SCRoG vs. LST & Fox Farm Ferts

[JCS]

Hello,
I'm new on the forum, so I'll give some background info. I recently built a micro grow box out of wood that measures 18"H x 16"W x 14"D. I am running four 26w CFL's (1,610 lumens, 6,500 K) and maintaing a daytime temp of 76f, with the help of two pc fans (120 mm exhaust, 80mm intake) and a piece of thin plexiglass mounted just under the bulbs. Taking into consideration the height of the pots and the lights, I have slightly over 9" of growing room. I am growing for personal use only, and am not too concerned with the yield, I just look forward to the experience and some home grown bud. I currently am germinating some black domina and dumpster bag seeds. I am using 6" tera cotta pots, with fox farm ocean forest soil, as well as fox farm big bloom and tiger bloom fertilizers. I plan to grow out four plants until i see pre-flowers and then I will hopefully have two females to grow out all the way. I will have 12/12 lighting from day one. Now for my questions:

1) In a setup like mine, considering I am a complete beginner, would you recommend using SCRoG or LST? It seems that overall, SCRoG would be easiest, but might become a problem when it is time to remove any male plants, especially considering they will be well established.

2) For those of you who use fox farm fertilizers. I am aware that I should not fertilize until a few weeks into the grow. I also know to slowly increase the strength of the fertilizer from 1/4 strength, and only fertilize every other watering. My question is, how "slowly" do I increase the fertilizer strength? By 25% each week, each two weeks, etc.?

Thank you for taking the time to read my thread. I appreciate any and all advise/constructive criticism.

 

[GrowBox420]

LST would be the easiest for a "noob" and it also has about the same outcome as a SCROG in my "noob" opinion.

They have fox farm feeding schedules online... I just got one from the local hydro store. Plus I think you can use your nutes from seed but weak strength.

Got any pics of the setup?

 

[FreezerBoy]

ScrOG is a form of LST. The big difference is, you tie down in LST, ScrOG does it for you. Anything non-cola pokes through the screen, poke it back under. Repeat until colas show.

I love ScrOG but think that LST would be better for you. More problematic than the males in the screen is your 9" of space. I have skinny hands and even I need 5"-6" of space under the screen. That leaves 3-4 inches of grow room (yoiks) If you want to ScrOG anyway. I'd suggest a "reverse" ScrOG, where the screen is at or below pot level. This may prevent growing under the screen and require you to tie to the top of the screen. Modular screens would make male removal easy as pie.

BEWARE INTAKE FANS! They are the one and only way to achieve positive pressure which will allow, if not force, air to bypass the filter. While Intake=2X Exhaust is not required, it's the easiest, never fail, math free solution to provide adequate ventilation and negative pressure. Consider removing the intake fan and increase intake to two 120mm passive intake holes.

Welcome aboard. Break a stem.
FB

 

[JCS]

Thanks for the reply. I have looked at the fox farm feeding schedule, I've just heard different things on different forums. Seems to be more of an art than a science... I forgot to add that I am using fox farm ocean forest soil, so that will provide the necessary nutrients for the first few weeks. I think I will attempt LST for my first grow, and go from there. No pictures, but I will try to work on that. I appreciate your help

 

[JCS]

FB, thanks for the input. Here is a more in depth description of my ventilation system.
I have the 120 mm exhaust fan located on the top left side of the box, blowing through a DIY carbon filter. The intake fan is located on the right side of the box, several inches from the top. In addition to the intake fan I have ten 1/2" holes drilled along the bottom right side (insignificant, i realize, in proportion to the exhaust). While I am aware that the intake (whether passive or active) is "supposed" to be located at the bottom of the box, in my case I believe I will achieve a lower temp keeping it in its current position. As it is currently situated, the intake fan blows cool air directly over the light bulbs (ballast) and directly into the exhaust fan. Without the "jet stream" of cool air across the ballasts, it is my belief that the box would overheat. I realize that this arrangement does not promote the best air flow throughout the entire box, but this is where I believe the 1/2" holes help out. I can feel air being sucked through the holes, so I know I must currently have a negative pressure (right?). Would you still recommend that I remove the intake fan and replace it with two 120 mm passive intakes? I'm just worried that the temps will spike... at one point they neared 100f (although this was with a 120 mm exhaust fan and only the ten 1/2" holes as passive intakes). Just as a side note, I did test out the carbon filter by placing some fairly pungent nugs in the box with the fans running. I couldn't smell a thing outside the box, but when opened, it wreaked. I would think that this also indicates negative pressure within the box? Thanks

 

[FreezerBoy]

Intake fans CAN be done. Just know you're playing with fire.

Both passive and active intakes provides the potential of unscrubbed air being forced from the cab. Just be sure to keep your nose open.

 

[JCS]

Understood, thanks again

 

[geeker]

Lst would by far be the easier of the two methods, what with also having multiple seemingly even tops, and you could pull your plant out... unlike with scrog where you weave it through a screen and can't remove it easily to examine it. not to say you couldn't build a set up that would allow you to pull your screen and plant out with out disturbing it... but yeah, "lst".

 

[FreezerBoy]

LST requires far more weaving than ScrOG. ScrOG requires none. Anything non-cola pokes through the screen gets poked back under the same hole it came out. No weaving. LST is another matter. Where do you tie to the plant, what do you tie it to, how to thread it through the lines you already have going? That's weaving.

ScrOG does LST's work for you, JCS just doesn't have the space.

 

[geeker]

not to sound contrary (and yet still be) but i've never weaved my branches in list, i simply go strait to the edge of the container and call it good. any new tops formed are taken to the nearest section of container rim and tied in place, left to grow strait up.

 

[FreezerBoy]

Contrary away. Debate is a great way to learn.

It's not the stems, it's the ties. Where to tie to the plant, where to tie to the pot. How to weave strings through and around other strings. None of this is required for ScrOG. There are many reasons to go LST, being easier than ScrOG isn't one of them.

 

[JCS]

Out of curiosity, what would you recommend as the bare minimum height of "growable" space for SCRoG? I know you said you like to have at least 5-6" of space between the pot and the screen, but how far will the colas then grow above the screen? I am wondering if in the future (as LST will be used on my first grow) it would be possible to get shorter, wider pots and give SCRoG a try (or if it would even be worth it)?

 

[geeker]

tbh, FreezerBoy, i've never needed to weave anything and that includes my ties. all ties are located on the outside of the container, most usually in a circular pattern. branches are then, if need be, super cropped and tied down in a pattern resembling an asterisk. no ties or branches cross any where, at anytime, ever.

 

[FreezerBoy]

Out of curiosity, what would you recommend as the bare minimum height of "growable" space for SCRoG? I know you said you like to have at least 5-6" of space between the pot and the screen, but how far will the colas then grow above the screen? I am wondering if in the future (as LST will be used on my first grow) it would be possible to get shorter, wider pots and give SCRoG a try (or if it would even be worth it)?

Depends on strain. With sativas under a 250 I'm getting colas in the 20-24 inch range, indicas 10-12.

tbh, FreezerBoy, i've never needed to weave anything and that includes my ties. all ties are located on the outside of the container, most usually in a circular pattern. branches are then, if need be, super cropped and tied down in a pattern resembling an asterisk. no ties or branches cross any where, at anytime, ever.

Each and every tie you attach to the plant is a tie not needed in ScrOG. Every tie to the pot is a tie you don't need in ScrOG. Every hole you drill for the ties or tape you use to hold them down is unneeded in ScrOG. Every tie you buy, or piece of string or tape you purchase for LST, you don't need in ScrOG.

If you prefer LST to the point that it's worth the extra time, effort and money, go for it. Never discount grower personality. But extra time, effort and money is just that. Extra.

 

[phr0st]

I like LST just because I like working with the plant, so I enjoy the extra effort. It also only cost me 2$ for a spindle of string and 2$ for a box of binder clips.

On the other hand i havent tried a ScrOG setup yet. I would like to try it but i havent gotten around to building a setup that i can stick in my pots.

 

[GrowBox420]

Too each their own......


As Phr0st said.... "I like LST just because I like working with the plant..."

 

[who dat is]

LST and scrog are both very similar in what they do for the plant but with LST you get the added bonus of easily pulling the plant out for inspections. In scrog you can't do that, or at least wouldn't want to either because of the pain in the ass factor. My vote is certainly for LST due to your height restrictions. You will most definitely be needing to pull them for inspection. LST costs next to nothing, binder clips and pipe cleaners. I would think that the same amount of time is spent on both scrogs and LST methods. With the pipe cleaner/binder clip method either materials can be reused or relocated extremely easy too. Scrogs are cool as hell but when you have almost zero space to work in it can be very frustrating, especially if you are going to have to weed out males at some point. Good luck man.

 

[stihgnobevoli]

i've never weaved anything with LST either?

i would go lst if i were's you as it gives you more options than a scrog, even thought i have never scrogged it seems like it would be easier if you had control over the individual branches rather than a scrog screen where everything is fixed.

i LST this one to keep the colas together as it tends to spread out and bush.

this one i LST to keep short. you can keep it as short as right above the edge of the pot, and as tall as the individual colas/buds grow.

i also have a short cabinet as you can see in the first picture. i have like 11 inches from the pots to the ceiling, or thereabouts.

a better picture.

 

[GrowBox420]

LST

LST



17days from clone thanks for letting me intrude good luck

 

[JCS]

stihgnobevoli, are those plants from seed or clone? They look great, GrowBox420's as well!