speak now or forever hear your peice!

[toohighmf]

I have access to test a bunch of ferts, stims, amendments, etc...
With the exception of house & garden & canna..
I'd love to hear what all the new school heads are rockin.
Whatchoo got for this old fart?

 

[PuReKnOwLeDgE]

Floranova Grow and Floranova Bloom by Genhydro. Both are 1 part nutrients, part chem and part organic. Pretty PH stable does the trick nicely. Floranova Bloom @ 8mL/gallon is the "Lucas Formula", a good starting point but tweeking is always nice. I have been adding back nutes and doing very little nute changes in an RDWC system for years now with this stuff. Try it

 

[mg75]

pureblendpro gives me the best tasting buds. not the biggest... but best!

 

[desertsquirrel]

what media toohigh?

good to see you testing again.

 

[ShroomDr]

How about a simple one?

Same cutting
Coco substrate
control vs. [insert carb product HERE] vs. epsom salt.
-
Id also like to see some tests with root accelerators. Many are expensive as shit, and im not willing to drop the cheddar.
If youve got an EZ cloner, take rooted clones, (possibly trim the roots so they are all equal mass) put them in coco with clear cups.


On a side note, for all those who love additives, check out evlme2 thread in the pix sub-forum Outlaw's Gorilla Grape and some Pre 98 Bubba...

 

[Rowdy420]

PBP = tastey

 

[EastCoastMeds]

I have run PBP, FoxFarm, House & Garden and for shits n giggles MaxiGro n MaxiBloom.....

always come back to Fox Farm. Blows the roof off the quality department IMO. And my yields are still very respectable (<1elbowper1K)

 

[toohighmf]

what media toohigh?

good to see you testing again.

Yo DS! Wass up Holmes? I am going to run 4x4x2.5 rockwool cubes

SD how you holding up bro? Love the weights. Why didn't I think of that? Me new mums will soon be strung w thems suckas!

 

[spurr]

My current test mix ...

Having another ICer testing my mix is welcome. I would bet a few hundred dollars my mix will beat all other commercial available mixes, including beating the hell out of GreatfulHead's mix:

1. My formula is to be used from veg to harvest, no adding P or K boosters during pre-flowering or flowering.
2. To see pics of plants with my mix, and pics of plants with sufficient P (< 60 ppm), see my signature.

• GH Micro 5 ml/gal
• GH Gro 5 ml/gal
• GH Bloom 7 ml/gal
• CalMag Plus 5 ml/gal
• Pro-TekT 2.5 ml/gal
  • or AgiSil 16H (here) providing ~29 ppm Si (I can do the math for you, if you plan to use AgiSil) or Dutch Master Silica at 7.5 ml/gal -- add the Si source to water first, then pH adjust and add other ferts. AgiSil 16H is the best choice.
• Epsom salt 0.5 g/gal
  • use hot water and shake or use blender to fully dissolve
• Boric acid 0.015 g/gal
  • you can get human-food grade boric acid at a pharmacy for cheap; use hot water and shake or use blender to fully dissolve
• Fulvic acid 10-30 ml/gal
  • "Ful-Power" from BioAg is by far the best, it can be found here from BioAg and here from HorticultureSource
• Humic acid (optional but suggested)
  • "HumiSolve" from BioAg is by far the best, it can be found here from BioAg and here from HorticultureSource

** use citric acid to lower pH, along with traditional pH down (ex., p.acid) if needed (re pH swing upward).​

Here is the ppm by element of my test mixes with Pro-TeKt and D.M. Silica

I made the chart so a grower can try various combinations (in terms of application rate) of the listed fertilizers to find what they think is ideal for their plants, in terms of elemental ppm, total ppm, ratios of 2 elements and relativity of 3 elements (ex., K|Ca|Mg).

Ex., one could add up say, the ppms from 6 ml GH Micro, 5 ml GH Grow, 8 ml GH Bloom, 2 ml CalMag+, 3 ml ProTeKt and 1 g Epsom salt (or other combinations thereof); and then find ratios, etc. All the fertilizers need not be used; ex., one doesn't have to use ProTeKt or Epsom.

In that screen shot the blue highlighted columns are my current test mix (re application rate per gallon) and the relevant ppms of elements from the fertilizers at the listed application rate. The green highlighted column under "Totals (ppm)" lists the total elemental ppm of my current mix when all ferts are added together. The other green highlighted column under "Ratios (":1" is assumed)" is the the 2 element ratios (ex., NO3:NH4, NO3:S, K:Mg, etc.) as well as 3 element relativity (ex., N|P|K and K|Ca|Mg) of my mix as compared to the same from the pH/Lucas mix. The orange highlighted text/numbers is the total ppm of my mix per element as compared to the total ppm of the pH/Lucas mix per element.


With Pro-TeKt:

With Dutch Master Gold Range Silica:

 

[spurr]

PBP = tastey

FWIW, GrowGreen's (a member that was on OG, CW and C-W, IIRC) mix with PBP for hydro is below. She was trying to match PH/Lucas formula. GrowGreen was/is the shit, she really was/is on her game (IIRC GrowGreen was a lady). She had an elaborate elemental testing kit for fertilizater solutions.

15 ml/gal PBP Bloom
5 ml/gal CalMag Plus

Please see the following thread by Lucas at C-W; incl. info on GrowGreen's mix of PBP, she and Lucas were/are buddies, IIRC:

"Calculating Nutrient profiles for Canna, GH and PBP" link

Here is PureBlendPro Bloom @ 15ml/gal

[N] 129
[P] 45
[K] 214
[Ca] 26

and PBPBloom 15, plus 5 cal mag (GrowGreen's formula) it resembles the grow formula of FloraNova @8ml, as well as GH's 15Grow, 10Micro, 5 bloom formulations, the most copied recipe Ive found. It seems competition only copied GH's veg formula for the most part..

Note also that GrowGreen has contributed a total nutes per crop spec, of 15ml per 40 gallons, or 20 ounces of PBPBloom per 1k crop.. a very interesting spec, resulting in about 5000 total ppm of N per croplife..

[N] 161
[P] 45
[K] 214
[Ca] 45

I dont know why Canna and PBP use such lower P and Mg levels than GH, nor do Canna and PBP hit Mel Franks 100-100-200-60 targets the way GH does. Yet folks with Canna and PBP produce excellent results, just like folks with GH do.

Lucas was unaware that 100 ppm P is too high, esp during pre-flowering. Levels of P higher than 80 ppm shouldn't be used, IMO/IME for the best bud (re internodal stretch, bud structure, grwoth, etc.).

 

[xcrispi]

FNB / Flora Nova Bloom
All I use anymore . I refuse to buy the grow as I have limited headroom and don't want the extra N as I fear added stretch from it . In the end of bloom I end up damn close to the 8ml per gal. P/K speaks of . Using FNB and a hint of powdered Koolbloom late in bloom I yielded 1.3 GPW last time around .
Big fan of the K.I.S.S principle and FNB fits right in .
Crispi

 

[Mountain]

FWIW, GrowGreen's (a member that was on OG, CW and C-W, IIRC). GrowGreen was/is the shit, she really was/is on her game (IIRC GrowGreen was a lady). She had an elaborate elemental testing kit for fertilizater solutions.

If this is who I think you're talking about thought she retired a few years ago? If it is who I think you're talking about she was using a Lamotte test kit...correct?

 

[spurr]

Yes, I think we are referring to the very same person.

 

[Mountain]

Yes, I think we are referring to the very same person.

We were gonna connect when she came through town and blew her off...ooops...I can't even remember why...then she retired a few weeks later...D'Oh! First and only person I've seen using that kit. She said I would not be able to tell the difference between her 'salt' grown and PBP organic based grown herb. Probably one of the few people I'd believe about that. Wish I had connected with the bunny...oh well. Great grower for sure!

As for this thread topic...can't contribute except maybe...I will agree with this though...

• Fulvic acid 10-30 ml/gal
  • "Ful-Power" from BioAg is by far the best, it can be found here from BioAg and here from HorticultureSource
• Humic acid (optional but suggested)
  • "HumiSolve" from BioAg is by far the best, it can be found here from BioAg and here from HorticultureSource

I'd be looking at their fulvic more as a foliar application along with other ingredients.

 

[toohighmf]

love my humics... love simplicity. currently running FNB, calmg+, liquid humus, diamond black, nutri+ bud+ & the finisher. flushed w molasses 1 week, straight RO until the wheels fall off!

 

[quantic_soul]

add the Si source to water first, then pH adjust and add other ferts.

Spurr, what is the reason for adding Si first and pH adjusting? I use 50/50 RO water/Tap as I know you do as well. I have been adding CalMag+ first for buffering ability. I am remembering my old practice of bubbling Si in water for a half hour before adding other nutrients. Maybe you can easily clear this up.

So my two main questions are :

• Why exactly does Si have to be added to water before other nutrients?
• Why do you pH the water at that point?

By the way I have been testing out your method vs my old method which was using PBP line so I will be able to further contribute to the discussion on that topic later on.

 

[spurr]

Adding Si (from potassium silicate) will raise pH, often > 8. So if you added Si after adding other ferts, the pH would be too high until you lower it. In the time some of the ions could become insoluble due to the high pH.

Adding Si first, then pH adjusting is good because it can help reduce ions falling out of solution. The difference may be minimal, but I think it's worth it.

Looking forward to reading what you think about my method vs. your older method. BTW, what do you mean by "my method"?

 

[ShroomDr]

I add Si last, right before i pH.
My tap is ~0.3ec. ~7.6pH.
My nutrient mix (including tap) pre Si is ~1.7ec. ~6.9pH.
Ive never had Si raise the pH to 8. Its normally only a few tenths.

So... while i see what your trying to avoid, i dont think the pH upswing caused by the Si is significant enough to cause fallout.

I guess either way will work, and again, i see what your trying to do, but id rather pH just once, rather than a possible two times..
(With stable tap water, i can estimate how much pH down im going to use anyway, negating the need for two pH adjustments.)

 

[quantic_soul]

thanks for the reply. I did remember the pH increase from Si. That's why it is recommended as a good pH UP. The interesting thing is I haven't noticed that pH rise since I started adding CalMag first. I had also ran out of ProTekt and grabbed a bottle of AN from a friends house at the same time so maybe it is the diluted Si in the AN bottle. I will have to check to see if it raises the pH when added to plain water.

Either way I will be doing as you recommend as you just cleared that up for me very simply. thank you.

BTW "method" was meant to say "formula" or your nutrient schedule. The Spurr Formula

 

[quantic_soul]

Spurr I think you should start a thread called The Spurr Formula. That would be a good place to keep updated with any tweaks you make to your mix. I think it would also make it easy to search as more people start testing it