smart meters and flip flopping

[canadasfinest]

I've seen people on here saying that there will be a noticeable spike/twitch when the load is transferred to the cold bulb. anyone know this for a fact or is it just speculation? while i'm on the topic, anyone ever run a digital ballast flipped?

 

[Strainhunter]

Flip flops work great, however they won't make a difference for those who have smart meters.

A 1kw grow won't raise any flags, smart meter or not.

Now if one has a larger grow the flip flops will avoid showing start up spikes but they WILL NOT lower your electric bill.

In other words: Flip Flop or not you still gotta pay that bill.
And for those planning to post "Hey but the non appearing spike when using a flip flop won't raise a red flag!" - It is a hole barrage of things raising red flags, not just the spikes alone. The main factor for flag raising is a unusual high electricity bill for the type of building where the meter is...and not spikes in usage.

 

[canadasfinest]

Flip flops work great, however they won't make a difference for those who have smart meters.

A 1kw grow won't raise any flags, smart meter or not.

Now if one has a larger grow the flip flops will avoid showing start up spikes but they WILL NOT lower your electric bill.

In other words: Flip Flop or not you still gotta pay that bill.
And for those planning to post "Hey but the non appearing spike when using a flip flop won't raise a red flag!" - It is a hole barrage of things raising red flags, not just the spikes alone. The main factor for flag raising is a unusual high electricity bill for the type of building where the meter is...and not spikes in usage.

lol i know a flip flop system isn't going to save me any money. so you're saying there will be no noticeable spike or twitch when the load is transferred on a flip flop?

 

[Bullfrog44]

Yes, when you first kick on your lights there will be an initial large draw. Then after firing up the ballast the power spike will level off. However if you look at your usage on line with a smart meter you will be able to see your spikes of energy. However, refer back to what Strainhunter said.

 

[canadasfinest]

that's still not answering the question. the ballast never turns off with a flip flop so the "firing up" you're talking about only happens once over a several month period. guess i could get one of those plug in kill-a-watt meters and see if anything happens when the load is switched.. thanks nonetheless guys

 

[The Phoenix]

Yeah, I wouldn't worry about any smart meter issues running 1-2 1kw ballasts in flip-flop. Just pay your bill on time.

I would suggest though that you use a surge relay for any 1kw ballast using 110 volt though, especially houses with aluminum wiring at the receptacle. They get quite hot and the relays prevent the surges from causing any problems if the light system does cause one.

The good flip-flop boxes are meant to prevent surges during the bulb switch.

We enjoy double the harvest per ballast every 60 days with our strains with no issues yet.

 

[canadasfinest]

Yeah, I wouldn't worry about any smart meter issues running 1-2 1kw ballasts in flip-flop. Just pay your bill on time.

I would suggest though that you use a surge relay for any 1kw ballast using 110 volt though, especially houses with aluminum wiring at the receptacle. They get quite hot and the relays prevent the surges from causing any problems if the light system does cause one.

The good flip-flop boxes are meant to prevent surges during the bulb switch.

We enjoy double the harvest per ballast every 60 days with our strains with no issues yet.

that's more the answer i was after. thanks

 

[Strainhunter]

that's more the answer i was after. thanks

I still don't get what you are trying to accomplish with that.

What is a surge which is not going to show on your smart meter going to accomplish for you?


Mind elaborating?

 

[canadasfinest]

I still don't get what you are trying to accomplish with that.

What is a surge which is not going to show on your smart meter going to accomplish for you?


Mind elaborating?

all i wanted to know is if someones usage was under investigation and they were running a flip flop system would it look like just one steady stream of power or would there be a twitch every 12 hours when the load is transferred. i dont know how to make this any easier to understand...

 

[The Phoenix]

There is so much power surging going on from refrigerators, home theater, pool pumps, and the like, that it would be hard to distinguish one from another IMO.

If you have the ability to run your lights in 220 volt, then I would do it. At a house with a lot of appliances running, 220 is way better for clean power to your ballast.

 

[Strainhunter]

all i wanted to know is if someones usage was under investigation and they were running a flip flop system would it look like just one steady stream of power or would there be a twitch every 12 hours when the load is transferred. i dont know how to make this any easier to understand...

Once someones usage IS under investigation...are you really that naive thinking a not showing surge is going to accomplish anything?

That's the part I don't understand.

 

[canadasfinest]

Once someones usage IS under investigation...are you really that naive thinking a not showing surge is going to accomplish anything?

That's the part I don't understand.

I'm almost positive they're going after 12/12 usage in my area. meaning they're looking (using a program to look for patters or whatever) at everyone's usage.

 

[rock solid]

very good thread this

 

[rock solid]

There is so much power surging going on from refrigerators, home theater, pool pumps, and the like, that it would be hard to distinguish one from another IMO.

If you have the ability to run your lights in 220 volt, then I would do it. At a house with a lot of appliances running, 220 is way better for clean power to your ballast.

what that man said.

 

[Fattie]

If not already, they will DEFINITELY be checking for 12/12 patterns before long...

All he is asking is IF there will be the surge every 12 hours on the dot... simple question.

To say that "oh well they don't worry about 12/12 just go for it" is ridiculous.

 

[Strainhunter]

what that man said.

No not what that man said.

A (light) ballast has a completely different (digital) signature from any appliance.
And please, before someone's gonna post: "But I use magnetic ballasts!" you need to understand how those "signatures" work.

No flip flop will help in regards of hiding/covering/camouflaging anything, period.
If you have a light ballast whether it be digital or not it WILL be recognized with a smart meter, flip flop or not.
Not any and every smart meter though. But you as the end user will not know which program the smart meter you have has installed.

There is a whole lot (more) to say about those things but the above is in simple words what it basically boils down to.

 

[Strainhunter]

......

If you have the ability to run your lights in 220 volt, then I would do it. At a house with a lot of appliances running, 220 is way better for clean power to your ballast.

Clean power?

I don't know what your definition of "clean power is" but what I can tell you is that 220V is nothing else but 2x110V phase = 220V.

There's absolutely nothing more or less clean about 220V vs 110V unless you are talking solar power or something...

 

[supersmallgiant]

Wouldn't running the ballasts from a ups work too? There wouldn't be a sudden 12/12 signature since the ups would smooth things out.

 

[Strainhunter]

UPS are back ups.

Once you take something from somewhere it has to be replaced hence the UPS batteries being re-charged. And even IF a UPS would be used...it would have to be HUGE for a 1kw ballast.



What some of you need to step away from is not the surge being the obvious giveaway but the potentially excessive usage.
The surge is just one of the patterns being looked for but it is by far not the only one.


The only way hiding excessive usage is stealing power...but not a flip flop nor anything else.

 

[rives]

that's still not answering the question. the ballast never turns off with a flip flop so the "firing up" you're talking about only happens once over a several month period.

The ballast itself doesn't generate any significant load - the load comes from the lamp. If you extrapolate this thinking out, you would have a large electrical bill from simply plugging in the ballast with no lamp connected - it doesn't work that way. You could run the ballast behind a large, battery-powered inverter with an online battery charger to cover the signature, but as Strainhunter said, you still have the usage.