medical marijuana and Republicans: fast track to reversals, harassment

[whateverman]

Republicans and personal liberties just don't mix.

Michigan residents, how secure do you think your law is? I suspect your Republican masters have taken note of their conservative sister in Arizona, who basically overturned the will of the voters.


http://www.myfoxdetroit.com/dpp/new...right-to-grow-medical-marijuana-20110614-wpms


DETROIT (WJBK) - Michigan voters said yes to lighting up, but the debate over medical marijuana is far from settled. The ACLU of Michigan is fighting ordinances they say makes patients and their caregivers criminals even if they grow the pot in accordance with the state law.
"We are not hippies. We are not getting high," said Robert Lott. "This is strictly for medical use."
His wife, Linda, suffers from debilitating, progressive multiple sclerosis. Confined to a wheelchair, blind and in pain, medical marijuana is her only hope.
"The marijuana truly alleviates her pain almost immediately," Robert Lott told us.
When the voters of Michigan approved medical marijuana, the Lotts finally had hope.
"To get out of pain, the terrible pain that my spasms cause and not be considered a criminal," said Linda Lott. "We're still going back and forth on that."
The Lotts said they would be considered criminals under ordinances in Birmingham, Bloomfield Hills and Livonia, the cities where they live and work, if they were to grow marijuana in accordance with state law.
The ACLU of Michigan is fighting those ordinances.
"How can you say that they are not being denied their rights or privileges under the medical marijuana act?" ACLU attorney Andy Nickelhoff argued in court.
The judge said she would make a ruling on June 30. The Lotts said it can't come soon enough.
"So, we're really criminals still in our own home," Robert Lott said. "To alleviate her pain, she has to be a criminal because she's at the max of prescription pain."
Nickelhoff said that is really what's against the law.
"Michigan also says that they can't be prosecuted or punished for exercising that right. Couldn't be clearer," he said.

 

[whateverman]

I also like how they try to establish credibility with their half-wit Republican neighbors by saying "we're not hippies. "

Because hippies are definitely what's wrong with the world today, lol.


And then the addendum "...we're not getting high."

Yes you are. Are you inhaling THC into your lungs? Then you are getting high. As shit, hopefully.

I appreciate what they are trying to say, but there is no need to demonize people who catch a buzz after work in the process. There is no such thing as a pot smoker who is not a medical patient, when you really break it down.

 

[DiscoBiscuit]

Touchy subject. Respectable, conservative cannabis lovers and their less than cannabis embracing representatives.

 

[whateverman]

Touchy subject. Respectable, conservative cannabis lovers and their less than cannabis embracing representatives.

Yep. I am not a conservative, but I feel bad for conservative friends who smoke. They are embarrassed by how clear the disparity is between Dems and Rep's in Congress. Not that Dems are our friends, of course, but the verdict is in: Besides literally like 2 people, if an MMJ platform has established, it's a Democratic cause.


And it's not as though conservatives are just sitting by the fire merely not supporting, either. They are actively campaigning against cannabis in huge numbers.


I love this famous line from influential conservator Governor Perry of Texas: "If you like gay marriage and medical marijuana, move to California, ya'll."

It's kind of hard to rattle on about Rand and personal freedom within the realm of capitalism while those who best espouse your views in congress simultaneously do everything humanly possible to send you to prison for an extended period of time.

 

[paladin420]

Huh. lets see, I am a conservative. Some call me Hippy. We are watchin 'our' reps and will vote accordingly. And your second post proves that you Sir are a fuk nut. Good night

 

[whateverman]

Huh. lets see, I am a conservative. Some call me Hippy. We are watchin 'our' reps and will vote accordingly. And your second post proves that you Sir are a fuk nut. Good night

A personal attack in the form of an unlettered one-liner is always appreciated. I'm sure people take your views very seriously on here, and in life.

 

[paladin420]

A personal attack in the form of an unlettered one-liner is always appreciated. I'm sure people take your views very seriously on here, and in life.

yup just po white trash

 

[DiscoBiscuit]

It's definitely complicated. My democratic governor is conservative. I can't find it on google but I believe I heard her say she'd veto any mmj bill that crosses her desk. That's not what makes her conservative. Her record and her personal declaration have a little more to do with it.

We're all mixed up in my state when it comes to reform. The most progressive bill we yet introduced (250 sq ft canopy!) met the most conservative legislature since post civil-war. I don't know how the bill's language compares to states getting heat from the feds for what's considered large, for-profit enterprise. But I could damn sure enterprise me some 25 x 10 vertical.

On the national end, Rep Frank (MA) pretty much introduces some form of decriminalization or mmj bill every session. Yet dems as a whole aren't exactly the weed warriors we need to pass meaningful reform.

But you're right to point out that some state actions are being rolled back (or at least roll back proposals.) I'd like to see how these votes pan by stripe. Not to be politically divisive myself, I'd just like to vote the bums out where bums roll back their own reforms. Especially voter initiatives. Those folks spoke and have a right to representation of choice. It's just a shame when things go backwards sometimes.

 

[paladin420]

I also like how they try to establish credibility with their half-wit Republican neighbors by saying "we're not hippies. "

Because hippies are definitely what's wrong with the world today, lol.


And then the addendum "...we're not getting high."

Yes you are. Are you inhaling THC into your lungs? Then you are getting high. As shit, hopefully.

I appreciate what they are trying to say, but there is no need to demonize people who catch a buzz after work in the process. There is no such thing as a pot smoker who is not a medical patient, when you really break it down.

Really 'no hard feelings'? That's all this post is. And you want me to articulate a proper responce to this drivel?
Are you a school teacher?

 

[DiscoBiscuit]

No need to demonize anybody except the monsters under my bed. Have to keep reminding myself I've gots a waterbed. FLAT DEMONS! :

 

[rives]

There is no such thing as a pot smoker who is not a medical patient, when you really break it down.

This is horse shit. I think that anyone that truly believes this hasn't really found the need to use it medicinally. I know the difference - the first 30 years or so were recreational, and the last 15 have been medicinal. I always find it amusing to see people on here who cannot understand why anyone would have the slightest interest in strains that don't get you high - when you live on pain killers you get to the point where you savor lucidity. Why do you suspect it is so hard to find a CBD-rich strain, yet the whole reason that the cannabis "movement" has gotten to this point is "medical".

As far as the Republicans and Democrats go, it would take some delicate instrumentation to tell the difference. They are all liars, the Republicans are just a little more predictable while the Democrats tilt whichever way the wind blows. I think it was Eldridge Cleaver who said that he would sooner trust a conservative than a liberal - at least you knew what the conservative was going to do.

 

[whateverman]

It's definitely complicated. My democratic governor is conservative. I can't find it on google but I believe I heard her say she'd veto any mmj bill that crosses her desk. That's not what makes her conservative. Her record and her personal declaration have a little more to do with it.

We're all mixed up in my state when it comes to reform. The most progressive bill we yet introduced (250 sq ft canopy!) met the most conservative legislature since post civil-war. I don't know how the bill's language compares to states getting heat from the feds for what's considered large, for-profit enterprise. But I could damn sure enterprise me some 25 x 10 vertical.

On the national end, Rep Frank (MA) pretty much introduces some form of decriminalization or mmj bill every session. Yet dems as a whole aren't exactly the weed warriors we need to pass meaningful reform.

But you're right to point out that some state actions are being rolled back (or at least roll back proposals.) I'd like to see how these votes pan by stripe. Not to be politically divisive myself, I'd just like to vote the bums out where bums roll back their own reforms. Especially voter initiatives. Those folks spoke and have a right to representation of choice. It's just a shame when things go backwards sometimes.

Agreed. I've noticed many Republicans lately dismiss people who support things like cannabis legalization as "libertarians" who "don't care about culture." This is a strange label to me.

Really 'no hard feelings'? That's all this post is. And you want me to articulate a proper responce to this drivel?
Are you a school teacher?

It's "response." And yes, I do. I'm sorry if you took offense to the term "half-wit" in characterizing the woman's neighbors. It was tongue-in-cheek. As to the rest of it: that all cannabis consumption is a form of self-medicating, and that hippies are not a huge problem in society- yes, I stand behind those statements.

I played nice with you by ignoring and subsequently dismissing your E-posturing as the resulting disposition of not being able to speak to men like me in such a tone IRL. You got a "pass," and I gave you the opportunity to be a big boy and discuss a very important issue facing our community.You've decided you're not quite "there yet" emotionally or cognitively. Fine. Now please get your parting one-liner, and leave the thread. Make it a good one.

 

[whateverman]

This is horse shit. I think that anyone that truly believes this hasn't really found the need to use it medicinally. I know the difference - the first 30 years or so were recreational, and the last 15 have been medicinal. I always find it amusing to see people on here who cannot understand why anyone would have the slightest interest in strains that don't get you high - when you live on pain killers you get to the point where you savor lucidity. Why do you suspect it is so hard to find a CBD-rich strain, yet the whole reason that the cannabis "movement" has gotten to this point is "medical".

I think we need to delineate between chemo patients who can't eat, and people who are self-medicating, often subconsciously, for a host of less-than-obvious issues. Usually psychological. I readily concede that the former is a more pressing concern, but I think it's short-sighted to dismiss the decision to get high as being a decision completely divorced from a kind of "mental health" decision.

There are layers here. In practical application, it takes a special kind of sadomasochistic monster to deny an AIDS patient MMJ. The decision to deny a depressed artist searching for inspiration in his sativa's is...something different. Agreed. But ultimately, it's the same broad umbrella.

I don't think we really disagree, ultimately. It's a semantics thing, but I think it's one worth noting.

As far as the Republicans and Democrats go, it would take some delicate instrumentation to tell the difference. They are all liars, the Republicans are just a little more predictable while the Democrats tilt whichever way the wind blows. I think it was Eldridge Cleaver who said that he would sooner trust a conservative than a liberal - at least you knew what the conservative was going to do.

This is not true. We don't have to debate it; look at the numbers. We can start at any level you choose. Let's start with California. Liberal counties elect politicians who uphold the most loose cannabis laws in the state. The places to avoid growing in California? Republican counties, almost exclusively. Same is true Colorado; the most liberal section of the state, Boulder County, has the most lenient pot laws. And it goes on like this accordingly almost everywhere in the United States.

This conversation always unfolds the way it has because we canna-users know better than to "pick a side." We know both sides dont' truly care about us. It's hard, I think, for us who watch Obama BS about MMJ to give Dem's credit. But I think it's important to recognize that there is simply no comparison between Republicans and Democrats on MMJ in general.

 

[rives]

I disagree with both of your points. The "all use is medical" argument is like extrapolating the fact that a bit of wine is good for your digestion to saying "all alcohol intake is medical". Bit of a stretch, no?

I've lived in NorCal all my life, and unless I am mistaken this is widely considered the place to be for cannabis cultivation. In general, the area is pretty blue and liberal meccas like the Bay aren't held in high regard by the constituency.

 

[DiscoBiscuit]

Agreed. I've noticed many Republicans lately dismiss people who support things like cannabis legalization as "libertarians" who "don't care about culture." This is a strange label to me.

Not sure I understand. Not many folks wear their voter preference on the sleeve here. IMO we're a pretty good representation of the nation and international perspectives as well. IMO, the majority here may read these discussions but posts are somewhat limited to more vocal opinions. I like diverse perspectives and hope that diversity can work to advance our goal.

Politicization has a way of dividing many subjects amongst the electorate. This issue won't be any different. But I'm learning that observation, more importantly the way observation is expressed tends to guide threads like this into discussion or argument.

 

[danut]

In 2008 the democrats basically took over Washington DC.

We the people gave them all the power they needed to fix the marijuana laws.

What did they do? The Holder memo.

 

[pearlemae]

The right goes further to the right( it's not my fathers republican party anymore),the left follows. What was the left is now the center and the right goes further right it seems that the ultra conservatives that are leading us down the path to a complete corporate take over and unfunding of our government...Oh wait it's already happening and we are going to feel the pain as the laws are changed to dismantle what's going to be left of the social safety net.

 

[brotherindica]

There is no such thing as a pot smoker who is not a medical patient, when you really break it down.

Couldn't disagree more.

Believe everyone should have the right to smoke, but some actually need it, daily, to function anywhere near normal. When you can't get out of bed, eat, or go the bathroom without some form of medication, with cannabis working best, then I'd say you're different than the 'average' person who wants to have a toke.

Nothing wrong with having a smoke, but please don't tell anyone you're the same as someone who needs it to try and live a normal life.

 

[supersmallgiant]

All republicans are not created equal. Here we have republican reps bringing in pro marijuana bills and a republican governor that says he is ready to sign...

 

[whateverman]

I disagree with both of your points. The "all use is medical" argument is like extrapolating the fact that a bit of wine is good for your digestion to saying "all alcohol intake is medical". Bit of a stretch, no?

I don't think that analogy is, err, analogous. Your example is a false conflation rooted in degrees; a little vs a lot. My statement merely accepts free will (as traditionally understood) as non-science mythology, and argues that people choosing to catch a buzz are making a psychological (and therefore medical), (usually) subconscious decision. In doing so, I'm in no way trying to minimize the very large distinction between a chemo patient and a guy who is bored.

I'm just saying broadly, while severity differs, from boredom to apathy to Hep C, it's all "medical."

I've lived in NorCal all my life, and unless I am mistaken this is widely considered the place to be for cannabis cultivation. In general, the area is pretty blue and liberal meccas like the Bay aren't held in high regard by the constituency.

You guys are still "blue" up there.

The right goes further to the right( it's not my fathers republican party anymore),the left follows. What was the left is now the center and the right goes further right it seems that the ultra conservatives that are leading us down the path to a complete corporate take over and unfunding of our government...Oh wait it's already happening and we are going to feel the pain as the laws are changed to dismantle what's going to be left of the social safety net.

I think it's Chomsky (Krugman, maybe) who says "..there is the Business Party, and then there is the Republicans."

but please don't tell anyone you're the same as someone who needs it to try and live a normal life.

I make no such claim. I clarified this statement in further posts.

All republicans are not created equal. Here we have republican reps bringing in pro marijuana bills and a republican governor that says he is ready to sign...

Definitely true! But the trend is broadly pretty clear.

You Maine boys are a different breed up there though. True live and let live conservatives. Respect.