1st mix opinions wanted:

[razor ridge]

Ok this is my 1st mix after obtaining the stuff I have access to:

4.5 cubic feet organic potting mix
2 bags of mushroom compost
a lot of perlite
2 cups blood meal
4 cups bone meal
4 cups powder dolomite lime
4 cups kelp meal
3 cups organic starter plus with mycorrhizae and bacteria
3 cups Azomite
2 cups Diatomaceous Earth


I dont have access to earthworm castings, what do ya'll think?

 

[C21H30O2]

can u get some high quality compost? make that the base of your mix and it should make up for lack of ewc.make ur own ewc and compost if possible. isnt mushroom compost sterile?

 

[razor ridge]

I have several piles of used FFOF that have been sitting in the yard, some for months, most roots are broken down, could I use this if it was screened?

 

[northstate]

Well other than EWC that seems like its great to me, maybe some alfalfa or neem seed meal? Mushroom compost is supposed to be sterile but as an amendment it works well for texture/moisture. If you can bubble up a compost tea (KISS) to get things going when you mix you will be happy for sure. Let the microbes do the work! NS

You could save dirt in a t-can or rubbermaid so insects dont set up camp and breed in you new mix just about the time you hit flower. Predatory nematodes will kill things if you want to use outside/recycled dirt.

 

[guest2012y]

I have several piles of used FFOF that have been sitting in the yard, some for months, most roots are broken down, could I use this if it was screened?

Yes you can,but you'll need to amend it with a bit more ferts/nutes...don't worry about the old root balls,just tear them up and add it to the mix. Take out the stumps though.
Try and find a good local compost if you can't get that EWC.
I'd ditch the bone and blood for N.bat guano and fish bone meal Or do fish meal and soft rock phosphate.
More kelp and add dolomite if you have any peat in the mix.
My 2 cents CC1

 

[razor ridge]

blood and bone meal used for availability, will be ordering some guano for future mixes, never seen soft rock phosphate for sale anywhere. I live in the sticks so other than regular stuff its hard to get the specialty items, hell I drove around for 2 hours today and couldn't even find a bale Pro-Mix

 

[Montana]

Bone and blood work better for longer than guano, plus it's harder to find and much more expensive, I say this from experience of using both many times, par up your blood with the bone, no problem in using 4 cups blood as well, it'll make a well balanced meal for a long time, the bigger the container, the longer the mix will last........if you can get guano, save it for tea during flower.

 

[Montana]

just my opinion from what I've experienced, capt cheeze knows his shit too so we're both right lol.....it's up to you now!

 

[guest2012y]

blood and bone meal used for availability, will be ordering some guano for future mixes, never seen soft rock phosphate for sale anywhere. I live in the sticks so other than regular stuff its hard to get the specialty items, hell I drove around for 2 hours today and couldn't even find a bale Pro-Mix

Don't know how far in the sticks you are,but so am I. Get online and search for organic garden supplies,if that doesn't work try nurseries,if that doesn't pan out try hydro-stores...if that fails order online.
There's got to be something within a hundred miles. They (the suppliers) know you're out there and need this shit...any local co-op's around?
I personally don't like blood for the factor that just because it say's it's an organic amendment,doesn't mean the cows/pigs were. (same goes for mammalian bones as well) They are exposed to pesticides,antibiotics,hormones,etc.,and blood often burns because it's fast release and faster to be depleted. N. bat guano takes around 4 -5 months to completely break down,the P. guano much longer. Try different sources of each fert/nute so that the breakdown rates are balanced...you'd need less of any one thing and have a more balanced soil mix.
But I understand resourcing these things is sometimes difficult....don't give up!

 

[razor ridge]

Thanks all for the advice, it's gonna be a work in progress to dial it all in

 

[jaykush]

if you live in the sticks like i do, you have everything you need around you to grow the best of the best. fuck the store shelf when you have raw natural materials for free.

 

[Montana]

yea everyone has different experiences and dials in what works best for them, everyone has a different environment in their rooms and different strains and methods, as long as you keep experimenting and making mistakes along the way, there is no learning without mistakes so try not to fret too much when you make them......your mix and methods will surely change once you do it a few times, it's worth it though good organic herb is superior

good luck!

 

[razor ridge]

Ive been growing for about 20 years, started with a phototron and bag seed, since I have gone threw a lot of trial and error, from dirt to hydro back to dirt, I have of late been using FFOF but have gotten tired of the expense, and have realized that it is overpriced and insufficient, so I'm going it own my own. I have toyed with my own worm bin and not knowing the difference I used the worked worm soil and got a lot of pest problems, flower thripes were the most destructive of the lot so that turned me off the worm project. I have tons of space and all the leaves, woods debris I need to compost just haven't done it. I need a ext low maintenance system, as the one thing I don't have is extra time. All advice to do with worming, composting and such would be greatly appreciated. Thanks

Ohh any ideas on the guano or alfalfa teas? Ease of making is a key...do you use the tea for all waterings?

 

[jaykush]

if you do a little hard work in the beginning, you can have a virtually maintenance free system. there are many many ways to go about this so i cant tell you what to do or anything. if you need help with some good links to read to help you design easily maintained systems shoot me a pm.

 

[guest2012y]

if you live in the sticks like i do, you have everything you need around you to grow the best of the best. fuck the store shelf when you have raw natural materials for free.

One of these days I'll jump on that train.....seems the ultimate way.
But in the meantime back to work hoarding and mixing organic soil amendments. I'm pretty fortunate to have access to several local sources that have fair prices and quality products. Doesn't really hurt the pocketbook as much as other ways of growing that's for sure.

 

[mad librettist]

Heya razor, couple of points:

top dress the DE powder, don't mix it in. Water will carry it down, and at the same time you have a pest barrier.

what is in your "organic starter plus"? I use Biotone, have for a long time. If you read the label, it has dried manure, feather meal, bone meal, cocoa meal, and all other kinds of diverse goodies to feed the herd long and short term. So instead of adding blood and bone and all that, I just make bio-tone a good part of my mix. Check that label, you may have all you need in that one bag.

Do you have a Napa Auto Parts near you? Napa part #8822 (floordry) is calcined DE chunks made by EaglePicher, the source for Playball and Axis, which are used to condition baseball diamonds (since it absorbs so much water without giving up air, it allows a playing field to be used sooner after drenching rain). Once you screen out the fines with window screen (as open a mesh as possible) and rinse off the dust, you are left with a more durable substitute for perlite that allows more air in the mix, but also more water (weird but true). Calcined DE is riddled with (relatively) massive pores, and supports way more microbial life than perlite. The rinse water from this process is a powerful insecticide. If you can find a source for Playball, that is the best.

As for flower thrips from the worm bin, are you sure you ruled out ALL other possible ways your containers got invaded? A bit of research tells me your conclusion is probably wrong. Check out some citations from that link:

The flower thrips' delicate egg is inserted completely into the plant tissue.

(meaning it's unlikely the colonized your worm bin unless you had plants growing in it)

Because of their small size, flower thrips are carried over large areas by frontal wind systems. They have even been trapped at altitudes of 10,000 feet. Flower thrips are found throughout North Carolina with peak migration during the first week of June.

(Kinda makes you wonder how some grows in your parts don't get thrips.)


Here it comes... Mad Lib is about to go off on the virtues of integrated pest management. I bite my tongue for now, go ye and research.

 

[guest2012y]

Hey Mad,good info.
I believe some types of thrips pupate in the soil,it's kind of difficult to monitor the behavior of thrips because they move out of sight when your hand approaches by slipping behind something like a stem or node out of the the line of your sight,my type did. They seem intelligent enough to evade predation.
Anyway,I recently had a nasty little outbreak of the buggers and since I was at the end of the flower cycle opted to do nothing. At harvest time I began a check on the population. Myself and another trained eye began scanning for thrips anywhere and everywhere...not a one could be found.
This was a large garden and we also handled each plant as we trimmed it under bright lighting...no thrips,not a one was found.
I can only assume that the use of crab shell meal and neem seed meal along with recycling the soil had eventually broke the cycle by building up that population of chitin eating organisms,plus the benefits of the azadactrin,thus interupting that pupate phase of this particular type of thrips life cycle.
When the infestation was in full swing I was noticing that some were actually down near the soil on the base of the stems...hiding from me.
It is possible that they hitched a ride in on worm bedding via some part of that bedding/soil's life,some types also go dormant in soil over winter.
There's lots of good studies out there on the little bastards.

 

[mad librettist]

Hey Mad,good info.
I believe some types of thrips pupate in the soil,it's kind of difficult to monitor the behavior of thrips because they move out of sight when your hand approaches by slipping behind something like a stem or node out of the the line of your sight,my type did. They seem intelligent enough to evade predation.
Anyway,I recently had a nasty little outbreak of the buggers and since I was at the end of the flower cycle opted to do nothing. At harvest time I began a check on the population. Myself and another trained eye began scanning for thrips anywhere and everywhere...not a one could be found.
This was a large garden and we also handled each plant as we trimmed it under bright lighting...no thrips,not a one was found.
I can only assume that the use of crab shell meal and neem meal along with recycling the soil had eventually broke the cycle by building up that population of chitin eating organisms,thus interupting that pupate phase of this particular type of thrips life cycle.
When the infestation was in full swing I was noticing that some where actually down near the soil on the base of the stems...hiding from me.
It is possible that they hitched a ride in on worm bedding via some part of that bedding/soil's life,some types also go dormant in soil over winter.
There's lots of good studies out there on the little bastards.

I'm still not sure what we are assuming attracted the thrips to a worm bin? They are not normally associated with decomp or compost piles. I guess if you had some unfinished compost with eggs inside, but that's easy to fix by properly ripening the compost.

 

[guest2012y]

I think if there was any phase of the game where infestation was likely,it would have been from some type of cross contamination with raw plant material or an infested soil added at some phase to any part of the process. As you say,quite possibly from unfinished compost. From there they would be looking for a way out of "wormville" to do their bidding. Heading towards the light..an exodus to the land of leaf tissue and nutrient rich plant juices. From there it'd be prime breedin' ground...cannabis on the menu for life.

 

[mad librettist]

nice description capt.cheeze, very vivid.