Rockdust? When to apply?

[Sprocket.]

Hi, when would be the best time to dig rockdust into my plot?

Now, and let it sit for a while, or before transplanting so its fresh in the ground?


Also, is it ok to dig rockdust and other ferts in at the same time? Or should this be done in separate intervals?

Cheers.

Sprocket.

 

[Xare]

Rock Phosphate contains heavy metals like Polonium which is radioactive. These can be uptaken by the plants root system and stored in the tissues of the plant.

Then when its smoked you inhale the traces of heavy metals which get in your lungs and start to radiate you from the inside.

Cancer is a fungus and like many other fungus it gets its energy from radiation.

The cancer grows as it feeds off that radioactivity coming from the small particles of polonium that are in your lungs from fertilization with Rock Dust containing heavy metals.

Tobacco companies fertilize with this stuff and its one of the main factors attributed to lung cancer.

 

[C21H30O2]

he said rock dust as in azomite and glacial rock dust, broad spectrum rocks. Not rock phosphate. your description of cancer growth also goes against known science. Cancer does not feed on radiation. Radiation causes mutations during cell replication which causes uncontrolled cell growth ie cancer. The amounts present in soil amended with rock phosphates would be probably less radiation than you get from microwaving a bag of popcorn. Also there are heavy metals in almost all soils it is the concentration of them that harms you. Things become toxic in quantity not just because trace amounts are there.

to get to your question: rock dust works best when combined with compost, mix at plot as soon as possible but as little as a couple weeks before planting should be fine.

 

[Brother Bear]

Rock dust is SLOW release, add as soon as possible. Works best when using the same spot for YEARS.

Xare - WTF !!! ??? Can't comprehend what you are trying to get across.
Sprocket. pay no mind to his reply

 

[Mountain]

The amounts present in soil amended with rock phosphates would be probably less radiation than you get from microwaving a bag of popcorn. Also there are heavy metals in almost all soils it is the concentration of them that harms you. Things become toxic in quantity not just because trace amounts are there.

to get to your question: rock dust works best when combined with compost, mix at plot as soon as possible but as little as a couple weeks before planting should be fine.

As for soft rock phosphate it's technically considered mine tailings and comes from settling ponds from the production of hard rock phosphate...waste basically. The stuff coming out of Florida can be highly contaminated. Look at Tennessee Brown phosphate instead.

Azomite is run through a kiln and the high heat breaks the structure down. It's 65.85% silicon dioxide, 11.43% alumina, 5.23% potassium oxide, 3.67% calcium oxide, 6.77% of 12 other minerals and other minor stuff. The trace mineral content is very low. The Roots Organics peeps in the shop told me when I was looking at their organic hydro program to use some Azomite in the res so fast acting.

Glacial rock dust is better, Azomite does work though, but other ways to get concentrated, natural sourced trace minerals that can even be used as a foliar...instantly available as they're ionic in form. With glacial rock dust I'd put that on as early as I could.

 

[Xare]

Xare - WTF !!! ??? Can't comprehend what you are trying to get across.

Just a warning that some Rock Dust could contain radioactive Polonium which may cause Lung Cancer.

Cancer is a radiotrophic fungus, meaning it "eats" Gamma Radiation and turns it into energy for growth.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radiotrophic_fungus

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Melanin

Radiotrophic fungi are fungi which appear to use the pigment melanin to convert gamma radiation[1] into chemical energy for growth

Some doctors treat Cancer the same way we deal with fungus as growers. Spray it with sodium bicarbonate and change the PH.


I hear Greensand is a safer alternative to the rock dust.

 

[Mountain]

I hear Greensand is a safer alternative to the rock dust.

I wouldn't be too concerned about glacial rock dust. Greensand is iron potassium silicate and a great source of K. Yeah there's some trace elements in greensand but I see it more as a good K source. Jersey greensand is about 20% iron oxide and 7% K. The southerners will tell you Texas greensand is better though...lol. Greensand has good soil conditioning properties also.

 

[grimcreeper]

I'm not sure why Zare posted on melanin. This reeks of holistic pseudoscience. Changing the body's PH does inhibit cancer growth, but come on, it's not a fungus. True, most modern Homo sapiens are in a self created acidic PH state, but this can be remedied with diet changes. Cancer is mutated cells growing uncontrollably dude. They mutate for a myriad of reasons (previous manmade chemical abuse and a shitty modern processed carbohydrate and transfat saturated diet noteably) and happen to thrive in an acidic body. Just eat more greens and alkinilizing foods. Or eat like our paleolithic ancestors. It isn't a fungus. There are almost countless varieties of cancer.

But it depends on what sort of rock dust you're speaking of. If it's busted up rocks you should put it in in the fall and let it sit over winter. Some of the stuff will be available depending on breakdown in the spring. It will drastically alter your PH, so check that before planting. Soil test kits are cheap and so is a PH meter (I got one for around 10 bucks at a hardware store). You have to mix your dirt in water and check the water's PH before you mix it into the test sample, then test again to get a reliable PH.

So it's best to mix it in the previous season and let it sit unless you're sure the PH is spot on. Always test before planting. Rock dust is extremely variable in what is immediately available and what has to be broken down first.

Shoot, even guano changes PH. Soil outdoor growers are the least affected by PH changes because most get their holes ready and make sure it's cool PH wise to plant before anything green goes in the hole. Cannabis is a pretty resiliant plant, especially when dirt growing is done.

 

[D.S. Toker. MD]

Sproket, i would suggest that you never use non agricultural products in agriculture.
Rock dust, hydrated lime, quick lime, those arent for agriculture and shouldnt be used for it.

Go get you a cheap,($12 ) bag of agricultural grade, pelletized lime and put it on your soil as soon as possible, it takes at least 30 good days to have an effect.. Keep in mind bthat "lime" doesnt leach down through the soil, so mix your pelletized lime throught the soil. Pennington's Fast acting lime is probably the highest quality ag lime available and is the fastest working.

Also, Lime is caustic in nature, and nitrogen and other nutes are acidic in nature. Together, they make a nasty chemical enviroment that plants wont thrive in. Nearly all ag lime manufacturers warn that a minimum of 30 days should be observed between when ag lime is applied and nitrogen apps are applied.

Dump that nasty coorportate watste your considering,.. Also, be sure to avoid any
"Ironite Brand " products. Theyve been banned in a number of states because they are so contaminated. Their "trace elements" come from mine tailings and are full of heavy metals and contaminants. It sits on the shelf at Lowe's, so use caution.

 

[Mountain]

Sproket, i would suggest that you never use non agricultural products in agriculture.
Rock dust, hydrated lime, quick lime, those arent for agriculture and shouldnt be used for it.

Go get you a cheap,($12 ) bag of agricultural grade

That's ridiculous...nature has used rock dust for millions of years . Some sources are better than others though. I know of an expert agriculture consultant who manages the nutrient programs on over 10,000 acres of various crops in a bunch of different states and in many situations rock dust, and also things like Azomite, are an integral part of certain programs. His programs have been developed over years using soil and tissue analysis and extensive research. He only uses things that have been proven to work.

Lime will not address trace mineral requirements...what's your option here? In areas with high pH, like a lot of parts of the western US, you won't wanna be using lime and gypsum would be a better option.

 

[Mountain]

I looked at the analysis for Azomite a bit closer and noticed 220 ppm of lanthanum which is interesting. The Chinese have done a lot of research into Rare Earth Elements, especially lanthanum, and found that it can dramatically improve plant growth and productivity. They use a lot of lanthanum chloride.

Pyrophyllite clay, mainly hydrated aluminum silicate, is a great source for REE's. Good sources of this clay available in the US and some research has shown good for ag use. GH's Rare Earth is overpriced and look at the stuff from Vitality Herbs and Clay as they have their own mines. You'd want the granular kind for outdoors if growing in the same area year-to-year or the powder if one time use soil in like containers or Smart Pots. If recycling soil I'd go with the granular. This is also a high energy, opposed to a low energy, clay and helps with Cation Exchange Capacity. REE's have a decent amount of trace elements if I'm remembering correctly.

I tried to upload a PDF about REE's, probably the most comprehensive compilation of research available on the subject but too big to upload. You can just Google 'rare earth elements in agriculture with emphasis on animal husbandry'. Mainly you want to look at chapter 11.

 

[Sprocket.]

Thanks guys. This is the stuff i was planning on getting, its definitely not radioactive! lol

"SEER® Rockdust®" - 420 million years old, freshly ground, untreated, volcanic rock from Scottish quarries. Decades of rigorous gardening trials and scientific analysis show SEER® Rockdust® to be safe to add to soils and compost. Whilst chemical fertilisers may produce more immediate visual results, SEER Rockdust adds a huge range of mineral and trace elements for long term soil health.

Thanks to the activities of the soil and compost fauna (from microbes to worms) remineralised soil and compost produces the following benefits:

- BOOSTS organic soil fertility
- HIGHER nutritional value
- LONGER shelf life of produce
- LUSHER lawns - BIGGER healthier crops
- BETTER flavour (vegetables start to taste like they used to!)
- INCREASED pest resistance (less reliance on pesticides!)
- IMPROVED drought resistance



"SEER® Rockdust®" also works as a COMPOST ACTIVATOR, encouraging microbial activity, creating a higher temperature, reducing odour, locking in more nitrogen and improving fertility of the compost

"SEER® Rockmix" - The SEER Centre top dressing to regenerate fertility in tired soils.


I was just unsure on application, i read that you cant lime and fert together and wondered what the deal was with rockdust.

 

[C21H30O2]

Lets take some time to educate ourselves...

Lets take some time to educate ourselves...

Sproket, i would suggest that you never use non agricultural products in agriculture.
Rock dust, hydrated lime, quick lime, those arent for agriculture and shouldnt be used for it.

Go get you a cheap,($12 ) bag of agricultural grade, pelletized lime and put it on your soil as soon as possible, it takes at least 30 good days to have an effect.. Keep in mind bthat "lime" doesnt leach down through the soil, so mix your pelletized lime throught the soil. Pennington's Fast acting lime is probably the highest quality ag lime available and is the fastest working.

Also, Lime is caustic in nature, and nitrogen and other nutes are acidic in nature. Together, they make a nasty chemical enviroment that plants wont thrive in. Nearly all ag lime manufacturers warn that a minimum of 30 days should be observed between when ag lime is applied and nitrogen apps are applied.

Dump that nasty coorportate watste your considering,.. Also, be sure to avoid any
"Ironite Brand " products. Theyve been banned in a number of states because they are so contaminated. Their "trace elements" come from mine tailings and are full of heavy metals and contaminants. It sits on the shelf at Lowe's, so use caution.

Here is some very important info on rock dust and the benefits it can have on the soil biology and crop yield.

http://remineralize.org/site/

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uOJ9vBdHZGM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xYV_HK0cTFc

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-WLMFu5_KJU&feature=related

 

[Mountain]

Here is some very important info on rock dust and the benefits it can have on the soil biology and crop yield.

http://remineralize.org/site/

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uOJ9vBdHZGM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xYV_HK0cTFc

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-WLMFu5_KJU&feature=related

Haven't looked too much at rock dust stuff and not much research information available in those links. Interesting though is the dude was talking about initial applications of 20 tons per acre or 5 tons with very fine material...LOL. He still says 1/4 lb/sq ft for maintenance which is 5 tons per acre. Holy crap that's a lot of material and better results with something like 4 gallons of Sea Crop per acre per year and that's about 7 lbs dried equivalent...per acre...and yield increases of up to 100%, better flavor, shelf life, plant health, increased microflora activity, blah blah. 4 gallons to match 20 tons. Also university level studies on Sea Crop. I saw the guy had a gallon of Ocean Grown seawater concentrate and Sea Crop works so much better they're not even close.

With remineralization like they're talking about you're looking for trace minerals. Major minerals, like calcium/potassium/magnesium/etc. are better handled by materials other than rock dust such as lime, gypsum, greensand, K-Mag, etc.

A friend is really into the seawater concentrate stuff and says that 2 good sources are TerraGenics and Ambrosia Technologies. That dude in the video was talking about using different materials for balance and nothing more balanced that a 4 billion year old soup, the ocean, with minerals in ionic form (pretty much monatomic) that are so absorbable you can even get away with a few foliar applications of a 1% dilution...lol.

Not saying rock dust doesn't provide benefits but much better ways to skin a cat. If you wanna go with rock dust I recommend you add some Biozome archae microbe product as archae are the best class to deal with breaking down rock dust. Fungi are really good but archae are better. If you use Biozome along with rock dust I'm pretty sure you'll get better results than rock dust alone.

 

[D.S. Toker. MD]

I apologize if im wrong. You see, "Rock dust" as i know it, is the waste material that comes from quarry/mining activity and is used as road base material, as well as an adherent to spray coal mine tailings to keep down explosive and polluting coal dust and sometimes in cement/grout applications. My carrer involved road building and i have used thousands of tons of the stuff.

My understandig is that there are "dust" products for ag that are good, Glacial dust or Dolomite dust, both have many fans, but sproket said "Rock dust" , which is an industrial mining waste product used in commericial industrial and civil enginerring operations.

Im sorry for the misunderstanding

 

[FireFly22]

Basalt rock dust is a by product of quarrying for paving companies, but as an agricultural additive is has many micronutrients, including mg, ca, zn and many others. It also acts as a ph stabilizers because its CEC is like 10000. As for the microbiological factor, it physically acts as a base for bacteria and fungi to adhere and is often the secret ingredient in compost teas. Many trials have been done over the years with all positive results, in low doses. This should be added in very early spring or best even in the fall.

 

[FireFly22]

DS you could also ask those guys how much and when to apply compost teas and see there reaction...should be good

 

[D.S. Toker. MD]

There are 2 kinds of lime. Calcitic and dolomitic. The calcitic lime is primarily calcium while the dolomitic contains considerable trace elements including magnesium which most growing plants need.

I thought that all gardening experts recommended the dolomitic lime and most do, but after reading, there are some states where the calcitic lime can be used.

sorry

 

[ganjasuiteseat]

Haven't looked too much at rock dust stuff and not much research information available in those links. Interesting though is the dude was talking about initial applications of 20 tons per acre or 5 tons with very fine material...LOL. He still says 1/4 lb/sq ft for maintenance which is 5 tons per acre. Holy crap that's a lot of material and better results with something like 4 gallons of Sea Crop per acre per year and that's about 7 lbs dried equivalent...per acre...and yield increases of up to 100%, better flavor, shelf life, plant health, increased microflora activity, blah blah. 4 gallons to match 20 tons. Also university level studies on Sea Crop. I saw the guy had a gallon of Ocean Grown seawater concentrate and Sea Crop works so much better they're not even close.

With remineralization like they're talking about you're looking for trace minerals. Major minerals, like calcium/potassium/magnesium/etc. are better handled by materials other than rock dust such as lime, gypsum, greensand, K-Mag, etc.

A friend is really into the seawater concentrate stuff and says that 2 good sources are TerraGenics and Ambrosia Technologies. That dude in the video was talking about using different materials for balance and nothing more balanced that a 4 billion year old soup, the ocean, with minerals in ionic form (pretty much monatomic) that are so absorbable you can even get away with a few foliar applications of a 1% dilution...lol.

Not saying rock dust doesn't provide benefits but much better ways to skin a cat. If you wanna go with rock dust I recommend you add some Biozome archae microbe product as archae are the best class to deal with breaking down rock dust. Fungi are really good but archae are better. If you use Biozome along with rock dust I'm pretty sure you'll get better results than rock dust alone.

sea-90 there the og sea salt fert(might not be og but the g ist).lolpeace

 

[FireFly22]

Sorry DS but I still think you are thinking of 2 different things, "dust" yes but rock dust and liming agents are 2 totally different things. Mined minerals, but basalt rock dust is like a plant and microbial stimulater vs lime being used to create the ideal ph for said plants and microbs.