HELP - ARRRRGGHHHH - Pythium Again !!!!!!, Tried everything !!!!

[Madrus Rose]

Yah , heard the same thing on the Hygrozme tends to =slime & 'spensive as heck too ....the UV unit at 9watts prolly would want to run it at 300gph max to get the most kill rate , you really could just drape it remotely over/into the control rez with its own small pump & just run it for an hr a day . That would all be needed remember the slower water flow over the light exposes more baddies to be killed , faster flow=less kill rate.

That Ionic Micro ammendment doesn't look too costly as a small precaution to running the UV & great they have anticipated more peeps using UV in sterilizing their rez's in dwc & hydro set-ups. Prolly could also foliar the micro's in as well in the foliar mix of your choice , remember to add some fulvic acid in the foliar mix too, a real good thing that aids in absorbtion thru the leaf tissues ...
(and some baby shampoo or other surficant in the foliar too !)

Like what uptown saying just topping off nutes when needed but as for full nute regime will let others here chime in ...suppose any of the better ones H&G, GH etc will do . Be interested to hear what u settle on & how its working for ya ...know that i've become used to adding Bot's cal/mag in the veg & 1/2 way into flower with excellent results . Since i'm in inert coco blend 5gal containers , just running FloraNova series & Floralicious+ , which is KISS.

Hope that UV sterilizer helps solve the problem , usually pythium & other probs originate thru higher temps but the UV will sure keep it
under control in the rez & ie= the containers roots .

 

[takeiteazy]

Cheers Madrus. I just converted 300 US gallons to ul litre and it turns out at 1135l

So i could use on either then, think i would prefer it inline with my feed line to buckets as this is less than 1000l/h.

I could even work out the flow rate and total volume of mix to see how long it takes to do a full cycle of nutes.

I could the set the UV to run for one complete cycle/change of nutes ?

What do you think ?? Or run it for 2 changes ?? I reckon an hour would be about 4 changes ??

I have drained topped up with plain ph water and 35% H202 for 2 days now.



Cheers

 

[angel4us]

pythium root rot or blue green algea?

pythium root rot or blue green algea?

it might be blue green algea -aka hydro herpes..... once you get it spores are forever in that grow enviroment for years and will come back unless you use a preventative thing like duthch masters zone .....and i beleive hygrozyme will just accelerate the slime production and really should be left out of dwc period.....peace

 

[greenmatter]

Cheers Guys. Trust me i have read and read on PYTHIUM. Had loads of awesome grows for years without changing nutes etc. Then BANG last 3 grows had it...After MEGA cleaning H202 etc..

Not using Hygrozyme but WAS thinking about it...

I have this on order - http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Pond-UV-Light...Features_UK&hash=item483b5a4511#ht_3666wt_754

Not sure whether to put it inline with my chiller/pump which runs at full speed 1000L/P, just recirculating in the control res. Or

Use inline on my other 1000 L/H pump which feeds direct to my five bubble pots, not sure what the actually flow rate is but def not 1000L/H as it restricted due to dropping down to 4mm feeds to each bucket (could work this out easily enough though)

Also as stated i use Ionic Nutes and they also sell a UV filter, they also sell this to -

http://www.emeraldcitysupply.com/product.asp?CatalogCode=IONICUV

What do you reckon my regime should be peeps ?

Cheers

Help is much appreciated, are you mostly US growers ?

sorry eazy .. your first post said third grow ... did not mean to sound like like an anus

 

[takeiteazy]

Well flushed each day with fresh water/H202, and sprayed roots with H202. They not looking good roots 'off colour' and plants drooping/yellowing badly.

I When doing this i filled to above net pots to cover everything.

Just dropped level to 1" below pots and can see VERY dark brown/black crap on the roots which is not good.

I have also added nutes at 0.3ec.

At a loss now tbh.

Think i will keep adding 35% H202 daily at 10ml a day (80l total system).

Also i have never had any sludge/brown goo etc. Water is crystal clear and always has been ??

Absolutely gutted !!!!

EDIT - Also come across this which says to lower level between nutes/bottom net pots, this is where my dark brown starts
'The air-gap thing works but I don't think it's about the roots. I think that when the water level is high the medium gets wet from the bubbles and is a starting point for the rot. But I'm just guessing, all I know is that years back when I had a root rot problem (3 grows in a row) an older grower told me to lower the water level and that took care of it.'

 

[Scrogerman]

0.25mls per litre of H2o2 at 35% to 80lites of solution is 20mls per 80litres not 10mls, thats a bit weak to fix a problem like this one. think ive done the math right there bro. Id be using the Oxy+ which is 17.5% H2o2 strength 'out the bottle id use at the recommended 0.5mls per litre, which would be 40mls per 80 litres, so you using like half strength at 10mls at 35% strength to 80 litres, try doubling the dose but dont go stronger, i dont think more is needed, but at half the recommended strength its gonna take ages to fix you up im guessing, even at full strength its gonna take a while, this isnt a quick day or two fix man, it takes time & will depend on the kind of infection(exactly) & how advanced the infection is.
like i said on the other thread to you, sometimes its better to live & learn, cut your losses & start again. Advanced rootrot damage can & will affect the final yields & it'can also take you much longer to get there, depends on how advanced infection is of course, but this is well worth considering.
get some pics up, you'll get multiple opinions & advices, better for you man, even a phone pic or something, dont forget to delete it afterwards.
Peace!

double that dose!

 

[takeiteazy]

Cheers mate so add 20ml daily. Not split in 2 doses as it rapidly deteriotes.

Your math was right..lol

 

[Scrogerman]

Ionic Nutes work great with the Oxy+, Growth-tech make both, ive fancied adding their liquid silicon they make into that regime(3), works good for me with other nute lines & Si, i do lov the ionic though, its solid & plants luv the stuff.

get some pics up man, you get the proper advice then im sure.

No hit them with the 20mls every 24hours, do it just after lights on then you got less chance of over doing it, making mistakes. if we can see how advanced it is we'll get a better idea, does the root-ball smell the bucket rez etc? Like smelly feet? rotton? it might be worth going down the physan20 route if the infection is advanced, if you can get the stuff. never used it but from what ive seen it nukes everything. Ive never used bleach but believe its good from what ive read on the boards. I've had some nice results running The Ionic line/Oxy+ & PK, nice & simple. Used the Oxy+ on a 3 day on 2 day off, 2 on 3 off regime, start to finish/flush with great results.

 

[Scrogerman]

You have white furr on your rootball?-smell??, above the water line i presume, mmm, sounds like a fungus possibly, impossible to varify without pics really. somethings not right then, if your just running H2o2 + Nutes(only) like has been sugested. Have you insulated the lid of your buckets? with mylar or similar, dont use tin-foil, but it sounds like there may be a heat/evaporation problem around the top of your buckets, could be a number of things. get some pics up n im sure you'll get to the bottom of what it is.

 

[takeiteazy]

There is low nutes, H202 and HYDROZYME still in there. My system is totally light proof/mylar covers over the pebble nets as well and the 'white fur' is in the very fine ends of the nutes in the solution.

 

[Scrogerman]

oh dear, i said just Nutes & H2o2, dont tell me you are using hygrozyme aswell? after everything thats been said about it, dump your res asap man. make fresh with h2o2 & nutes only, nothing else at all, run that for a week, no zymes or zyme products, nothing but h2o2 & nutes at the correct EC. should put you on the right path bro. which zyme product is it, hygro or hydro, who makes it? sipco?, i think its called hydrozyme in Cannada where its made & hygrozyme when exported, think im right there. Lose the zymes fast bro, dump your res, new nutes & h2o2 only!

use the correct EC, watch PH & EC &* adjust accordingly. whats your PH doing mate? is it going up or down, & what EC are you using? & at what PH?

 

[Scrogerman]

There is low nutes, H202 and HYDROZYME still in there. My system is totally light proof/mylar covers over the pebble nets as well and the 'white fur' is in the very fine ends of the nutes in the solution.

I dont understand the last bit, do the roots smell bad at all like smelly feet????????

 

[takeiteazy]

Roots smell fine. It's the expensive Hygrozyme stuff. Got em 0.6ec, just checked ph and was 5.8 yesterday now shot up to 6.5 ?

 

[Scrogerman]

Thats perfect bro,well(not quite), seems like your problem is related to your use of Hygrozyme bro, like i said in the Hygro Thread, you have to use Bene's, innoculate with beneficial bacteria, like Great White or Voodoo juice etc etc, theres alot of beneficial bacterai products on the market those are two well known brands. I bet you got slime on your roots havent you. ?

If you had Pythium your PH would be shooting down & your root ball would smell like smelly feet/rotton!!, !I know PH dives down with various Bacterial infections. Your PH is rising/Up so that indicates you have no infection, plus the no-smell tells me the same too.
Id guess the hygrozyme is causing your brown roots(is it Slimey Brown Roots?) & if your seeing brown snotty slimey roots then thats whats doing it, its not Phythium bro. You need to either get the Bene's fast & hope youve got time to colonize your system with them. Hygrozyme can only be used with h2o2 at low EC's as far as i know but it doesnt specify how low. I would stop using it myself, like i have in the past. h2o2 & Nutes only, or go the Bene route. At least you know what the problem is.
btw you cant use H2o2 with bene's.

PH up is a good sign, but the plants are telling you they need more food. PH up & EC Down = Not Enough food, PH Down & EC Up = Too Much Food.
You want a gradual upward drift & your EC is the key, take it up to 0.8 & watch what happens next(EC & PH). after you dump you Res for Nutes & H2o2 only. We av had to spray clean slimey rootballs before now, in exactly the same boat as you are(snotty brown roots because using Hygrozyme £45 a bottle stuff). Beneficial bacteria was the answer, but imo running a sterile res is better to learn, some pro's prefer running dead/sterile res's, which the h2o2 or bleach will provide.

watch the slime, it'll strangle your roots starving them of O2, id spray it off with a spray bottle & H2o2 solution, dump your res & start again(fresh nutes & H2o2). if you had bene's in there it would eat this shit up, but you havent & thats where your problem is!

hope that help[ed!

 

[takeiteazy]

Hi Mate, thanks for helping...

It def root rot/pythium. Here is a pic i found that looks exactly like mine, the roots are very dark brown nearer the net pot which is not shown-

This id the FIRST time i have ever used hygrozyme as read good stuff about it and its the ONLY additive that can be used with H202.

I have no slime etc BUT do have very fine white fur on the roots in the clear solution.

Going to dump it/clean through couple times and do as you said.

One plat though has 2 tiny fresh white roots popping out the side of the net.....

Cheers

 

[Scrogerman]

na, its the only enzymatic product that can be used with H2o2 at low EC's, ie- 0.2-0.4, i wouldnt like to say if 0.6 is OK, i dont know & it doesnt specify an amount of h2o2 to use with it, it just says low EC's, so i presume 0.8-1.2 is no good, 0.6 may be too high.

Thats not Phythium bro, it would stink for a start, like ive told you, Smelly Rotton Feet is a dead give away.
Ive used Hygropoo in hydro & you get slimey brown snotty roots, yes nearer the top, but it can be all over.
That looks like staining from the hygrozyme bro, not phythium, you'd know about by now if it was phythium, it'd be stinking. H2o2 Nukes Phythium no sweat, thats why i dont think its phythium, you root temps are good at around 70f, its very unlikely phythium with such root zone conditions, especially in a high o2 enviroment! low O2 & high temps like 80f yes, but not how you got it bro! unlikely, but i could be wrong. smell your rootzone, its a dead giveaway!

The Furr sounds like mold or fungus. you need to stop using the Hygro untill you get it sussed out how to use it, & that is adding benes fist, leave for 3-5 days so the beneficial bacteria can colonize your rootzone, then add the hygro & you should be stellar. Untill then just use Nutes & h2o2 trust me! DWC is my game, luv NFT too.

tbh, on the hygro website it says to use hygrozyme from day 1 in hydro, maybe that counts & helps, gives it time to promote natural bene colonisation, i dont know, but i do know adding bene's fix's it up.

 

[takeiteazy]

Hi

Just drained system down and the roots are SMELLING !!! I had the out of the buckets and cut away the main dark brown stuff and sprayed with h202/water mix.

Refilled with PH water/h202 at double strength as recommended on oxyplus. I will add low nutes late2 -0.2 ec.

That pic does not do it justice, i have one plant in flower and will get a pic up later, ui am positive its Pythium/root rot

The roots have gone that colour last 3 grows regardless and i did not use Hygrozyme, i just bought that spur the moment....

Also my good grows when using ionic i had no staining and bright white roots so i is not that..

I have a plant infl ower which has survived with root disease and will get a pic up if get chance as one above does not show the severity of it.

Cheers

 

[Scrogerman]

Double strength, watch that man, you sure that the instructions dont mean for cleaning, ie- once youve finished your crop, for sterilising etc. i'd just give it a 0.5ml PH water spray after an hour or two, personally, but thats me. Yes, i think that would be a good ldea, 1ml per litre is strong & could damage roots imo. be carefull, ever got any neat on your hand, burns, roots are delicate etc, think about it. be ok anyway just rinse with proper strength 0.5ml per litre(17.5%).

Sounds like you have it sussed now! remember the bene's for the Hygro. my buddy had a bottle (1 litre) sat around for months after he got slimed(because of the hygrozyme-RDWC), i had half a litre & used it all on a soil grow, guerilla stylie after seeing what a mess it made of my buddys res.
Im gonna try the Bene's & hygro myself in the future. I wreckon the Hygrozyme is good stuff once you have it dialled in, ive seen people running silly high rez temps & no pathogens through the whole grow, seems like it works very well.

 

[Scrogerman]

Good move cutting out the mush, if it was mushy dark brown/black & smelling like rotton smelly feet, then yes that sounds like pythium for sure bro. Id cut it out myself, rinse with a sprayer bottle of H2o2 & ph water solution, then rinse spray again etc. then back in the main rez!

well done anyway. I hope it sorts itself out now!

peace!

 

[Scrogerman]

Id say your issues were down to the Hygrozyme, ive seen it time & time again on IC & other forums. I think your onto a winner now though. Phythium/RootRot is pretty easy to control/cure. Unlike a Brown Algae Bloom, i beleive bene's are the way to go. The H2o2 should fix you up, but there are other Phythoum specific products out-there, numerious ones, ive never needed them but im sure they work if you continue having problems, i think UV steriliser are only nessasary in large commercial rigs, but yeah its one answer, H2o2 has always fixed me up, & as youve been using it with exellent rootzone & Res temps i find it unusual you have a phythium problem, says Hygrozyme to me, i dont think the stuff has helped your case, put it that way. I dont see many people struggling with phythium these days, it should be an easy fix really, so i think you'll suss it out. How are you measuring your res water tempreture, im not sure on the Furr, but i relate that to warm damp environments, not cool regulated ones, maybe add a breath hole(just a thought)?
It may be that simply adding Beneficial Bacteria would of fixed your probs(-minus- h2o2), dont think it would be a quick fix but it might be an idea after youve sterilised with the h2o2 this time?, let me know how you get on bro!
Best of luck for future ventures!
Peace......Scroger!