Soil beds?

[dank.frank]

It's been a long time since I've done a soil bed...and honestly, since switching to fully organic years ago, I've not grown in a bed. I think the time has come.

Being as I am a bit rusty on this method, I would like to ask those who have a high degree of experience with growing in beds to toss me a few ideas and pointers, especially in constructing the beds themselves.

My concept this far:

42" x 42" x 7"

12-16 plants

I was only planning on using roughly 6" depth for planting medium in the bed, giving me roughly 40g.

Pointers? Thanks in advance!


dank.Frank

 

[pinecone]

I haven't done a large bed, but I am working with 22 gallon totes that are somewhere between a traditional container and a bed. The state of the art thinking on beds to mulch heavily, re-use the medium, and not to till between crops.

Pine

 

[dank.frank]

Maybe I should note this will be an indoor garden...hehehe...


dank.Frank

 

[pinecone]

Maybe I should note this will be an indoor garden...hehehe...

Same principles apply - mulch heavily and don't till.

Pine

 

[heady blunts]

oo jealous. i designed a no till indoor bed perpetual vert grow that i'm dying to implement.

some things to consider:

6" is really shallow. unless you're building the beds on bare ground, where the roots can penetrate into the earth below, i think you'll gain a lot from a few more inches of soil. afaik, cannabis prefers a deep root bed, although it can adapt to shallow containers. what i would worry about mostly is the plants toppling over when they get too tall for the 6" of roots to support them.

are you already composting? home made EWC or good thermal compost will be invaluable to this set up.

i'd also point you in the direction of mad's "living mulch" thread if you haven't seen it yet. companion planting/ living mulch has some interesting benefits to consider.

other than that, just to echo pinecone's suggestion of no-till. a few rounds practicing no-till gardening and utilizing a nutritious and diverse mulch should develop a pretty sensational soil.

 

[CT Guy]

Depending on how large you let the plants go, I wouldn't mind seeing 8" or more of planting medium.

Have you got your soil mix figured out? Getting a good biologically active soil is going to be the key....

 

[dank.frank]

Yes, the medium is a non-issue. I'll be using the same base mix I always do and amending it with the NSPB:FLF mix.

Base mix: (ratios in gallons)

4g organic "potting" soil
3g chunky perlite
1.5g coir
1.5g peat
1g EWC

Amending with:

alfalfa meal
azomite
beneficial bacterias
blood meal
bone meal
diatomaceous earth
dolomite lime
dry molasses
earthworm castings
greensand
guanos (N, P, seabird)
kelp meal
leonardite
rice flour

I'll let this sit and cook for at least 2 weeks before planting.

I was itching to do a SOG garden again and was preparing to do such. However, I just didn't want to deal with THAT many clones. If I put 12-16 plants in this small a space they will have to be fairly small to begin with when flipped into flower. I am figuring I will be taking rooted cuttings, placing them in 9oz solo cups and letting them get to roughly 10-12 in. From there I will transplant to the table, veg for 1wk and then flower. No real target or goal in mind, just to have a successful harvest at the end...

I agree that cannabis prefers a deeper rooting, however, I also notice that when it doesn't, the plants simply bush out vs. getting more vertical. If I flowered each plant (16) out in 3g each like normally, we are looking at 48g of soil needed. I know the plants aren't going to use that much soil as they are not being flowered at 24-26" tall, but rather 12-14". I think 40g of medium is all they could possibly use or need...so to make the bed any deeper, seems reasonable to help support the plants, at the same time, has a large potential to create unused and wasted space. (another side note - no direct intent to reuse the spent medium again) This leads me to say that a typical 6" aka 1/2g square pot is only 6.5" tall. I can grow very sturdy plants 2ft+ tall in these containers without any issues. That being the case, I see no reason why a bed with 6" of soil should be any worse for wear. After all, could always stake and tie them up if they get too heavy...which better be necessary!

Keep in mind, this is just me rationalizing the idea, and I could be wrong. It is why I'm consulting with you folks before getting the ball rolling on this idea...


dank.Frank

 

[Microbeman]

Think deep. Soil microorganisms function at heirachical levels, each type functioning within the homeostatic strictures of its given levels (e.g. moisture, oxygen, CO2, porosity) passing on components of degradation/digestion to the adjacent heirarchical level. Myriads of fungal structures and pathways remain inplace. Thus, we have the basis for not tilling. The indigenous peoples of the Terra Preta beds claim that so long as the soil below 20 CM remains intact, fertility will remain or be restored. If it were me I'd go for at least 12 inches depth.

 

[h.h.]

Give each plant a 6" ring as an individual raised planter on top of the 6" bed, giving you a total depth of 12" around the plant. Use wicks buried in the bed and protruding out the top of the rings. Mulch the lower layer with living mulch to make Mad happy. Maybe a bit of steamed bone meal for when the roots hit it in flower. Topdress the rings.
Water first few times from the top until established , then alternately top and bottom..

 

[guest2012y]

I ran 3 6'x5' beds that were about 12" deep. Absolutely the best set up for the best soil diversity and health of the plants. Impressive results,and super easy. I ditched the beds due to space issues,but Soma's design would have served better.

Lot's more was going on in those beds than in pots. It was an incredible little ecosystem.

 

[big_daddy]

Have you considered these? I've seen these linked but haven't seen any journals of folks using them. I'd be inclined to use them if I had the room.

b_d

 

[growingcrazy]

I am running a 36" x 36" x 12" bed in my flower chamber. I run a vertical 400 hps and usually run 8 plants around it. Soil is your typical soil mixture with all available flowering amendments. 100% organic next step will be living mulch.

Can't wait to see what you come up with!

 

[MrFista]

I must agree with all suggestions of getting your bed a bit deeper. Plus mulch and no till. I'll add that no till systems require plants constantly in the bed to keep the microbes alive and thriving. Many will die off/encyst with no plant hosts.

The ease of this system is amazing, and the growth when the microherd is happy is as good as I've ever seen in soil.

Also agree a worm farm is aperfect complement to the system.

 

[heady blunts]

sure filling a 24" tall bed is gonna take a ton a soil (and cost a pretty penny) but all the investment is on the front end, and it'll pay for itself the first harvest.

yes, you can grow a two foot tall plant in a 6" pot, but it's not gonna produce very well, and the quality will suffer since the plant is stressed trying to grow in such a confined space.

now imagine the opposite situation: the plants have all the soil they could want. you can still control the height by when you flip and some simple pruning.

meanwhile you have a massive root system, a much healthier, more diverse, and more active microherd, and no stress on the plants. you can grow a 2 foot plant with a huge roots system and get a yeild that absolutely dwarfs the 2 foot plant in 6" of soil. plus with a healthy soil biology, great soil, and no stress, the quality of the final product will also be much higher.

that's what i would do anyway... damn i wish i had a spare room....

 

[NOTB]

thats a great media you have goin on there frank..grow on man.

 

[Marlo]

 

[Ludo]

I think you should try it out the way you intend to.......see how it works for you. If you run into problems like drying out to fast or such, you know what to do.....more soil.....!
I hope you get it sorted and wish you the best of karma....

 

[tuinman]

dank.frank - what were the ratios for the amendments you'll be using in this bed? It looks like a rich and diverse mix.

 

[growingcrazy]

I just wanted to throw this out there.

My bed contains 78 total gallons of mix. That is almost 10 gallons of soil per plant, theoretically.

It really is a different world like this. I have my fan in the center blowing up on the vert bulb, even when the top 6" of soil is looking dry, under the fan is still nice and moist. (pulls moisture from below to the surface)

I also run worms in my bed. They seem to enjoy themselves. I treat my soil as if it were outside 100%.

 

[dank.frank]

Quick thank you to all the responses!


Summary Response:

I can honestly say after reading and looking into it for a few days the major benefits of a soil bed come from continued long term use...as this is also one of it's key advantages. The depth of the soil bed really comes into play as a major factor in the ability of the bed to become a self-sufficient ecosystem.

My situation has forced me to return to mono-cropping for a couple rounds. This naturally leads me to my old love of a massive SOG, but I have a law to follow these days and don't want to breech it. Since I was planning on running a single strain anyway, it only makes sense then that a bed becomes and immediately viable option. (I'm a firm believer that plants, even siblings of the same genetics, when sharing root space, will begin to compete and attempt to overpower the intruder of it's precious root space. As such, I have never run a bed unless it was clone filled...as it will be this time) So the goal for running a bed was simply the concept of extra root space as opposed to every plant having it's own sidewalls. It makes sense that a soil bed can and should yield better using the same amount of soil medium vs individual potting of those same plants.

Because this was my general concept, a bed as a container, vs a bed as a biological system, and there was never any intent to reuse the bed a second time, many of the benefits that are gained by a proper depth of the bed, I would not be utilizing anyway. With this in mind, I have two viable choices...leave the bed as I stated in the first post or I can make the footprint smaller in order to gain a bit of depth instead...which I think I LIKE that idea. This will force me to grow less plants a bit larger, but that is okay...pull out a 1k and start vegging!

A 36 x 36 x 12" would run 9 plants and is still nearly 60g of medium where if potted these were potted there would only be 28g of medium. This nearly doubles the cost of the cycle still, even when using a smaller bed. Not too sure which direction to go with this one. I think this is the most PRACTICAL solution to truly get all the proper benefits of this style of growing, although I think I'll give them a bit of veg time in the bed to get them situated before flip...

Stay tuned...

Seems maybe it would be worth it to do the larger, more shallow bed to see what kind of results are produced this way vs a deeper bed of the same size. I might end up doing TWO beds at 3 x 3. One at 12" depth and one with 6" of depth. This would help establish the use of beds simply as a potting method and if it is even practical without going to the full extent of a true reusable no till soil bed...


dank.Frank