Greenmopho
Member
Do you use RO in your res? Did you get the algae with RO water, or with tap?
Basically, replicate the conditions of your res in a bucket with an airstone, without a plant. Any nutrient with a good source of N will work.
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H202 dilution ratio?
- Thread starter bilbobonger
- Start date
Do you use RO in your res? Did you get the algae with RO water, or with tap?
Basically, replicate the conditions of your res in a bucket with an airstone, without a plant. Any nutrient with a good source of N will work.
bilbobonger
Member
I've had BA with both RO and tap. This previous mix was RO water w/MaxiGrow, Diamond Nectar, and Root Excellerator, and I added pH up to about 5.8. Planning on using only the base nutrient (MaxiGrow I guess it would be) until I get this straitened out. I'll toss some in and dial the pH. But I have tap water in the bucket right now. Can't really get at the filter right now. Gotta drag the hose through the house and everyone's sleeping. Is it ok just to use the tap? I mean if the RO doesn't filter out the BA, it shouldn't matter either way right?
jesus... that's just crazy scary... lmao... all sorts of shit in the tap!
something like that came out of my lung once, but damn...
bilbobonger
Member
I was thinkin the same thing. Looks like a cracked-back lunger. Things gonna give me nightmares.
Hey Guys,
This thread's come along nicely & i see your starting to get to the bottom of things. I just want to clarify that meself & friends of mine have got rid of a B'A Bloom in its early stages with the sole use of H2o2+water, im not saying it'll 100% work for you Bilo(we dropped the hygrozyme at the time-in DWC), your res looks to be quite mucky & looking at that im convinced you have a more advanced bloom than we did, so as Cannagirl is trying to get across it could make it worse but i cant see it as H2o2 destroys anything Organic & breaks it down, eventually,that includes all form's of Fungi, Bacteria, so i cant see Brown Algae being immune to the cleansing properties of h2o2, but i could be wrong. I think we can safely say you need the bene's, thats one definate, is that where your going now after sterilising your system mate?.
What Bene's are you gonna use? or rather what brand?
This thread's come along nicely & i see your starting to get to the bottom of things. I just want to clarify that meself & friends of mine have got rid of a B'A Bloom in its early stages with the sole use of H2o2+water, im not saying it'll 100% work for you Bilo(we dropped the hygrozyme at the time-in DWC), your res looks to be quite mucky & looking at that im convinced you have a more advanced bloom than we did, so as Cannagirl is trying to get across it could make it worse but i cant see it as H2o2 destroys anything Organic & breaks it down, eventually,that includes all form's of Fungi, Bacteria, so i cant see Brown Algae being immune to the cleansing properties of h2o2, but i could be wrong. I think we can safely say you need the bene's, thats one definate, is that where your going now after sterilising your system mate?.
What Bene's are you gonna use? or rather what brand?
bilbobonger
Member
Probably gonna end up going with the GH beneficials and the UV deal as recommended by cannagirl and mopho, though I would like to first give it a go with just a base veg nutrient and h202, and see if it fogs up. Came across a lot of people online that claim to have gotten rid of this stuff with h202 alone, though what I've got going here does seem to be pretty advanced. Also, the form of algae I'm dealing with here might be different and perhaps easier to get rid of than what canna&mopho had. Definitely never had any slime like that. Though if BA does in fact feed on oxygen, seems plausible that more oxygen would just increase the bloom. But I got the stuff, so I figure I might as well give it a go. If nothing else, it sounds like it'll be a good additive to throw in once the funk's gone.
Forgot to put the damn nutes in bubbling bucket last night. But everything's crystal clear. Gonna throw some in and see what happens, though as I mentioned before, never seems to fog up until after flooding the table.
So are there synthetic nutrients that contain beneficial bacteria, or is this something that's only found in organics? For instance, say I disinfect everything (get the UV if necessary), can I just go with GH 3 part, or something similar and get by? Had numerous people recommend against organics in an ebb and flow type system. As I said before, at the risk of coming off like a pimple on the ass of progress, I'd like to stick with synthetic nutes for a minute if possible. Got school starting in about a week. I'm shooting for cost efficient ease of operation at least for the time being.
Forgot to put the damn nutes in bubbling bucket last night. But everything's crystal clear. Gonna throw some in and see what happens, though as I mentioned before, never seems to fog up until after flooding the table.
So are there synthetic nutrients that contain beneficial bacteria, or is this something that's only found in organics? For instance, say I disinfect everything (get the UV if necessary), can I just go with GH 3 part, or something similar and get by? Had numerous people recommend against organics in an ebb and flow type system. As I said before, at the risk of coming off like a pimple on the ass of progress, I'd like to stick with synthetic nutes for a minute if possible. Got school starting in about a week. I'm shooting for cost efficient ease of operation at least for the time being.
Yeah, thats the route i rec'd in the beginning with the Ionic & H2o2 only after the sterilisation(nutes & h2o2 only),& go from there. Imo Oraganics & Hydroponics is or can be complicated to get dialled in, knowing about & adding bene's for example, ive seen commercial organic hydro operations using bio-filters in large NFT Rigs(check that out). Not sure on the GH 3Part, i know GH is good stuff, but i believe the grow part is useless & not needed(Back to Lucas or Heads formula 0/6/9). Never used it myself but enough people on IC swear its exellent stuff, i think you'll be just fine. If not & you can get the Ionic you should try it man! Not sure if i mentioned Heath robinson is using it right now & have you seen his 24oz Trees or however huge they are? Now thats a monster of a plant.
Did you Clean-Spray the roots of all the slime and poo after? or did you just clean out the res etc.? I think your onto a winner now anyway, hope the bene's work out for ya bro. Im thinking of innoculating with bene's in my DWC this time myself. Keep everyone posted on how you get on bro! Good Luck with it all!
Did you Clean-Spray the roots of all the slime and poo after? or did you just clean out the res etc.? I think your onto a winner now anyway, hope the bene's work out for ya bro. Im thinking of innoculating with bene's in my DWC this time myself. Keep everyone posted on how you get on bro! Good Luck with it all!
I just wanted to add that i see alot of people hating on H2O2 & why is beyond me really, people hate it & dont even use bene's etc. The Growth sperts you get using it are Huge, not to mention the healthier plants, Darker leaves, Thicker stems & 100% piece of mind that NO nasty pathogen is lurking. I use throughout Veg before i start using organic addy's like Canna Boost Acellerator in bloom, its very handy stuff to have about. If i see PH diving down that can mean usually one of two things, either my nutes are too strong or i have a bacterial issue & an application of H2o2 is needed, then worry's over. I swear by the stuff myself! Good Luck All!
C
cannagirl
I dont hate H2O2, I've got a bottle in my lineup at the moment, but what Im saying is that a plant scientist with a masters degree in plant pathologies and BA, told me that the H2O2 doesn't truly work.
Scrogerman, you said that when you were using H2O2 and you were also using Hygrozyme. So I see how it worked, the hygrozyme is designed to basically consume or breakdown the algae or any other organics in the water and the H2O2 will keep everything else out of the res, thus allowing you to fight the BA successfully. Im wondering though if you were sure it was BA you had, because usually H2O2 works the best on rot or lack of O2 issues. Neither of which contribute to a BA bloom...
Scrogerman, you said that when you were using H2O2 and you were also using Hygrozyme. So I see how it worked, the hygrozyme is designed to basically consume or breakdown the algae or any other organics in the water and the H2O2 will keep everything else out of the res, thus allowing you to fight the BA successfully. Im wondering though if you were sure it was BA you had, because usually H2O2 works the best on rot or lack of O2 issues. Neither of which contribute to a BA bloom...
C
cannagirl
Bilbobonger, I think to really tackle the BA issue, you have to find the source and address that first.
As far as synthetic benies, I dont believe so, but I will take a picture of our res water with the benies already in it to give you an idea, its not soupy and it does not clog 1/4 inch feed lines. There is no build up in the lines or the pump either. We must stay on top of our Ph though because we have a live micro-herd in the water.
When I first started out growing I grew using just GH 3 part and nothing else and it worked great, now in a different climate, with different pathogens in the water I have had to alter my style.
Im currently in the process of setting up and video taping a BA experiment, using all sorts of methods to get rid of it, Ill be posting the trials and results when Im done. It should be ready in about a week. Ill post some results in this thread too!
As far as synthetic benies, I dont believe so, but I will take a picture of our res water with the benies already in it to give you an idea, its not soupy and it does not clog 1/4 inch feed lines. There is no build up in the lines or the pump either. We must stay on top of our Ph though because we have a live micro-herd in the water.
When I first started out growing I grew using just GH 3 part and nothing else and it worked great, now in a different climate, with different pathogens in the water I have had to alter my style.
Im currently in the process of setting up and video taping a BA experiment, using all sorts of methods to get rid of it, Ill be posting the trials and results when Im done. It should be ready in about a week. Ill post some results in this thread too!
Hey Cannagirl,
Yeah im with you on everything, but it truly was Brown Algae, 2 different grow locations, 2 different systems. A B'A Bloom was positively ID'd after using hygrozyme in an 'Unsterile' Res, i believe trying to use Hygro, in an unsterile enviroment will kick off a bloom, & this has been my Obsevations. Ive done a ton of research, although its been a while since now. On the Hygro website it gives instruction to only use it in a sterile enviroment from the beginning of your grow, so it sort of makes sense to me that what happened was a BA Bloom.
It was noticed very quickly & in my res was just starting. I dumped my res, finger cleaned & sprayed my roots with a h2o2 solution, then changed-out my res for fresh Nutes & H2o2 only. The BA Bloom was not given the chance to get a foot hold. In my grow buddies Res using the exact same nute & addy shedual with Hygro the BA Bloom was much more advanced than mine & my buddy acted late. I told him to do the same thing as me, 10 days later after cleaning & steriling everything & using just the Nutes & Oxy+(H2o2), His BA Bloom had also been defeated. He lost many clumps of the root balls/roots but all new lovely white root growth was then observed, exactly the same as mine.
My conclusion was H2o2 will rid you of a BA bloom but i can only say in the early stages of a bloom. How Can you mistake that Brown Slime/Snot that sticks to the roots, completely enveloping them in Snoty Slime. Yip it was 100% most certainly a BA bloom, wish i had of taken some pics, maybe my buddy did, ill ask him.
Ive learned that if id of innoculated with bene's in the first place, Hygrozyme would have been a very welcome protective addy in my DWC system, offereing extreamly high root protection among other benefits. Ive spoken to a few heads who use it in DWC & all report positively, although most say its too expensive. all thats another story anyway.
Im starting to think that Hygro purposely causes a BA bloom so Bene's can feed, but im not sure on this score at all, i do know alot of people have complained about getting 'Slimed'(a BA Bloom) because of using Hygro. If only they would have innoculated with Bene's, it may be a different story with little or no complaints. I wanna give it another try just now.
Has anybody got a recommendation for Bene's in DWC-(which brand), im thinking Voodoo Juice from AN or GreatWhite or some other powdered versions ive seen, qany advice for my DWC would be great. Cheers!
Oh yeah one other thing that was noticed that sort of proved to me it was not pythium was the smell, its a dead give away for rootrot & stinks, & this was not the case, the both Res's smelt ok & nothing like when Rot gets a hold! G'Luck!
Yeah im with you on everything, but it truly was Brown Algae, 2 different grow locations, 2 different systems. A B'A Bloom was positively ID'd after using hygrozyme in an 'Unsterile' Res, i believe trying to use Hygro, in an unsterile enviroment will kick off a bloom, & this has been my Obsevations. Ive done a ton of research, although its been a while since now. On the Hygro website it gives instruction to only use it in a sterile enviroment from the beginning of your grow, so it sort of makes sense to me that what happened was a BA Bloom.
It was noticed very quickly & in my res was just starting. I dumped my res, finger cleaned & sprayed my roots with a h2o2 solution, then changed-out my res for fresh Nutes & H2o2 only. The BA Bloom was not given the chance to get a foot hold. In my grow buddies Res using the exact same nute & addy shedual with Hygro the BA Bloom was much more advanced than mine & my buddy acted late. I told him to do the same thing as me, 10 days later after cleaning & steriling everything & using just the Nutes & Oxy+(H2o2), His BA Bloom had also been defeated. He lost many clumps of the root balls/roots but all new lovely white root growth was then observed, exactly the same as mine.
My conclusion was H2o2 will rid you of a BA bloom but i can only say in the early stages of a bloom. How Can you mistake that Brown Slime/Snot that sticks to the roots, completely enveloping them in Snoty Slime. Yip it was 100% most certainly a BA bloom, wish i had of taken some pics, maybe my buddy did, ill ask him.
Ive learned that if id of innoculated with bene's in the first place, Hygrozyme would have been a very welcome protective addy in my DWC system, offereing extreamly high root protection among other benefits. Ive spoken to a few heads who use it in DWC & all report positively, although most say its too expensive. all thats another story anyway.
Im starting to think that Hygro purposely causes a BA bloom so Bene's can feed, but im not sure on this score at all, i do know alot of people have complained about getting 'Slimed'(a BA Bloom) because of using Hygro. If only they would have innoculated with Bene's, it may be a different story with little or no complaints. I wanna give it another try just now.
Has anybody got a recommendation for Bene's in DWC-(which brand), im thinking Voodoo Juice from AN or GreatWhite or some other powdered versions ive seen, qany advice for my DWC would be great. Cheers!
Oh yeah one other thing that was noticed that sort of proved to me it was not pythium was the smell, its a dead give away for rootrot & stinks, & this was not the case, the both Res's smelt ok & nothing like when Rot gets a hold! G'Luck!
C
cannagirl
Scroger your observations are interesting, Ill keep that in mind when I start the experiment.
For benies in DWC, I prefer some powders but I also like some liquids. In our line up we use the House and Garden roots excelerator, we use this all through veg and we add it into the first res of bloom but then we dont add anymore, but we also dont dump the res throughout bloom so technically it should still be in there. We also use aqaushield a liquid which is basically chicken shit, the GH Sub-B powder and sometimes we will add GH Sub-M powder, although its not always necessary.
For benies in DWC, I prefer some powders but I also like some liquids. In our line up we use the House and Garden roots excelerator, we use this all through veg and we add it into the first res of bloom but then we dont add anymore, but we also dont dump the res throughout bloom so technically it should still be in there. We also use aqaushield a liquid which is basically chicken shit, the GH Sub-B powder and sometimes we will add GH Sub-M powder, although its not always necessary.
Thanks CannaGirl,
Let us know please if or when you start your experiments, id really like to watch & follow along, definately have an interest on most of the issues we've disscussed here, Im more than certain that the use of H2o2(17.5% solution at 3-5mls per 10litres) will be effective against an early BA bloom, if it was very advanced id of used Physan20 although its Not for sale or banned in the UK(i think), im sure i could get my hands on some if i tried.
I defo want to go the bene route. I use Rhizotonic but i wanna try the RExelurator, keep hearing its the nuts, Thanks for your input on the bene's, ill prolly go with Voodoo anyway. Cheers!
Billo, my bet is the H2o2 will clear up your res nicely bro. Did for me & my buddy & it was defo a BA bloom bro, I wish you luck with it, keep us posted!
Let us know please if or when you start your experiments, id really like to watch & follow along, definately have an interest on most of the issues we've disscussed here, Im more than certain that the use of H2o2(17.5% solution at 3-5mls per 10litres) will be effective against an early BA bloom, if it was very advanced id of used Physan20 although its Not for sale or banned in the UK(i think), im sure i could get my hands on some if i tried.
I defo want to go the bene route. I use Rhizotonic but i wanna try the RExelurator, keep hearing its the nuts, Thanks for your input on the bene's, ill prolly go with Voodoo anyway. Cheers!
Billo, my bet is the H2o2 will clear up your res nicely bro. Did for me & my buddy & it was defo a BA bloom bro, I wish you luck with it, keep us posted!
bilbobonger
Member
No sign of algae yet. Got my 5 gallon bucket going with tapwater, and the res w/RO, both w/MaxiGro from General Hydro. Doin my best to keep any light out. The real test I think will be when they get their next flood. Usually by the next day after, the water's all cloudy. Could this have something to do with the coco perhaps? Seems that whenever I try to recirculate my nutes is when the shit starts to take hold.
Scrogerman-
Just checked out some of Heath's girls. Yeah, fuqin monster
Didn't do any spray cleaning on the roots. They're newbie clones, only had one hit of nutes since I put em in 3 inchers with coco (Canna). Still waitin for em to dry out from that first hit. Ya think I should flush em perhaps?
Cannagirl-
Should I pretty much rule out the BA being in the water source? My last few runs, I was getting clones from a buddy who was having problems with gnats. Perhaps I just didn't clean out the equipment well enough. I've previously only been using water for everything. Definitely gonna start doing the bleach thing in between runs from now on. I also have Root Excellerator here. Should I add some into the mix to eat the funk, or should a wait on it? Lookin forward to the vid.
Thanks for the posts all. Really hoping for a good run here.
Bilbo
Scrogerman-
Just checked out some of Heath's girls. Yeah, fuqin monster
Didn't do any spray cleaning on the roots. They're newbie clones, only had one hit of nutes since I put em in 3 inchers with coco (Canna). Still waitin for em to dry out from that first hit. Ya think I should flush em perhaps? Cannagirl-
Should I pretty much rule out the BA being in the water source? My last few runs, I was getting clones from a buddy who was having problems with gnats. Perhaps I just didn't clean out the equipment well enough. I've previously only been using water for everything. Definitely gonna start doing the bleach thing in between runs from now on. I also have Root Excellerator here. Should I add some into the mix to eat the funk, or should a wait on it? Lookin forward to the vid.
Thanks for the posts all. Really hoping for a good run here.
Bilbo
Perhaps you should do a lil flush, but will that effect the coco, prolly yes,maybe flush through then re-charge the coco,i wouldnt leave it flushed(the little i know on coco), id of still run a h2o2 sol myself. If i was you man, id stick with low EC nutes & H2o2 untill your clean, then maybe add other stuff, but as i dont run coco, you cant really listen to me, i know coco needs nute charge or def's will start to appear. Didnt realise your using Coco, that sorta makes things a little different. A few buddys of mine run NilNat as precausionary measure against nat. they seem to like Coco(nats).
R'Exel isnt considered a bene suppliment is it? dont think thats gonna work, bene's might, but ionly use after sterilisation or youl kill them! Good Luck buddy! hope you kick the slime's ass! it is a pita!
Cloudy res solution is not a clever sign man, it can mean a bacterial issue/bloom, which the h2o2 should nuke tbh! your not adding ph up & down to the same res are you?, that will do it, dont add ph up&down together, im sure you know that though.
R'Exel isnt considered a bene suppliment is it? dont think thats gonna work, bene's might, but ionly use after sterilisation or youl kill them! Good Luck buddy! hope you kick the slime's ass! it is a pita!
Cloudy res solution is not a clever sign man, it can mean a bacterial issue/bloom, which the h2o2 should nuke tbh! your not adding ph up & down to the same res are you?, that will do it, dont add ph up&down together, im sure you know that though.
bilbobonger
Member
Was thinkin about doin a little flush. Maybe do it right before their next nute hit. Get rid of any funk that was left in there, and recharge the cations right afterwards with a flood. They look like they still need at least a couple days before they're ready for another flood. I've gotta read back through this thread. I thought Cannagirl referred to RE as being a bennie. IDK, I might be wrong though.
Never heard the thing about mixing pH up and pH down before. This will cause a bloom? Come to think of it, I over shot a bit with the up last time around and had to mix in squirt of down (both GH products). Had to do this quite a bit on previous runs. Not sure how I'm gonna get around it though. Now that I'm using an RO filter, it drops my pH to around 4.6. Gotta use a good shot of up to get it to 5.8, then it raises after every flood, so I've gotta throw in down. Have I been causing this thing the whole time? I mentioned before that my buddy always has clear water w/no lids on his res. One thing he doesn't have to deal with over there is pH. Apparently the water's already pH'd to the nutrients he uses. Never even has to check it.
Never heard the thing about mixing pH up and pH down before. This will cause a bloom? Come to think of it, I over shot a bit with the up last time around and had to mix in squirt of down (both GH products). Had to do this quite a bit on previous runs. Not sure how I'm gonna get around it though. Now that I'm using an RO filter, it drops my pH to around 4.6. Gotta use a good shot of up to get it to 5.8, then it raises after every flood, so I've gotta throw in down. Have I been causing this thing the whole time? I mentioned before that my buddy always has clear water w/no lids on his res. One thing he doesn't have to deal with over there is pH. Apparently the water's already pH'd to the nutrients he uses. Never even has to check it.
bilbobonger
Member
cannagirl-
You mentioned earlier in this thread that if I wanted to run sterile, with no bennies, I would need to add a small amount of bleach to the res periodically. Is this only necessary when the BA's in the water supply? May very well hit em with bennies either way, was just wondering.
Hope everything's going well w/the experiment. Thanks for all the help.
You mentioned earlier in this thread that if I wanted to run sterile, with no bennies, I would need to add a small amount of bleach to the res periodically. Is this only necessary when the BA's in the water supply? May very well hit em with bennies either way, was just wondering.
Hope everything's going well w/the experiment. Thanks for all the help.
C
cannagirl
Only add the bleach if you have not already added the benies, otherwise you are just wasting them. The ratio is 10ml per gal. I would say that anytime you want to run sterile run bleach. No matter if the BA is in the water or not.
How did the flood go, your water still clear?
How did the flood go, your water still clear?
H2o2, Oxy+, aka Hydrogen peroxide is a type of bleach & will sterilise everything man. if you want to sterilise just use the OXY+(h2o2)man, no need for anything else & certainly not domestic or commercial bleach's(they may leave a residue). For equipment cleaning etc, it can be used at a much higher rate than when just using with roots. I cant remember the exact amount, but its much stronger, a quick search will clarify.
No RootsExel is not a bene suppliment as far as i know, its a root stim. Hope the Res stays clear for ya man! yeah dont Mix PH up & Down together, it turns Res solution Cloudy straight away, & this could be mistaked for a bacterial bloom or something similar, maybe you have no problem there other than mixing the up & down, which is a No-No as far as i know. Mmm does it cause some sort of precipitation, thats what it looks like to me, really cloudy solution after doing it, all the litrature advises against mixing the two, but im not 100% sure why, i cant remember off the top of my head. i'd throw it & start again personally, but that may be a little harsh, but thats what i'd do. Good luck!
Check out the other benefits of using H2o2, imo a very under rated suppliment:
http://www.growthtechnology.com/mgmt-loxygen.asp
After reading that again for the first time in ages, it honestly makes me wonder why more dont use this stuff, especially good for new or novice growers, as it offers very effective protection against the mistakes often made by such peoples! Some of the Best results ive had ever were with Ionic Nutes, Oxy+, a little Superthrive now & then & Canna PK, Wow was my reaction, i may go back to basics as it yields great & there aint much in Quality difference anyway. Snake-oil everwhere these days, everyone in the industry seems to be on the take or on the fiddle, get real peoples!.
No RootsExel is not a bene suppliment as far as i know, its a root stim. Hope the Res stays clear for ya man! yeah dont Mix PH up & Down together, it turns Res solution Cloudy straight away, & this could be mistaked for a bacterial bloom or something similar, maybe you have no problem there other than mixing the up & down, which is a No-No as far as i know. Mmm does it cause some sort of precipitation, thats what it looks like to me, really cloudy solution after doing it, all the litrature advises against mixing the two, but im not 100% sure why, i cant remember off the top of my head. i'd throw it & start again personally, but that may be a little harsh, but thats what i'd do. Good luck!
Check out the other benefits of using H2o2, imo a very under rated suppliment:
http://www.growthtechnology.com/mgmt-loxygen.asp
After reading that again for the first time in ages, it honestly makes me wonder why more dont use this stuff, especially good for new or novice growers, as it offers very effective protection against the mistakes often made by such peoples! Some of the Best results ive had ever were with Ionic Nutes, Oxy+, a little Superthrive now & then & Canna PK, Wow was my reaction, i may go back to basics as it yields great & there aint much in Quality difference anyway. Snake-oil everwhere these days, everyone in the industry seems to be on the take or on the fiddle, get real peoples!.
Greenmopho
Member
Hydrogen Peroxide = H202
Bleach = sodium hypochlorite, NaClO
Bleach does not disinfect through oxidation.
If H2O2 is cleaning your roots, you don't have brown algae. If hygrozyme is cleaning your roots, you don't have brown algae. If water temps are responsible for the slime on your roots, you don't have brown algae. Brown algae is a last resort diagnosis that comes AFTER you've tried EVERYTHING to cure bacterial or fungal root rot, especially lowering water temp, and the slime is still persistent. Pythium will not survive in water below 72 degrees, brown algae will.
Please read through the entire Sticky on Brown Algae before jumping to more conclusions.
https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=55259&highlight=h202
