Remove HOT AIR 6 inch Heat Exchanger

[Ravi Singh]

Yea I plan on making a journal thread for setting up my new grow; I am testing a 5x5 HydroHut (silver). I spend a bunch of money on this new grow, over $5k with all the bells and whistles like Co2 w/CHHC-4, UV-b, etc. I am setting up the Icebox with a 2245 gph Ecoplus pump (~3/10 hp) and the chiller with the appropriate sized pump of 1056 gph (also an Ecoplus). Both pumps will be in the 50gal rez; the chiller will be in a separate bedroom (hosing through the wall) along with the Galaxy select-a-watt ballast. The Icebox, fan and reflector will be setup as so in my closed circuit room:

air ->-> [==reflector==]{##IceBox#}(~~Fan~~) ->-> air

My old grow was a fairly identical setup - HydroHut Silver, Sentinel CHHC-1, etc.........spent a shit ton of money on it.

A couple of things - you mixed up your pumps and uses (1056 should be for Ice Box, 2245 for chiller), and the second is that the Ecoplus pumps lose LOTS of head pressure when stressed - I have ~15 of them, and they're great pumps, but they can't handle the head pressure that a lower rated mag drive pump can.

I love my Ecos for for little projects, but for something that's going to be putting constant strain on the pump, I'd go mag drive all day.

Good luck.

EDIT: watch the zippers on the HydroHuts - had to throw away my 4x4 because I broke two of the zippers, but that being said, still have my 2x4 and use it as a veg tent, so maybe I was just a little too rough with the 4x4.

 

[spurr]

A couple of things - you mixed up your pumps and uses (1056 should be for Ice Box, 2245 for chiller),

I got it right, the Ecoplus chiller is rated for 1056 gph and the folks at HydroInnovations use and suggest 3/10 hp for the height/distance of my Icebox from the pump. If you use a pump that is too powerful (overrated) for the chiller, at least the non-top-of-the-line brands, like an Ecoplus, you can damage the chiller. That said, thanks for the heads up on the Ecoplus and head pressure, my 2245 gph pump is on back-order, so I may get a mag drive like you suggest. I would probably go with > 2000 gph, what brand mag drive do you like?

EDIT: watch the zippers on the HydroHuts - had to throw away my 4x4 because I broke two of the zippers, but that being said, still have my 2x4 and use it as a veg tent, so maybe I was just a little too rough with the 4x4.

Thanks for the heads up. I don't plant to use it fully closed, it's in my grow room; a bedroom that is ~12x10x8. I got it to test it out for more efficient light usage (higher irradiance from better reflection; closer walls) and IR blocking. I also bought a shit ton of Orca film, the next gen diffuse reflective material that is way better at full PAR range reflection (plus UV) and IR blocking than any other film. I plan to line the inside of the Hydrohut with Orca film to get better diffuse reflection inside the tent and better IR blocking.

Did you try the HydroHut Control Mounting Board (2' x 2')? I got two of them in case I wanted more than one.

P.S. Did I see your now at C-W2?

 

[Ravi Singh]

I was going off of this rating for the chiller pump:

http://www.horticulturesource.com/i...5956/?osCsid=7bd15903bcd1b07c386d7678e2fdb10e

As far as mags go, Danner is fine in my book for anything like you need - they make an 1800 and a 2400 (and a 3200, if memory serves) - the 1800 would be perfect for your needs, IMO.

No, never tried any mounting boards - mine just sat in my garage.

Not whoever you're thinking of from CW-2 - I'm a derivation of Bob Smith (Ravi Singh, Rupert Schmidt, etc.) at every weedsite I go to.

I was Bob Smith here (had some nice arguments with you on the "24 Hour" thread) but had to change my name because of a perceived security issue which turned out to be a non-issue.

 

[spurr]

I was going off of this rating for the chiller pump:

http://www.horticulturesource.com/i...5956/?osCsid=7bd15903bcd1b07c386d7678e2fdb10e

That is the older model, I bought the newer white commercial model. That model (the black one) underperformed for it's BTU rating, as I was told by folks at Hydroinnovations (they tested both the black and white model). This is the model I bought, horticulturalsource happens to sell it too, and the price is a bit cheaper than what I paid: http://www.horticulturesource.com/e...9710/?osCsid=7bd15903bcd1b07c386d7678e2fdb10e

As far as mags go, Danner is fine in my book for anything like you need - they make an 1800 and a 2400 (and a 3200, if memory serves) - the 1800 would be perfect for your needs, IMO.

I have hear good things about Danner from a few other people too; I will check them out, thanks.

Not whoever you're thinking of from CW-2 - I'm a derivation of Bob Smith (Ravi Singh, Rupert Schmidt, etc.) at every weedsite I go to.

I was Bob Smith here (had some nice arguments with you on the "24 Hour" thread) but had to change my name because of a perceived security issue which turned out to be a non-issue.

Yea I knew you were Bob Smith from the 24 hour thread, but I thought I saw you at C-W2, now I see the nic there is "Bobby Smith": http://www.cannabis-world.org/cw/showthread.php?t=6105

 

[Ravi Singh]

Oh yeah, that's me...........didn't understand what you were saying with the CW-2; but yeah, that's me............going HP aero with my octagon.

 

[B. Friendly]

putting your fan on a temp stat is the cheapest fix for me. water running is not an issue

 

[spurr]

Oh yeah, that's me...........didn't understand what you were saying with the CW-2; but yeah, that's me............going HP aero with my octagon.

Ok, I thought it was you by the description in the thread. I hope you didn't mind me posting that here, if so I can delete it.

Cannabis-world is called C-W2 because it's the reincarnation of the busted site cannabisworld (from the days of overgrow). However, there was a bit of drama when cannabis-world first opened becuase c-ray and plantbuilder and few others can be real ass-holes and arrogant, considering their lack of knowledge, so many of the long time cannabisworld members started thecannacabana. I used to be a member of C-W2 as "gojo", but C-ray and I went from being buddies to not being buddies (he didn't like somethings I posted on another site); so I am no longer there. A running joke amongst some folks is that C-W2 is home of 'copy and paste science' thanks to c-ray's overuse of copy/paste and lack of understanding. C-ray also tends to just make things up and call them facts (e.g., claiming SPD can make a wide leaflet biotype [aka indica] into a narrow leaflet biotype [aka sativa]), and he tries and use non-relevant topics he doesn't understand (e.g., non-coding DNA) to back up his faulty positions.

 

[spurr]

putting your fan on a temp stat is the cheapest fix for me. water running is not an issue

That is what I am planning with the fan-controlling thermostat I bought, glad to hear the Icebox has worked so well for you.

 

[Ravi Singh]

Ok, I thought it was you by the description in the thread. I hope you didn't mind me posting that here, if so I can delete it.

Nah, no worries bro - just keeping a journal over there as a thank you to Nuggdigger, who archived a lot of the old Ddoc threads for vertical gardening - figured it was (is) my way of thanking him for going out of his way to save that knowledge for idiots like myself.

Heard good things about the thecannacabana, but have never checked it out.

EDIT: BTW, glad to see that you can (as I can) put aside our differences in the past and let bygones be bygones. Best of luck with your new setup, wish you nothing but the best.

 

[choch]

Was a regular for years on cw but haven't checked out cannacabana due to restricted access. I assume the intention is to keep leo less active there but it keeps a lot of good potential members out as well. Is it worth the effort to join?

 

[Yes4Prop215]

what kind of heat exchanger would you guys get for a 10x10 bedroom running 4k in lights? my temps are already pretty good, rarely gets above 75. but i wouldnt mind having something like this in case of a heat wave.

also my res water is always cold as F around 30-40 degrees....i think having the heat exchanger setup to drain to the res would help bring those temps into a better range..i could use an aqua pump but kill two birds with one stone.

that ecoplus unit looks like serious business too...but damn a 1200 dollar 1k watt machine for a 5x5 tent? isnt that overkill lol? just to make the water cold or does this unit make the air cold too...kinda like a portable AC or something? kinda confused about this, would love to learn more.

 

[spurr]

Was a regular for years on cw but haven't checked out cannacabana due to restricted access. I assume the intention is to keep leo less active there but it keeps a lot of good potential members out as well. Is it worth the effort to join?

IMO no, TCC isn't anything special. Many of the members here are also at TCC. I think there is more and betting info found at this site than at TCC.

 

[spurr]

what kind of heat exchanger would you guys get for a 10x10 bedroom running 4k in lights? my temps are already pretty good, rarely gets above 75. but i wouldnt mind having something like this in case of a heat wave.

Do you vent the hot air from the hoods outside? And what other heat producing things are your room (ex., ballasts, dehumidifier, gas co2 generator, etc)?

also my res water is always cold as F around 30-40 degrees....i think having the heat exchanger setup to drain to the res would help bring those temps into a better range..i could use an aqua pump but kill two birds with one stone.

that ecoplus unit looks like serious business too...but damn a 1200 dollar 1k watt machine for a 5x5 tent? isnt that overkill lol? just to make the water cold or does this unit make the air cold too...kinda like a portable AC or something? kinda confused about this, would love to learn more.

I plan on using it to cool the air for the whole room, instead of using an A/C. So it's duel purpose: cool the air coming from the hood so I don't need to vent outside (I have neighbors) and to cool the room so I don't to use an A/C unit.

I plan on using the chiller to cool the 10x12x8 room, but I am only using one 5x5 tent with one 1,000 w HID in the room at this point (ballast is outside the room). I am using the tent for reflection issues, not becuase I am trying to use the room for something besides growing.

I got a deal on the 1 hp ecoplus commercial unit, I only paid wholesale price, so I got a couple hundred bucks off the retail price.

The commercial (white) ecoplus 1 hp chiller only runs at over 8,525 BTU, but a true 1 hp chiller should run ~12,000 BTU. On average a 1,000 HPS HID generates ~4,000 BTU (~3,500 BTU of lamp heat and about ~500 BTU of radiant heat; cite).

If you want to use a chiller and heat exchanger to cool the room you need to add up all the BTU heat input from all the heat producing items in the room, like HID (unless the hot air is vented outside), ballast, dehumidifier, etc., than get a chiller that provides at least 10% BTU of cooler power over the total BTU input from the room.

If you want to use a chiller to only cool the exhaust from a HID then you only need a chiller with at least 10% 'extra' cooling BTUs over the BTUs generated by the HID (better to have 20% 'extra' cooling BTUs). Another way to look at it is the room BTUs should only add up to 90% of the BTU of the water chiller.

You should check out this blog post: "Size Matters – How to Properly Size a Chiller" (link to watercooledgardens blog)
​

Below is something I wrote in this thread: https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=202072

If you are trying to use the chiller as an A/C unit, as well as to cool the heat from the lamp (like I am planning), you need sufficient BTU output (from chiller) over room BTU input; or less BTU input (from room).

The claim from HydroInnovations about 1/4 HP for a 1,000w is only accurate for true 1/4 HP chillers, i.e., ~3,000 BTUs of cooling. That won't happen with the black Ecoplus nor the white Ecoplus 1/4 HP chillers. Also, because a 1,000w HID puts out ~4,000 BTU a true 1/4 HP chiller will only cool the hot air from the hood, not act as an A/C unit to cool the room.

A 1,000w HID (ex., HPS) will put out ~4,000 BTU (~3,500 BTU of lamp heat and about ~500 BTU of radiant heat). To use water cooled lamp via Ice Box correctly you need to add up all the BTUs from your lamp/s. The total BTU for the lamp should be less than 90% of the BTU from the chiller (ideally < 80%).

Examples of the math:

• (lamp BTU/chiller BTU)*100 = percent of 'extra' chilling BTUs if under 100.
• (chiller BTU)*0.9 = max BTUs from lamp to cool lamp with an 'extra' 10% BTU for cooling left over.
• (lamp BTU)/0.9 = needed BTUs from chiller to cool lamp with 10% 'extra' BTUs for cooling left over.

If you want to use the Ice Box to cool the room and the lamp heat you need to add up all BTUs in the room (ex., lamp/s, ballast/s, dehui, etc.). Then you need to use a chiller that offer greater BTUs of cooling than the BTUs put out by your room. The total BTU for the room should be equal to or less than 85% of the BTU from the chiller (giving 15% 'extra' cooling BTUs). Ideally the total BTU from the room should be less than 80% if the BTU from the chiller (giving 20% 'extra' cooling BTUs). Ex., if you have 7,246 BTUs of heat from your room, you need at least 8,525 BTUs of cooling from the chiller.

Examples of the math:

• (room BTU/chiller BTU)*100 = percent of 'extra' chilling BTUs if under 100.
• (chiller BTU)*0.85 = max BTUs from room to cool room with an 'extra' 15% BTU for cooling left over.
• (room BTU)/0.85 = needed BTUs from chiller to cool room with 15% 'extra' BTUs for cooling left over.

 

[Yes4Prop215]

spurr my room is 10x10 and does not have air cooled fans...currently i disperse the heat through a ton of oscilating and having really cold intake air being pulled by negative pressure from a 10inch 800 cfm fan. my temps rarely go above 75 because outside air is rarely above 60...

inside the room i have 4 ballasts but they are low heat digitals from phantom...i have a santa fe dehuey but that only runs maybe an hour or two a day. 7-8 fans, thats about it....

i was looking at the heat exchangers from the website Vagpuncher posted, they have a model LPB063 that is one fan, 4 tubes, and claims to cool 4k worth of HPS lights.

your idea makes sense though, cool the air as soon as it comes off the hood so your room temps never get affected..however my room is arranged in a way that i would need two chillers for each row of 2 lights....so i need some kind of heat exchanger that does not connect to the hoods, just pulls ambient air and cools it.

 

[spurr]

your idea makes sense though, cool the air as soon as it comes off the hood so your room temps never get affected..however my room is arranged in a way that i would need two chillers for each row of 2 lights....

If you wanted to cool the air from the HIDs you would only use one chiller and use a manifold to run water to all of the heat exchangers. The same heat exchangers would be used to cool the room, too. I only posted info about HIDs for a more through post, in case you could use the info.

so i need some kind of heat exchanger that does not connect to the hoods, just pulls ambient air and cools it.

That is what I was writing about, re cooling the room. You can use Iceboxes for that, or the knock-offs Vagpuncher posted. All you would do is attach a centrifugal fan to the heat exchanger and hang them in your room. Then attach the inlet (cool water) hose from the water pump at the rez to the heat exchanger and run the outlet (warm water) hose from the heat exchanger back to the rez. I only added info about HIDs in case you didn't vent outside or didn't cool some other way.

To cool the air from your room it would be most efficient to use an 8" heat exchanger, even better would be to use two 8" heat exchangers piggy-backed for greater surface area which equates to more efficient cooling via heat exchange.

Did you write that you have a rez? A rez for what? And you wrote the water stays at 30-40'F? Do you use a chiller to keep it so cold?

If you already have a water chiller cooled rez that you can use, then you may be good to go. Just buy at least one 8" (or 6") heat exchanger; but two would be better. You can piggy-back the two heat exchangers so you only need to buy/use one fan for both heat exchangers.

If you use two piggy-backed heat exchangers then all you do is use the outlet hose from the 1st heat exchanger as the inlet hose for the 2nd heat exchanger, and the outlet hose from the 2nd heat exchanger goes back to the rez.

Using two piggy-backed heat exchangers is not only better for greater surface area for cooling (i.e., heat exchange), but also will help prevent condensation on the heat exchangers due to how cold your rez water is. If you used only one heat exchanger with 30-40'F water in 75-80'F room I bet you would get condensation...

If you use a water chiller to cool your rez already what is its rated BTU?

 

[sunnydog]

DIY

DIY

You can make this type of thing real easy.....
It is really just a radiator/ heater core from a small car, box it in and you're ready to go! It will de- humidify, also, so provide for condensate runoff.

I have a thread on how I did this many many years ago.

But, depending on the cost, may not be worth it, unless you got the parts lying around.

SD

 

[vaped]

Think of something radical. Im thinking of running several heat exchangers of geocooled rezes . If I take 55 gallon drums bury them like 6 feet deep with a pump and drain tube how much heat would the ground take out of my water. If the pumps only kicked on when my lights did at night that would give my res time to cool back off to 54 deg. the average temp under 6 foot of soil in my area. It shure would give my air conditioners a break. I have also seen great room heat exchangers made by strapping box fans to car radiators. any input on my ideas is well apreciated.

 

[teemu shalanie]

nice diy swamp chiller , way 2 b
B.
peace TS