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Vert grow in planning stages - need input and advice

S

SmokinErb

Member
This won't be my first vert grow. However, this will be my first stealth grow. No, not some 250w stealth grow. 800w flower + 432w Mother/clone/veg separately. My issue I'm having here is the flower chamber.

My last vert grow was a 1,200w 3 tier octagon that was 4' in diameter.

However, I can not realistically build a 4' square armoire. And I do not want to go back to a more traditional, horizontal garden. I guess once you go vert, you never go back.

However my issue is this - most armoires are about 20" deep. I doubt this is enough space, I could easily extend that to 2', but I still believe that is too small to surround my bulbs with plants.

Basically I've been looking for size charts for vert growing. I need to know how small of a space I could use with 400w bulbs. I'm guessing 3' square. Maybe 30"? I'm just trying to figure out the depth of the cab I need to build to house 2 stacked vert 400w bulbs.

I'll make a separate cupboard housing a 4' 8 bulb T5HO to store some bonsai mums and clones. The clones will only veg a few days before going into flower, they'll be in small containers, 6" or 7" square pots (9" deep) for flower.

I think the vertical space I'll use will probably be about 40"-48"

Strain(s) will be chosen on SOG ability (main cola dominate with minimal branching)
 
S

SmokinErb

Member
Meh, I typed this up a bit too late last night. Let me continue.

I know that ideally I'll keep my plants 6-8" from the bulb.

I'm not sure of the actual dimensions of the bulb, but I'll just say it's 2" thick. So figuring from there:

In a 30" box - 14" remaining from side of box to bulb; 8" from the side of the box to the "burn zone" around the bulb. With the pot taking up 6-7" of that space, which leaves 1-2" beyond the pot for the plant to reach toward the light.

In a 36" box - 17" remaining from side of box to bulb; 11" from the side to the "burn zone." 6-7" pot leaves 4-5" for the plants to grow towards the light. Easily accomplished with training.

I'm starting to feel like 30" is just unrealistic? 1-2" from the close edge of the pot to the burn zone around the bulb.

So 3x3' is doable, but excessively large for ANY piece of furniture. Can anyone think of a better alternative for stealth? It will likely be placed in a bedroom. A 3x4' piece of furniture is just huge.
 
dustin27

dustin27

Active member
Veteran
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S

SmokinErb

Member
I could do that, however the issue i'm having with the growing in the closet thing is this - it will be rental property. If the landlord was to come and inspect, they can open a closet. They cannot open my armoire/cupboard and dig through that. I also imagine that it would cause some pretty serious ventilation issues, as I can't cut holes in the wall/ceiling to remove the air.

Personally? I just want a grow tent. The woman has a problem with it. It's simple to take down and place the plants in some large rubbermaid bins in case of an inspection. She doesn't like the idea, so the 4x4 secret jardin idea is out.

In the end though, my bedroom is my bedroom and nobody will be going in it except my girl and I for the most part so an overly large cabinet really does't matter THAT much, I suppose. And if it makes her feel safer, then what can I really say?

I take it you agree that the 30" is too small? Bear in mind that these are going to be SOG style from clone, 12-18" tall at finish. I've only grown larger bushes in any grow and never attempted SOG before. I'm not sure how much space they really need.

Heath used a 600w in a vert system. 42" across, 30" high. 4" pvc tubes to make it 34" from tube to tube with a light in the middle. With a 600. I was looking for the specs on his 800w vert grow, but could only find pics.
 
S

SmokinErb

Member
@Whodair, I'm pretty much set on the 400's because I'm pretty much in love with the CMH bulbs. They run much cooler, and I was considering using cool tubes, but hoping to run bare bulb. I really don't have the resources available to do hydro, nor the experience. When space and money allows, I'd love to experiment with some DWC trees but right now it's just not feasible. I'm on a somewhat limited budget. 2x400 would create more vertical space and allow for more plants/strains than a single 600. Also a 400 would allow me to shrink the footprint of the base of the cab more than a 600 would.

I'm absolutely loving that link, man. I'd LOVE to get into hydro, I just don't want to experiment now and have a disaster and no buds. I'll delve into hydro as a side grow, 1-2 DWC buckets and go from there.
 
whodare

whodare

Active member
Veteran
k sticking with the 400 hundreds i would still say that those pcv fittings stacked and filled with coco would work too.

water from the top and catch run off from the bottom you could prolly pull half to 1 oz a plant from clone and since its modular you can go as high as you need.

coco is easy. go get some calmag and some cns17 grow, bloom, and ripe. ph to 5.8 and keep it moist but not drenched.
 
S

SmokinErb

Member
I'll take it into consideration man. I love how much more space it saves using any type of PVC tubing. Right now I'm currently looking into a cool tube which houses 2 bulbs, it's 36" long, so I think that'd work well with a 40-48" grow space. I think it'd buy me another 2" in terms of how close the plants could get to the bulb, and thus making a 30" more realistic. Still not sure if its good enough though as I've never done a SOG.

Any thoughts on that? Right now I'm trying to get my size figured out. After the box dimensions are set, then come the details.
 
whodair

whodair

Active member
Veteran
i have a very similar set up...vegg is 432w, 8x4ft t5s cooled by a 4in vortex

flower is 860w 2 x430w hps bare verti, 2 4in vortex, one is 24/7 and the 2nd vortex is 12/12 on with the lights...

the flowering plants are in crop circles around the bare bulbs ive got enough room for a row between the bulbs so its kinda figure "8"

its run perpetual ... and yields very well !!
 
S

SmokinErb

Member
Your Kali looks amazing dude! That was definitely one of the strains on my list that I was going to do with DWC trees in the future. I love the serious seeds lineup and this grow will probably run the AK47 along with others.
 
S

SmokinErb

Member
@Bobblehead - HAHA DUDE! I totally did consider that, but really I don't have the means, nor the refrigerator. I'd love to do something like that.

I think I can pull it off. I know I can with 36", but I'm just trying to shrink it down. It may not sound like much, but mere inches matter when it comes to raising an eyebrow or not. I think 3x4' armoire (the extra foot for holding ballasts, etc) might be suitable. Pretty big, but meh. Not much I can do if thats the minimal amount of space I can use.
 
Aerohead

Aerohead

space gardener
Veteran
bobblehead said:
Mod a large refridgerator with a 2 400w stack... 400 more in the freezer. :)
Click to expand...

LOL, the fridge would move around on it's own with the fan it would take to cool that..

Here's an idea, Can you put the armoire in front of the closet to gain the stealth aspect, and use it for a secret doorway to the closet?

I think 8" is too close to the bulb (for yield anyway) I have some ladies 14" from a 400w CMH and it's slamming them in veg. So my inner circle is 30" with 2" added for the bulb. Add another 14" X2 for the back of the plants and It takes 58" to get that 30" grow circle.

To get your plants 8" from the bulb, you are going to eat up 18" of cab depth leaving 2" for plants to grow on each side. If you have to run an armoire, you might be able to do it with 2 X 250 CMH in tubes, it's the 20" of depth that makes it so hard to do vert.

The other option is to build your own armoire out of some pretty wood and make it 36" deep...

Good luck, whatever you have to do I am sure you will max it out with those lights...
 
T

T-type

Active member
I don't see any reason for a landlord to look in your closet. There is nothing in there that needs to be looked at.

You could always buy an extra door and cut holes in that for ventilation and just replace the door if your landlord comes knocking.
 
S

SmokinErb

Member
Lol dude, that's what I'm talking about doing - building an armoire/wardrobe/cupboard to suit my needs. I know I can do it if I get 36" of depth, but I've been trying to figure out is if it would work with only 30"

Either way I'm probably going to opt for a 3x4' cab, maybe slightly wider.

@T-type, that's not a bad idea actually. I'll have to talk to my girl about that one to see how comfortable she is with it.
 
wisco61

wisco61

Member
I have one tent that is 38" x 38". The sides suck in from negative pressure so it probably is a little less than 36"x36". The fence is 15" across, which is OK for some strains, but is on the edge. If a fan leaf pops through bleaching and burning will occur.
 

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S

SmokinErb

Member
I'm digging your set-up, man. I take it that's a 400w? So that screen is just there for protection rather than a SCROG? What's your container size? Extraction fan CFM? Temps? Or would you happen to have a grow journal I could just check out?

I've only done 2 small space grows, neither were vert. So sorry about all of the questions. I've been searching for a vert grow journal with a 400w in a 3' or less space and haven't had any luck.
 
wisco61

wisco61

Member
Its a 400. The screen is for protection, but it also supports the plants. They lean into it, and I tie some of the back or side branches to the fence with twisty ties. After a couple days I can undo them and the branch will stay pretty much there. Those are in 3 gal smart pots, 5 of them.

The extraction is just an 8" inline duct booster in the center of the top, so the fan on the floor shoots directly up into it causing ample air movement. It stays at room temperature, maybe a couple degrees above.
 
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