Coco deficiency

[doctorR]

Hi guys,
I'm actually having a nutrients deficiency on my ParadiseSeeds' Icecream (14 days old). I'm growing in cococoir preparing the solution before use it using RO water mixed with tap water (150ppm), adding nutrients and fertilizers Canna COCO A+B, Canna Rhizotonic, Cannazym (I'm still vegetating). Then I adjust solution's pH to 5.80 and then put the airstone of the aerator and let it go 8/12h. I'm using leds with a 20/4 light cicle and integrate with yeast co2.
These are my doses:
water ph 7,25 - EC 150ppm (0.3 ms)
rhizotonic 20ml/10L
coco a+b 20ml/10L
cannazym 25ml/10L

ghe ph-minus => PH 5.82 - EC 760ppm

I'm attaching a image of my deficiency. Those photos where taken once a day. Initially I was thinking it is a Cal/Mag def caused by a water too soft so are 2 days that I'm using only tap water (0.65 ms - 325ppm) trying to integrate these components (obviusly with all the other ferts!)
These are my doses:
water ph 7.55 - EC 320 ppm (0.65 ms)
rhizotonic 20ml/10L
coco a+b 22.5ml/10L
cannazym 25ml/10L

ghe ph-minus => PH 5.78 EC 930ppm (1.87 ms)

As you can see deficiency seems to not stop.. necrosis on the margin is rising to upper leaves, looking alike potassium def..
What do you think about that? What's wrong?

Thank you all!

 

[doctorR]

This is what I got this morning.. deficiency is not stopped

According to my grow-shop owner we decided to increase Coco A+B dosage to 35ml/10L (instead 22.5ml/10L) thinking it's a macro nut def caused by the fast growing of the plant (lot of light + co2 + good roots). We also decreased EC value of the water to 0.4 mS (using RO + tap) so what we have these new values:

PH 5.76
EC 2.25mS (1120 ppm)

This is also my last run-off (using the new dosage)
PH 5.85
EC 2.24mS (1120ppm)

Any other ideas?

 

[abuldur]

Are you using good quality coco ? Heard some were full of sea salt .

 

[doctorR]

Are you using good quality coco ? Heard some were full of sea salt .

Yes, I'm using fresh new coco coir enriched with trichoderma and washed with ph-fixed water before seeding..!

 

[ganja_hasi]

sorry dr, that's not a def, that's a nut burn, you just feed them to death! give them a good flush and then start feed them again @ 0,7-0,8 ..pH is fine.
gh

 

[doctorR]

sorry dr, that's not a def, that's a nut burn, you just feed them to death! give them a good flush and then start feed them again @ 0,7-0,8 ..pH is fine.
gh

Hi Hasi! I think it's really strange since before that we have tried using hard water I was using the minimum dosage of nutrients (20mL/10L) and Canna proposes a range from 20mL/10L to 30ml/L for this stage of veg. The water I was using is really soft (130/150ppm) and the final EC was in the lower part of recommended values.. I was using that nut-rate and symptoms comes out.. Runoff EC values are not increased so not seems to accumulate..
I'm a little bit scary since I can try this way but if it's wrong I think I'll not have another chance..!

 

[audiohi]

I agree with ganja_hasi... PPM is to high. I feed full grown plants less then that! Good luck.

 

[Herborizer]

Looks like a cal/mag issue. More on the mag side of things. On a .7 based meter I run 1200ppm and could easily go to 1400 ppm, using canna coco a/b.

Try a foliar spray of calmag, it will work like a quick shot of medicine to you plants. Remember, that damage there will never get better. Only your new growth should be your measurement of fixing this.

Then mix your base water (RO/tap mix) down some ppm. My magic base water ppm is 110-120. Also, rhizotonic raises ph a lot. You say you have a res, but dont mention how you feed. Are you hand feeding? If you are I would mix your res up and then come back 6 hours later and readjust ph. Do this again 24 and 48 hours later. At which point the ph should be stable. Then use that batch.

 

[Buddle]

1120 ppms is way too much for 14 day old seedlings..I try more like 350 until they show some recovery..GL

 

[doctorR]

Thank you all for your responses!

[...]
You say you have a res, but dont mention how you feed. Are you hand feeding?
[...]

yes, I'm hand watering vaporizing the solution (1.5L/day) directly on the coco trying not to get leaves too wet. Then I wait a little bit and put the plant in my microcab. I prepare the solution min. 4h before feed the plant, usually 24h before.. I adjust the PH before use the solution, waiting a bit to let it stabilize and measuring it with my Hanna's combo (ph - ec). Before deficiency appears 150ppm was my EC starting point and now I changed it 200ppm according to Canna's reference card but if it will disappear I'll try to get back to a lower value as you say.
My EC is measured with also Rhizo and Cannazym that are not properly nutrients so I hope my values are not alarming (in the past I used higher values without problems with other strains!)

 

[Strainhunter]

I did not read all the responses but those plants got the hell burned out of them.

Be careful or you might end up with hermies...

 

[doctorR]

Hi guys! Take a look to the new photo..!
It seems that chlorosis has stopped and new leaves are healthy.. Looking closely at the photo of yesterday and today it seems that the situation has stabilized

What do you think? Am I too much optimistic?

 

[doctorR]

Hi guys, I'm back
One week ago I decided to follow your hints so I flushed with about 25 liters of plain water (ph regulated - my pot is about 6.5L).. Then I began to give her a super light nutrient solution (0.75mS - 370 ppm - 5.80 ph). Plant looks much better and began to spread new healthy leaves.
Now something has changed: take a look to the photo.. Do you think is's simply a deficiency (so I can give her more nutrients - Canna raccomends at least 2ml/L for the veg fase, I'm actually giving her 0.7ml/L to have that EC)? Or do you think it's overfert once again??
I've got also another question: I'm currently hand watering daily with 1 liter of solution to have a 20/30% runoff.. Do you think It's better if I'll use for example 1.5/2L every 2 days? I'm using coco-coir so I think it's better if I don't let the soil dry too much..

 

[doctorR]

Nobody can give me an hint? If I watch middle leaves todays they seems burned as happened before but they are less green (expecially veins) and less crispy..
If it's nute burn once again what's wrong? I was givin her much less than raccomended dose.. Runoff's EC value (0.5-0.6mS) is less than nutrients solution's EC (0.7-0.8mS) so I think that plant "drink" all nutes I'm giving her..
Is it possible that the watering is too often so the plant behaves in this way?
Or do you think there is any other problem?

 

[turbolaser4528]

get yourself some Drip Clean by H@G. Always recommended for coco to remove residual salts.

Perhaps your coco has a build up of nutes from you feeding them so heavily?

nice improvement, keep it up.

 

[epicseeds]

You shouldnt have to feed/water every day. try every other or third day maybe?

 

[doctorR]

Yesterday I flushed again my plant with 120+ liters of ph'd RO+tap water (110ppm) , waited few hours and then feeded the plant with a very light solution (0.8mS). Now I think I'll wait as epicseed said 2 days or more and see if something changes!
Reading the forum I also found this thread
https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=138214
where problems are really really similar to what I have.. I'm not sure if someone has found a good solution or not

 

[Wav3F0rm]

i know this is an old thread, but, i am having this same issue.. I know my water is crazy, so, i PH over the period of 48 hrs, mandatory, have to COMPLETELY use up the waters buffering capacity. That was all solved and i was having magnesium lockouts like in that link.

I'm like you though, looking at any other plant pictures comes up with the same results, which looks like potassium def.. I am in half coco, not 100%, so, i dunno. I was thinking maybe i was over feeding to, but.. i am not completely sure what is going on atm ether, it is a really confusing issue..

https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=204061&highlight=potassium+def&page=2
this is the same issue, he seemed to have PH swing issues, attributed to his tap water.. for me i think my PH meter is off, there isn't any reason via runoff that the tap should have changed(unless they started adding more crap to the municiple water).