Filter System questions

[Browser]

I have a grow room mylar with the following dimensions: 110 cm long x 65 cm width x 120 cm high, 3 openings: 2 of 120 mm and 1 expandable up to 160 mm.

Seeing that silence and odour are 2 key factors, I'm opting for a silent box. However, being relatively new to this game, I still have some questions:

What are the main differences between metal and wood (MDF) boxes?

What size of box should I use? The 2 smaller ones are 250m3 and 500m3
What are the advantages/disadvantages of of each?

Are there filter box models with dimmers? How do I get it to work at different speeds?

What size of filter should I use? 200m3, 250m3 or 300m3? Any brand that you would recommend? I'm looking at Carbon Active and Rhino, and looking for smallest but effective.

What is the relation between the size of the extractor and the size of the filter?

What is the added benefit of using those “socks” on top of the filter, do the filter lasts longer?

What kind of tubbing to use? Any brand names you can recommend and available in 125mm diam?

Seeing the small space available, is there a point to use a silencer? How about a muffler?

As you can see, I have some rather specific questions after doing my homework. I would very much appreciate input from folks with more XP on this, and who can provide a tip or 2.

Thanks!

B

 

[gaiusmarius]

no expert on the box fans, tend to use the round ones. but some of the box ventis are already insulated to be more silent. normally the venti is made of metal, the insulation bow out of wood or metal, not sure which i'd use. wood is probably quieter.

have seen models of ventilators that have different speeds, otherwise you need a mechanical dimmer/speed controller. the wrong kind of dimmer will make the ventilation run louder and possibly hum. the ones that really work are always heavy, the light weight ones are ok if you are only dimming a little, but as soon as you dim bellow 70% they start to make the ventilator hum.

go for the 300m3 with a good dimmer, it's great to be able to turn it up when you are trimming or if there is a heat wave.

it's best to have the filter be slightly over capacity for the ventilator. this gives you extra efficient smell neutralization, even on those days where climatic conditions make it hard for the filter to neutralize the smell, like very damp days. if im using a 1800q3 venti, ill take the 2000 or even 2400 q3 filter. last thing i want is the filter to get clogged up over time and start being less then 100% efficient.

good scrubbers have a dust catching layer over the top, this does make them last longer as it stops dust getting inside to the active carbon.

sono dec is insulated tubing, this is a great help to keep noise levels down.

silencer and muffler are the same thing, if your space is limited you don't need to bother with them. really up to you and how important noise is. the sono dec and dimmed ventilation will already help a lot in that department.

that get the ball rolling anyway. hope it helps.

 

[Core]

gaius has given some good info for ya


i'm running a Box and a RVK side by side....the 1000m³ is the box and the RVK is a 400m³
and double if not trippled the sound....
i do have to say that the ductingstubes of the Box are also insulated and that will cut the sound drasticly !

the wood ,metal thing is not in order here...the silent box is always a iron blower but laminated with wood and inside on the wood is a thick insulated layer to dampen the sound and vibrations...never seen one with a speed regulator though....some of the RVK's do have that...


them socks is to reduce the sound of the wind comming out....just use insulated ducting to reduce that

on the cannister to use....you should just watch out to not buy it too small....if you use a too small filter for the capacity of the blower you will use it up faster

 

[ChaosCatalunya]

Hi Browser,

Acoustic boxes work very well, but, as GM says, also use the acoustic ducting, it is really effective.. Obviously, keep any ducting to an absolute minimum in terms of length and bends, both significantly reduce performance.

A box made of wood, with the same amount of foam inside would be quieter IMO, wood is a great sound absorber, but metal transmits it very well and can also give off noisy vibrations. Always finish off any bare wood in your growroom with Varnish, sooner or later water will hit it, swell, split and rot, also molds love somewhere absorbent and organic to start, without it, they are far less likely to occur.

2 years ago I made a stealth window exhaust with further sound trapping from Leroy Merlin green fiber tiles sold to insulate wooden parquet floors and a nice thick Sony TV cardboard box, works a treat.

Fans and Filters need to be matched or the filter does not work properly, Can are meant to be the best, Odour Socks, fairly useless.

ONA gel works very well, but use it as a secondary, additional odour neutraliser.

Here is the homemade silenced exhaust Sony TV box. Air pumped in top left, goes horizontally along the top, down the right hand side, out bottom left [by white sticker] to a window kept open by the 8" plank you can see bottom LHS. This has worked fine for years, visitors admiring the sea from the balcony beside this, 2 feet away, hear and smell nothing.

Good luck mate, will keep an eye on this

 

[Browser]

Hey Guys

Many thanks for passing by and dropping some knowledge. If some of my questions can seem very basic, please take into account that I'm coming from the OD bush side of things.

So I have made a little summary with all your useful input:

Box filter:
Wood is quieter than metal, tho wood needs to be protected against rotting

Speed controler:
The ones that really work are always heavy

Extractor & Filter:
Fans and Filters need to be matched or the filter does not work properly. Extractor for 300m3 with a filter slightly over capacity for the ventilator. This gives you extra efficient smell neutralization, even on those days where climatic conditions make it hard for the filter to neutralize the smell. If you use a too small filter for the capacity of the blower you will use it up faster.

Tubing:
Keep any ducting to an absolute minimum in terms of length and bends, both significantly reduce performance.
Suggested: Sonodec. Sonodec GLX seems better for noise absortion than the TRD model.

-----

...and now it's time for some more questions:
From your posts, I get the impression that most of the noise comes from the wind blowing, rather than the actual equipment (extractor), and that if I want to add a speed controler, I'll have to add another piece of heavy machinery into play.

So, I'm considering to go for a round, RVK type of thing, not with a speed controller, but probably with a fan controler and thermostat, so that I can just set the temp and watch 'em grow

How does this sound to you?

Any experience with sonoflex tubing? Say my filter has 125mm diam, but my openings are 120 mm opening. Which diamer of tubing do I get? 125 or 127?

Cheers! B

 

[ChaosCatalunya]

Hi B, Sounds good mate, unlike many, I always run fans "just plugged in"........no controllers or thermostats interfering... Always thinking that a fan running at normal speed 24/7/365 is happier and stealthier than one that changes its droning noises every now and then, or always at 10 in the morning. My grows back in the UK were all in Suburbia, where keeping it stealthy from the neighbours is important. Constant noises are very quickly ignored by our brains.

 

[gaiusmarius]

the point about controllers is the climate as well as the noise. i always go over capacity for this reason. my fans don't run at more then a third of their capacity normally, unless i'm trimming, when i might turn it to 60%.

the point is a larger fan running at a third capacity with a proper speed controller is hardly audible. wider ducting is also quieter then thinner ducting. basically if it's winter and the lamps are in the off phase, i don't want my ventilation running at the same speed as when the lights are on, else they will get cold. but sure if having a ventilation on full power the whole time is just back ground noise and your temps stay constant, i guess it's fine. but for me i need more. i don't want it to be hear able from anywhere outside the room its running in. that includes in front of the house.

 

[Browser]

for your contributions Chaos and GM.

Both make valid points:

A constant noise is certainly less interfering than a noise that changes... Guess that's why them car alarms go piu-piu-piu, but also naah-naah-naah, too-too-too

And sure stealth is key. I'm talking stealth as with people standing next to it and not even noticing that there's anything runnning.

For this, while I haven't given up on the box idea (tho I haven't seen any coming with a temp control, and the options are either 250 or 500 m3), but I'm thinking that a extractor fan with temp (and revolution) control will not only help me address the temp difference during the seasons, but should also run rather smoothly, seeing that it would not be using more than 30% of its capacity.

Having it already instealled in the extractor also gives me more confidence about electic failures and incompatibilities leading to extra noise.

For this I'm thinking about the "G tools 420". Anyone has heard anything about it? It's supposed to be for 420m3 and has a temperature and minimum speed setting. Which makes me wonder: what happens if one sets the temp at one extreme and the speed at the other?

Next will be the filter. I'l thinking to put at 400 or 425 m3 on it, but I'll discuss that later, I want to hear your ideas on the extractor 1st.

Whatchathink?

B

 

[gaiusmarius]

never seen that brand before. looks like it has 2 speeds, so again if you don't mind running ventilation at full speed during lights on these would be ok. as long as there is no buzzing or humming when it runs on the lower speed. with ventilation it's good to go for well know reliable brands. the last thing you can afford to happen is a exhaust burning out.

what kind of lights you plan to use? have to buy some 600's soon, trying to get as much feed back as possible. so far i'm really liking the sound of the gavita 600 pro, not cheap though.

 

[Browser]

Hey Gaius

That's a good point, better to stick with known brands to prevent a problem later on... Ruck and RVK seem to be the better ones, no?

With regards to lighting, I'm planning on using 220w of T5s, which can be cut to half if heat is an issue. Mind you this is only a veg, clonnig, moms room. I can't really help you on the 600 lights, as I've no XP with them.

So, I've been looking at what's in the market extractor-wise, and have limited my choice to either:
A - An extractor with 4 speeds, or
B- An extractor with temp control

The advantages that I see for A are:
- I can regulate speed depending on needs: veg/flo, temp, noise
The disadvantages:
- The models with 4 speeds have a heavier, more noisy motor

For B, the advantage is:
- That I get to keep a constant, regulated temperature in the tent, resulting in better b-growth
The disavantage is that:
- if the noise level is higher than desired, I can't reduce it to a lower speed, other than by changing the temperature. Taking this into account, it would make sense to buy a bigger extractor than required, so that it doesn't have to work at max capacity.

Any opinions?

Something else that I need to figure out is the size (diam) for the tubing: So, I understand that a bigger diam is better to have less noise.

Would this be noticeable in the 100mm - 125mm diam range? Would it have any added benefit to go to 160mm diam and then use a reducer (to 125mm diam)?

Also, just to make sure I have it right, the setup should be like this, no?

<Filter>[extractor]-|tubing out|-->air direction (out)

Where the tubing is kept as short and straight as possible.

How flexible is this setup? I mean can I use the filter with tubing towards the extractor somewhere else to reduce noise? Or is it more the wind movement than the actual extraction noise that is a problem?

Getting there, pls don't give up just yet folks I just want to dig deep enough before jumping on something like this, and your experience is much welcome.