have to add more water to lower the ppms. So that's just something to keep your eye on.
You really need a good digital cycle timer. you can get one cheap. You'll end up with root rot flooding them that long.

 

[GrowForIt]

budelight: As resinryder pointed out you shouldn't use the Lucas formula (7g maxi/gal) your plants nutrient requirements are based on not only the strain but the environment. Full strength maxi is fine in a dialed in environment under large hids, but it's way too much for your plants under a few cfl's.

With a flood schedule it's not too important where you set the time on at once you figure out the interval, every one has their reasons for having the flood start at a certain time. The reason I recommended 2 hours after lights on for you is because of your cool environment, I don't like to flood at lights off because there isn't as much heat in the grow room and the plants are forced to have a cold wet root zone the entire time the lights are off. Those plants aren't going to take up much nutrients in their current condition, and keeping the root zone too cold and wet is going to be counter productive. So in my reasoning by flooding 4 hours before the lights go off will allow the medium to drain well and allow the plant to use up some of the moisture in the rocks before the lights switch off, this will be better to help those plants grow new roots. When the lights come on the 2 hours to the first flood will give the roots time to warm up from the over night and use up some more of the moisture in the rocks. The hydroton may dry out at the top but will remain moist lower down, I've had rooted clones go 24 hours in 5.5" net pots without a flood at 78* a few times because I've forgot to plug the pump back into the timer. So I'm confident you will be fine with the schedule I've recommended.

If you must use the 15 minute timer, try to make sure the the nutrient returning to the reservoir is falling at least 1 foot from where it exits the drain line to where it contacts the nutrient. This will oxygenate the nutrient.

I see you got the heater for the nutrients, what i haven't seen is if you have any plans to get heat in the grow area? Heating the nutrients alone is not going to be enough, you need to get the area where the plants are in the 70s at least.

Good Luck
GFI

 

[budelight]

On my way to work, wanted to throw these pics up.

Thank you for your help. Will talk with my better half on a maxi grow & bloom grow like GrowForIt. Do you use any of the additives resinryder mentions (CalMag, Floralicious Plus, KoolBloom)? I see in one of your posts from 6 weeks ago that your using Maxi Grow @ 1.00 (i assume that means 7g/gal) and Dyna Gro ProTekt, with some admirable results.

Not sure what my better half is going to be interested with, but i prefer simplicity which is why i chose the Maxi brand.

No doubt i would get great results using resinryder's method, looking at your Chem 4 harvest! however this doesn't seem to simple to follow...

"Add any additives you're going to use, such as calmag for example, then add the primary nutrient last, in your case it's the maxi Bloom. You may have to adjust the ph during the maxi Bloom addition. When adding the maxi bloom, the ph may go down below your target ph range but your target ppm range hasn't been reached yet. After you have reached the ppm you want and adjust the ph up to where you want it, all of a sudden your ppm's are much higher than you want. At this point you'll have to add more water to lower the ppms. So that's just something to keep your eye on."

Thats all for now, will most likely be going back to the H-store today after discussing the options with my better half.

Again, i cannot thank both of you enough for your support in this time of uncertainty.

Ciao,
Budelight

 

[Crusader Rabbit]

You can use MaxiBloom throughout both veg and flowering. MaxiGrow isn't necessary. There are very few minerals in my tap water and I get deficiencies using straight MaxiGrow without additional Calcium and Magnesium.

Buy the pH measuring kit that uses drops. It'll cost you less than $10 and provides you with vital information. You need a digital aquarium thermometer too. That's another $10.

 

[resinryder]

No doubt i would get great results using resinryder's method, looking at your Chem 4 harvest! however this doesn't seem to simple to follow...

"Add any additives you're going to use, such as calmag for example, then add the primary nutrient last, in your case it's the maxi Bloom. You may have to adjust the ph during the maxi Bloom addition. When adding the maxi bloom, the ph may go down below your target ph range but your target ppm range hasn't been reached yet. After you have reached the ppm you want and adjust the ph up to where you want it, all of a sudden your ppm's are much higher than you want. At this point you'll have to add more water to lower the ppms. So that's just something to keep your eye on."

I had hoped that wouldn't be too hard to follow. Let me take another crack at it.
When mixing your nutes add the additives/supplements first. Then the maxi grow or bloom.
When adding the primary nutrient, in your case maxi grow or bloom, the maxi grow or bloom can/may really lower your ph. You may need to add a bit of maxi grow or bloom(depending on plant stage) and adjust the ph as you go along. Sometimes when adding the maxi grow or bloom the more you add to your mix the lower the ph will go.
So say you are shooting for a ppm of 600. If you add the grow or bloom and you get to 600 then you adjust the ph to, say a target of 5.8, after you finish adjusting the ph, your ppms could go up to 750 to 800 ppms. It happens. That is just something you want to keep an eye on. It's just easier to adjust the ph as you add the maxi grow or bloom to your res as you go to keep from making the mix too strong.

 

[GrowForIt]

On my way to work, wanted to throw these pics up.

Do you use any of the additives resinryder mentions (CalMag, Floralicious Plus, KoolBloom)? I see in one of your posts from 6 weeks ago that your using Maxi Grow @ 1.00 (i assume that means 7g/gal) and Dyna Gro ProTekt, with some admirable results.

budelight I have CalMag on my shelf but I haven't used it in any of my grows over the last 6 months, and I use RO water with an ec of .04. When using maxi near full strength (2.0) I haven't seen a need for it. I do use ProTeKt at .25 - .5 tsp/gal when mixing fresh nutes, and as ph up when needed. In flower I supplement with powdered Kool Bloom at a rate of 1/24 - 1/12 tsp/gal at the onset of buds, and a few days before res changes. In flower I run my nutes near full strength from day 1 to flush, I flush with straight RO for 2 - 3 weeks.

The post you mentioned where I said I was running the maxi at 1.0 (@ half strength) is the nutrient strength. The 1.0 refers to the nutrient having an ec (electrical conductivity) of 1.0. Ec is an actual measurement of nutrient strength! When people talk about PPM (parts per million) their meter is taking the ec and multiplying it by a conversion factor to give the ppm. The problem with ppm is different meter manufacturers use different conversion factors. One may use the 500ppm = 1.0ec another may use 700ppm = 1.0ec, my Milwaukee meter when set to display ppm uses 6.8 for the conversion factor so 680ppm = 1.0 ec. It's all too confusing when trying to compare actual strengths. So I use ec and post nutrient strength in ec because it's a universal number.

Good Luck
GFI

 

[resinryder]

What it all comes down to is different nute mixes for different people. What works for 1 may or may not work for another. Simple as that.
You need to find a mix that is simple, repeatable, and producing the results you want. Keep a log book, unless you're worried about getting caught with it, of what you've mixed for each run. This way you can go back and see what worked and what didn't. Get your mix dialed in before you start tweaking it. It's real easy to get hyped up on the newest product out there.
GrowForIt has posted some great info on his recipe for success and I've pretty much posted mine. And he's dead on about the Kool Bloom. That's some strong stuff so a little goes a LONG way!!! I used maxi grow/bloom for a while then switched over to the Flora Nova series. I just like the flavors and yields I'm pulling with it. For me it's a simple mix. And it really doesn't cost me that much per run. So I'm happy with it.
BTW, I use EC measurements as well. It's simpler for me. Just dip it, read it, mix it, adjust it, and let it auto grow. Love it.

 

[budelight]

GrowForIt - I just got off the tele with my other brain and we decided that CalMag sounds great but we are on a budget so its off our short list. Going to the store (soon i hope) to get maxi grow and ProTeKT. We are going to try and mimic your setup and results

When you say "use ProTeKt at .25 - .5 tsp/gal when mixing fresh nutes, and as ph up when needed" WHAT exactly is our target pH?

Instead of KoolBloom, we are going to use the "(Grotek) Monster Bloom" as we believe it to be the same product and we have it left over, so rather than spend more money. etc.

"In flower I run my nutes near full strength from day 1 to flush, I flush with straight RO for 2 - 3 weeks." DO you switch from 2.0 maxi grow to 2.0 maxi bloom, and the same day you switch the lights?

ec vs ppm - How do i figure out what my conversion factors are so that i can also think about the nutrient strength in ec. I bought the ppm meter after reading everyone write about them, but i have no idea what ppm i need to be in range of during what periods, or what the acceptable ranges are!!! Same goes for pH!!!!

resinryder - You are spot on with the "find a mix that is simple, repeatable, and producing the results you want" and "Keep a log book". I do keep a log and urge everyone to document everything, good learning is good observation!

I really do need to dial in my setup, i need to finish building it first! I don't know how big to make my supply area vs my veg area. I want as much space for veg as possible, but i need adequate space in my supply for the carbon filter, fan, power strip, timers, ballast.

Do you have a ec meter or are you converting your ppm?

Both of you rock, and i owe you 1.
Budelight