Air pumps and diffusers for DWC?

[mrcreosote]

My plan is to have 3-14 gal. roughneck tubs for flower and one 3 gal. w/ 2" net pots and aero for veg. One poster (I forget who, sry) mentioned Fusion makes a cheap quiet pump that has replaceable diaphragms which sound pretty good to me since I'm unemployed at present and have had huge medical expenses.

The 700 which is good for 100+ gal. aquariums has 2 outlets that I could join with a 1/2" pvc manifold to distribute to the veg space above and flower space below with a valve to limit air to the small tub. At $20.00 @Pet Mountain, I'm wondering if it will do the job and can be fixed if needed seems like a way to go if it will put out enough air. One poster mentioned that the guy who designed the tetra whisper pumps also designed these to be very quiet, which is necessary because the closet back is on my bedroom wall.
(A plus for wife factor)
Since many of you folks have gone through tons of different pumps, I 'm looking for ideas since I can't seem to find specifics on this pumps output.
Stones vs. flexible air curtain tubes? Are tubes worth the extra cost? Seems as if the tubes are easier on the pump (less air restriction claimed) and last longer would be a better spent buck but nothing beats experience with both and right now I would rather not experiment with trial and error.

Any thoughts are appreciated.

 

[FreezerBoy]

A 3 gal pot with 2" cups will be lucky to hold 2 gal of water, even less with aero. The smaller the res the faster the disaster. With multiple plants you run the risk of roots getting tangled which means ripping them apart to switch tubs. 2" cups will provide little if any stability, start thinking now of ways to hold plants up: string, trellis, ScrOG etc.

I don't know if there's a formula for pumps (like 50 wsf for lighting) I go 5X. My 18 gal tub holds 12 gal and uses a pump rated at 60 gal. My bubbler holds 2 gal and uses a 10 gal pump. My Whisper pumps are rather loud, not impressed on that score.

Stones and tubes both have a tendency to rise. They can be secured through tape, glue, silicon, hex nuts etc. I use 12" bars or 4" dia discs both of which are heavy enough that they sink to the bottom.

 

[mrcreosote]

Thanks for stopping in FreezerBoy,

Yeah, I'm thinking that a 3 gallon might be ok for vegging 2 plants for a couple or 3 weeks (or longer, depending on how they go) before switching em to the 14 gallon tub in flower. Do you think that I need to go bigger res /cups just for that short bit of time? I'm underestimating how much root I'll get in veg? I have really no idea as this will be a first go around.
I got the space so I'll go bigger. We'll see how the shelf holds up ...

I have a 2'x4'x8' closet that I'm going to set it up so I have 3 different 2 plant tubs (5" pots) in flower (below the veg shelf) in a staggered perpetual grow say 3 weeks apart for a 9 week strain.
I'd just like to have one air pump to run 3-14 gal tubs and a 3 gallon in veg that's not going to sound like a jackhammer compressor.
My understanding is the bigger commercial pumps are pretty loud so I'm hoping to get by with a pump that reviewers say is quieter than the Whisper pumps. Locating it in a hot attic above my closet would be a real PITA to get to if needed.

I really wish the Company would list a specific output for it so I could figure if it has enough to run the tubs. An Active Air w 4 outlets would put out 15 liters a min. which seems like it could do the job but I think those are toss aways if the diaphragm leaks.

Guess it's one of those things that you just buy and take your chances on.

 

[FreezerBoy]

You can run a couple of plants in a small tub for a few weeks but, air bubbles create currents which will tangle up the roots. This requires you to detangle daily which is a pain. I eventually made use of air pump filter bags as "condoms."



Be sure to give roots a thorough rinse to wash away any torn bits of roots from the mass before transplanting into a larger tub. Dead matter in the res is a no-no.

Wish I had more info on pumps for your situation. I would say be wary of placing the air pump any place that's too hot. Hot air will raise water temps. While warm water in DWC is not by itself a death sentence, it will greatly accelerate any other problem the res may have (like dead root bits)

 

[Original Past]

The key metric you're looking for, which isn't always readily available, is watts. You want about 1 watt of air pump power per gallon of nutes in your reservoir. Say you have 10 gallons in each of 3 reservoirs, you'll want a 30 watt air pump, or 3 10 watt air pumps. It's better to go a little over than a little under, too.

If a package doesn't list watts, open the box and look on bottom of the pump. Every one I've seen has the specs listed on the device itself.

Good luck!

Cheers,
Past

 

[stonedar]

root condoms...

 

[budshoteyes]

Excellent idea! FreezerBoy that is genius!

 

[mrcreosote]

Really is a great idea.

I hadn't really thought about the air swirling the roots together but that's one of those things you only have to see once to know you don't want to deal with again...

Wifey will be donating some pantyhose to the cause...I like the McGuyver netpots too...

I guess I'll goes big with the smaller commercial pump. 45 liters of air/min is a bunch of air, works out to 713 gal/hr.

 

[FreezerBoy]

Note that root tangling is only a problem if you want to transplant into another tub. Once in their final tub, let them tangle as much as they want.

 

[snoopytime]

I <3 the 'Alita Sintered' air stones. They are very well made and they never expire. You just gotta scrubb them for a good 30secs under hot water in between grows. They are like $9 from that hidhut place in florida for the 3.5" round ones.

 

[mrcreosote]

Sorry to not say thanks for the thoughts for a while but computer went to self destruct mode and the greater aggravation of "Yeah, I haven't had a chance to look at it yet, but I'll be sure to charge you too much when I do" hell.
Naturally my son lends his laptop to his girl at the same time...

FreezerBoy , I guess there's good reason you are the go to guy in house...
I found that "Large 'Tomato' plants recommended to have 4 gal. air/hr. per 1 gal. reservoir size to total."
Given that our particular plant would generally encounter higher temperatures/ less D.O. availability due to the sometimes confined nature of our gardens, Your 5:1 ratio seems right on the money. Not that I would doubt but, it's nice to have a confirmation from a horticultural source with fancy letters after his name...

Then again...ain't a lot of our present troubles in the economy caused by those same fancy lettered folks supplying advice to to the crooks with M.B.A.'s?

And they have the gall to call us criminals for wanting to grow flowers...

Snoopytime, thanks for the tip... Buy once, last forever is my kind of thinking. As much as I love being cheap, if it costs more in the long run, it ain't cheap. Since every tub will be cleaned, restarted every 3+/- weeks, a quick clean and scrub should keep em good. I was under the impression that all stones eventually clog and generally lose the ability to 'pass gas' so to speak. Nice to know that sintered stone will last from somebody who uses em and that the claims aren't just typical expensive marketing B.S.

I wouldn't mind tossing a few Madison Ave. types in the slammer along with the Wall St. crowd.
Must be time for a nap...I'm getting cranky...

 

[snoopytime]

Haha right on mann, good luck with your system!

 

[Young Pumpkin]

Just a thought. (another one, imagine that) I do clones 2 at a time in 3 inch net pots in a 1 gallon plastic shoe box thingy from wally world. To eliminate roots tangling each pot gets a good rotation of a 1/2 to a full turn at least once a day. I've kept the same bottom for a year but I always have to cut up the top apart to remove the plant/cup. The trained roots are several inches in diameter and fill up an 8 inch pot pretty well. Keep 'em spinning and they wont tangle........er, mine haven't.....