Help a chemical hydro grower make his first organic soil mix

[hisser]

I managed to get some stuff that might be enough to make an organic soil mix, I know some wonderful stuff can be added or replaced... but that's all I could find/got, just need an advice on ratios & if its good for an indoors mix.

My first mix ended up anaerobic from too much water (janitor's mistake) and I used mostly chicken manure pellets, probably helped attracting more insects.

here's a list of what I have and the ratios I came up with:

1 gallon potting soil (peat moss based with organic compost at 6.5-7 pH)
0.75 gal decayed & compacted peat moss
1.5 gal perlite
1.5 gal coco choir
0.25 gal of manure mix (powdered fish + pelleted chicken manure)
4-5 oz hydrated lime

I'll add a bit of powdered oak biochar soaked in manure tea on top. plus I'll give manure teas with carob molasses every 1-2 weeks to boost things up.

Feel free to tweak the recipe

 

[SilverSurfer_OG]

That looks good. If it was me I would pray at the alter of the coco church and add another gallon...

Good luck with your transition.

 

[jaykush]

how long do you plan on letting that mix sit before potting up?

how fresh is the manure?

 

[hisser]

SilverSurfer_OG Thanks mate! I loved coco+perlite in hydro a lot, sounds good to me

jaykush I'll let the soil mix sit at least 3 weeks before using it, the manure is very well composted and sterile.

 

[jaykush]

only other thing i can say is i wouldn't be set in stone with 1 gal perlite. i would just add enough to make a light mix, if 1 gal is enough then thats good, but if its not add more. specially since you said your first mix had poor drainage. you might also want to look into things like pumice( if weight isnt an issue) or rice hulls for additional drainage. because the biochar will make the soil mix hold even more moisture.

also rock powders are a big benefit imo.

 

[Frozenguy]

It looks ok except I would advise against the hydrated lime and suggest dolomite lime. Hydrated lime is hard to work with, and can screw up your Ca:Mg ratios.

 

[statusquo]

Might want to start off with a little bit less manure as you can always add more but its especially hard to compensate for too much food in organic soil growing. You can flush soluble nutrients but many are insoluble/not flushable. In addition, manure sources tend to vary a lot so it's hard to judge + chicken manure runs hot!

And just a side note that's not too important/relevant , sterile means 100% clean of microorganisms whereas sanitary implies 'clean' (for our purposes I guess you could say lack of anaerobic bacteria) Good catch frozen on the hydrated lime - taken directly from the man himself IIRC:
Hydrated Lime- Lacks Magnesium. Handling hydrated lime is hazardous. Also called Slaked lime, Quick lime, Pickling Lime, it is best avoided unless you are in the advanced class… Invokes a sudden pH change and may create further toxic conditions…

Glad you are trying organics out keep us updated! P.S I like the coir idea for helping with water dispersion/retaining more water

 

[hisser]

Thanks all, I'm forced to use hydrated lime since I couldn't find any dolomite lime, the potting soil and the manure got enough mg plus the carob molasses contains lots too. I'll add the hydrated lime after letting the mix sit for 2 weeks, test pH and add it to a bit of hot water then gradually fix it between 6.5 and 7. Maybe I'll lower the dried peat moss ratio a bit too so I won't have to add much of it.

I've modified first post as suggested, thanks again!

 

[B. Friendly]

great starter bro
http://www.gaiagreen.com/products/default.asp
Here's what I go with and my girls love it
MY MIX: Amounts for 50 – 2gallon pots
3 parts peat 2.2cu.ft
3 parts perlite 100 Litre
3 parts coco 1 Brick
2 part potting soil 50Litre, 2 bags
1 part Gaia FERTILIZING SOIL CONDITIONER 4-4-2 30Litre Bag
1 part vermiculite 25Litre Bag
1 part mushroom compost 20Litre Bag
2Litres wormcasts, from Gaia 5-2Litre Bags
15 Parts x 4L(ice cream bucket to ration parts)= 60Litres x 5 mixes = 50 2gallon pots

To each 60 Litres I add:
280g Gaia 4-4-4 All Purpose 5g/litre = 280g’s @ 5 mixes = 1400g’s
(Add some extra Gaia All Purpose at flower, maybe as soil drench??)
225g Gaia Kelp Meal 4g/L = 225g’s @ 5 mixes = 1125g’s
(Add some extra Gaia Kelp Meal at flower, maybe as soil drench??)
225g dolomite lime 4g/litre = 225g’s @ 5 mixes = 1125g’s
????56g GROW,Gaia Seabird guano 1g/litre= 56g’s @ 5 mixes = 280g’s
**Best to give Gaia Seabird Guano as a TEA due to ammonia content.
**If you do want to add Gaia Seabird Guano as a soil additive then let your pots sit for at least 10 days before planting babies.
225g FLOWER, Gaia High P guano 4g/L = 225g’s @ 5 mixes = 1125g’s
56g ?rock potash 1g/L (NOT Needed included in Gaia All Purpose) 280g’s
56g ?rock phosphate 1g/L (NOT Needed included in Gaia All Purpose) 280g’s
molasses at 1 teaspoon/gallon
and some water crystals (As needed, mainly for outdoor grows)
*Note: Do not over water! Do not let your soil completely dry out! Maintain moist but not soggy soil for happy healthy plants.

the bat guano amounts change a little with strain. for instance the Blueberry has less N guano in the mix - but that standard mix has worked for pretty much everything i have grown and i just refine it a little as i get strains dialled in.
feeding is often not necessary but i use Dynagro and some other nut’s every 10-14days’ish sometimes if i think they need it and molasses at 1 teaspoon/gallon weekly,
(from B.Friendly, best, cheapest mix I have ever seen!!) See his results for yourself!!
Important:
Mix it really well, When you think it’s good, mix it some more!

 

[statusquo]

Hydrated Lime works but I would recommend adding it early so that you can deal with any potential PH problems that arise from its use. Also, as with all additives, start small and work your way up. It's kind of hard to evenly distribute and mix hydrated lime into your mix since it's so potent in such small amounts. Another thing to consider about hydrated lime is that although it is a soil sweetner, it doesn't have the same buffering effects that dolomite lime has (gyspum, or drywall, is a cheap buffering agent but honestly dolomite lime is so cheap I highly recommend getting some. ~5$ for a 40lb bag; at roughly 1 cup per gallon of soil mix it's a hell of a deal!)

Good luck and great suggestions everyone Molasses is an awesome and cheap additive, just make sure it's blackstrap molasses and not unsulphered.

Be ready for some very tasty and stinky organic buds Hisser - I haven't read any scientific literature on it, but anecdotally it seems that organic grows tend to result in bud with a more complex/larger terpenoid profile.

 

[hisser]

Shipping 2lb's to my place costs between $200-$400, would feel weird paying this much for a thing that costs $5...

and every local garden store said when I asked about dolomite lime or pH down suitable for organics: "our land doesn't need adjusting ph". And for some reason there's no such thing as plant based compost, its just manure... bone and blood meals are banned, and fish bone meal actually means to them fish manure

Instead of using the dried peat moss which is highly acidic, I'll add more coco, this hopefully won't require much hydrated lime, maybe non at all?

And what about ascorbic acid for lowering pH of water? is it against the organic traditions?

Instead of Blackstrap molasses I'll use Carob molasses, I had great results with it in hydro and soil, all types of plants seemed to love it here's what it usually contains:

mineral Analysis Results (mg / kg)
amount of substance is soluble in water (mg / kg): 68
Sodium (mg / kg): 203
Potassium (mg / kg): 7040
Zinc (mg / kg): 10
Calcium (mg / kg): 1234
Iron (mg / kg): 7.6
Phosphorus (mg / kg): 547
Manganese (mg / kg): 3
Magnesium (mg / kg): 500
Copper (mg / kg): 0.8

May the Microherd rule the Earth!

 

[SGS]

it would seem in this case less is more!

you may be adding things you dont need.

What type of Organic Mix are you trying to make here:
A mix that you don't want to feed much after planting? OR
A mix that requires a feeding once a week during the grow?

These goals need to be defined as they require totally different materials.

SGS

 

[hisser]

here's the composition of the chicken manure --> Fertiplus 4-3-3

not sure about the goat manure N-P-K but the internets states its 1.44-0.5-1.21

Fish manure --> Guanumus

I'll get info on the potting soil later on.

Cheers

 

[hisser]

SGS024 I don't mind both, a super soil or a soil that needs teas, all I want is a soil that does a good job...

The potting soil has 100-300ml/1L of N-P-K and it needs fertilizing after 6 weeks.

So I finally made the mix, I ended up using more coco & perlite & less peatmoss/lime.

I ditched the goat manure, used about 0.25 gal of 30% chicken + 70% fish manure.

I measured the pH after all got mixed & moistened & it was about 6.8 pH.

The mix ended up smelling good + light in weight, looked like it drains well, Here's a pic of the mix sitting:



I'll be adding the biochar in a couple of days.

 

[hisser]

Tested the pH today and the result was around 6.12, I'm thinking of using gypsum or wood ash...

 

[SilverSurfer_OG]

6.12 is fine for weed. In fact its great. Anything between 6 - 7 in soil and they be very happy but more on the acid side is good.

Have you added your biochar yet? I have found mine to be alkaline at around 9ph.

Its best to just let your mix mellow and the ph will come into balance. Wood ash is good but has extreme ph and is easily washed out. Gyspum is neutral. Also you have to be very careful of your source of gyspum as some is industrial waste and will have high levels of cadmium and possibly othet heavy metals.

What strains you going with?

 

[milehighmedical]

.

 

[hisser]

SilverSurfer_OG Thanks for the insights brother, I'll add the biochar today, been soaking it in a fish guano tea, I'll cover a thin layer on top of each pot & mix a bit, then test pH after a week or so. just to make sure its staying between 6-7.

The strains I'm using are ALF#3, ICU#2, & Bad Betty by Mossy, since they are auto-flowers this gives me about 3 weeks till females show pistils & get transplanted, so hopefully I got a bit of time to tweak the mix & let it mellow.

milehighmedical Thank you

Respect