Is Chitosan considered organic?

[mosstrooper]

Could crude home made or even store bought Chitosan be considered to be an organic soil additive or amendment.

To make (as far as im aware) you boil you shrimp/crab/lobster/crayfish/grasshopper waste in caustic soda solution (for quite a long time) wash the caustic solution off and dissolve the remaining shell waste in (cider) vinegar. Then dialute 1-200/500 and use as a pre germ seed treatment, foliar spray, soil drench.

Commercial chitosan

 

[Clackamas Coot]

Is Chitosan considered organic?

Chitosan, depending on the specific extraction process, was approved in December, 2010 as a soil amendment, for HABA applications, et al. Pretty wild claims from the so-called 'health food' industry on Chitosan being a wonder drug to move people from being fat & stupid to being svelte and intelligent. Hopefully this is accurate and Glenn Beck and Rush LimpNutz will begin ingestion immediately. They can bring Sarah Palin along for the ride - "You betcha!"

Here's a link to the entire document with the cites and research that that was used for this approval - identified as EPA Document ID: EPA-HQ-OPP-2007-0566-0019

I and CaptCheeze1 add an organic crustacean meal to our potting soils where microbes breakdown both the chitin as well as the Calcium content in these shells.

HTH

CC

 

[Scrappy4]

Is Chitosan considered organic?

Chitosan, depending on the specific extraction process, was approved in December, 2010 as a soil amendment, for HABA applications, et al. Pretty wild claims from the so-called 'health food' industry on Chitosan being a wonder drug to move people to being fat & stupid to being svelte and intelligent. Hopefully this is accurate and Glenn Beck and Rush LimpNutz will begin ingestion immediately. They can bring Sarah Palin along for the ride - "You betcha!"

Here's a link to the entire document with the cites and research that that was used for this approval - identified as EPA Document ID: EPA-HQ-OPP-2007-0566-0019

I and CaptCheeze1 add an organic crustacean meal to our potting soils where microbes breakdown both the chitin as well as the Calcium content in these shells.

HTH

CC

Have you noticed any improvement in your garden after adding crustation meals? I've read the science behind it somewhere, probably on these pages. So what sort of improvements should one see? scrappy

 

[Clackamas Coot]

Have you noticed any improvement in your garden after adding crustation meals? I've read the science behind it somewhere, probably on these pages. So what sort of improvements should one see? scrappy

The easiest benefit to track is the dearth of gnats (fungus or otherwise). If for no other reason it's worth the $.50 to add a cup or so of crustacean meal to 1 c.f. of potting soil.

It's certainly a better option than the gibberish offered at cannabis sites around the web.

CC

 

[mosstrooper]

I and CaptCheeze1 add an organic crustacean meal to our potting soils where microbes breakdown both the chitin as well as the Calcium content in these shells.

This is just what i was hoping to hear, i can get untold quantitys of shrimp crab and lobster waste. I think im inclined to pre-compost it outside just to neutralise the smell.

I may buy commercial chitosan for my outdoor grows since there may not be enough time to make a good compost for the coming season.

Anything that gets rid of fungus gnats is a god send too, they are something of a plague where i live.

Clackamas Coot you have made my day.

 

[Clackamas Coot]

Composting would be even better. I can't recall the specific information but there is a definite link between chitin and soil fungi - in particular some strains of mycorrhizal fungi.

In general the addition of this to a thermal compost pile has been shown to facilitate fungi development in general.

Sounds like you have some good materials to work with. The bagged product that we use has been washed, ground to a very consistent size thereby making it easy to use.

CC

 

[Clackamas Coot]

mosstrooper

One thing that you mentioned in your original post was using a fermentation process (or using a fermented product to be more exact) as a means to extract the chitin from the shells following the first process. I'll pass on the caustic soda deal - LOL

This has been a question that I've often wondered about - "Would there be any benefit from fermenting crustacean meals as a means to extract the chitin content?"

I'm talking about using both the lactobacillus-based products like EM-1 with papain and would opt for fresh kiwi fruit as it's higher in papain than the traditional source of papaya.

I don't know how one would test the final fermented liquid for determining a chitin level - if any.

CC

 

[dirrtyd]

CC do you know of a place that sell this in the Bay Area? Thanks in advance

 

[Clackamas Coot]

CC do you know of a place that sell this in the Bay Area? Thanks in advance

dirrtyd

Crustacean meal is pretty standard fare in organic/sustainable farming operations. You might find it easier to look for 'Crab Meal' and while it's over-priced (IMHO) the Down-To-Earth company out of Eugene, Oregon offers a 25 & 50 lb. pack.

At this link you can find the list of their retail distributors in the Western States (primarily)

Still though - any decent farm store operation will carry some kind of crustacean meal and again it's more often sold as 'crab meal' as the shrimp & crab meal available in Oregon is a local product from the shrimp and Dungeness crab industry on the Washington & Oregon Coasts.

Commercially the only shells used come from shrimp, crab & lobster.

HTH

CC

 

[dirrtyd]

Thats where a few of my amendments all ready come from thanks CC. I took a look at the link and where I buy my amendments is the first store in California thanks. dirrtyd

 

[mosstrooper]

As far as im aware crab and shrimp shells etc are almost entirely made of chitin, and cautic soda is used to deacetylate the chitin into chitosan. Its the chitosan that is soluble in acid and benificial to plants or microlife.

Seemingly, this process can be achieved in a slower way using soil borne organisms.

However, i have only just become aware of this stuff as a result of my quest to find safe cheap fungicides, or in this case preventative treatments. So im no expert, and shouldnt be confused with someone who knows what they are talking about.

Making it yourself with caustic is pretty hazardous and probably not to be recommended.

 

[rocket high]

Looks like it has a good few uses as well

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2010/04/100416094012.htm

 

[rocket high]

Could this be a safer alternative than brewing your own ?http://www.powerhealth.co.uk/produc...oductid=1033&gclid=CKDpuO_KpqcCFdFX4Qod-0lmBQ

 

[mad librettist]

Is Chitosan considered organic?

chitin (ky-tin) is the basic substance from which arthropods make their shells. the link to fungi is that fungi are also made of chitin.

as far as I know, adding chitin to a mix has no direct effect on gnats or any other arthropods also made of chitin. the benefit is supposed to come from cutivating a good population of chitin eaters. the theory goes that having something around that likes to snack on insect shells puts pressure on the insect population.

the quickest I have found to turn chitin into dirt is to first ferment it (bokashi style). using this method I can feed lobster carcass to an indoor worm bin.

 

[Clackamas Coot]

as far as I know

Read more.......

 

[mosstrooper]

Could this be a safer alternative than brewing your own ?http://www.powerhealth.co.uk/produc...oductid=1033&gclid=CKDpuO_KpqcCFdFX4Qod-0lmBQ

Oh, im not really planning to make my own, at least not if i can buy it, or better still brew it bokashi stlye as suggested by mad librettist

Im new to all this stuff, chitin, bokashi, organics, etc.
as i said, this all just started when i began looking for an alternative to agro chemical fungicides, which are cripplingly expensive and not easy to get.

 

[mad librettist]

Is Chitosan considered organic?

Read more.......

read more what? any assistance appreciated.

please give a source. I am reviewing all the sources I can find, and afaik chitin itself in sterile conditions has no effect on insect population. Microbial action is doing the work.

think about it - if chitin itself inhibited insect growth, an insect with a chitin exoskeleton makes no sense.

likewise, chitin amendments help control fusarium, etc... indirectly by feeding and breeding chitin degraders.

 

[guest2012y]

The way I understand it from other gardeners as well,the chitin eating organisms need to be built up via recycling the soil,which builds up the population of chitin eating organisms. So if this is all really happening on a level that we can't see,I'd say the organisms are attacking the insects during a weak point in the pupate or larval stage in the soil...
All I really know is since using crab shell meal AND neem seed meal I don't have issues with soil loop pests.

 

[mosstrooper]

My understanding of this is that chitin breaks down to chitosan which has a strongly inhibitory effect on bad nematodes, and it also stimulates a strong immune response in the plant itself.

Ive been wondering if this is why bat guano is such a good plant food, all the chitin from undigested insect exoskeletons (and nitrogen).

 

[Clackamas Coot]

CC whistles while passing the graveyard................

Again.