need help with clones in coco

[ajc0k]

hey guys this is my first run with coco, and indoors really, so i decided to go big. 4k bare bulb stadium.

What STRAIN are you growing? Williams wonder ix, green crack, the white x sour diesel, mosca c99 bx, og kush, 48 total.
What was the establishing technique? (Were the seed or clone?) clones
What is the age of your plants? 5 DAYS FROM CLONE
What PHASE are the plants in? (seedling, vegetative or flower) are the plants in? VEG
What Technique are you using?
What substrate/medium are you using?(Hydroton, RockWool etc.) USING CANNA COCO
What is the Nutrient temperature? NOT SURE
What Nutrient's are you using? FLORANOVA GROW
What is the TDS/EC/PPM you are using? 200 ppm (shitty meter)
What is the pH of the "Tank"? never check ph and have had good results.
Are you sure your calibration is correct on your equiptment?
When was your last watering? yesterday, 2 ml gal floranova grow.
When was your last feeding change? (ie. grow-bloom-micro-additional)
What size bulb are you using? (4) 1000 watt bare sunpulse 3k bulbs on quantums all dimmed to 500 watts at the moment.
What is the distance to the canopy?
What is your RH Factor? 34%
What is the canopy temperature? varies, 70 with bulbs at 500 watt power 50% dimmed.
What is the Day/Night Temp? (Include flucutaion range) day temp ~73-75 F .night temp 69-71 @ 2000 watts total~, 4 bulbs dimmed 50%
What is the current Air Flow? (cfm etc.) 1300 cfm total exhausting through 2 filters, crazy air flow
Is the fan blowing directly at plants? oscillating fans: 1 mounted on ground, 1 on ceiling.no they arent they blow directly at bulbs, plants still sway though.
Is your water HARD or SOFT? RO WATER
Has plant been recently pruned, cloned off of or pinched
Have any pest chemicals been used? If so, What and When? MONTEREY GARDEN for thrips, when clones rooted.
Are plant's infected with pest's , all my seed moms were infected with thrips until treatment.

SORRY FOR BAD PICS, cant find camera so i used my macbook. also plants on concrete floor are missing for a few days, both rows.

the problem: all growth is yellowing, hardly growing at all, twisted leaves, stems are purple, getting some burnt looking marks. upon transplanting i fed them floranova grow at ~2ml/gal. I DID NOT PRECHARGE COCO (found out about that after transplant, shit!) could that be the issue here? I have around 4 c99 clones in fox farms ocean forest soil and they are growing fucking lovely already, not the coco plants though (except the green crack i bought from club, in RW cubes)

 

[brummiefarmer]

I wouldn't worry too much. Clones can look rather dishevelled as their bio-systems fight between rooting and growing. Let them get a bit bigger before looking at nitro for the green and other micro-nutes. Once they establish themselves, they should be alright. The soil has nitro in it so they will be greener than the coco wich has zero in it.

New to here, but very old grower. Moved from grasscity as they were too much over there....

 

[FirstTracks]

Looks like you have some that are still unrooted clones? It was hard to tell if they're rooted or not from your description.

If they're not rooted...
-Your light might be too strong
-why did you use grow instead of bloom nutes? For clones, nitrogen slows down rooting, while a dose of around 1 mL /gal of GH bloom can be useful in getting plants to root quicker.
-your light levels might be too high. You could be a lot more efficient just cloning under fluoros and then transplanting IMHO.
-you say you never check pH, but then you ask what the problem might be....do you know about nutrient lockout?

When I cloned in coco, I just started in small cups with holes in the bottom and filled with pure coco sitting in a 1/2 inch of water. I used 1 mL/gal GH bloom until rooting was well underway. Clear cups are nice because you can see the roots.

 

[ajc0k]

yes all the plants* have roots around 2-3 inches when transplanted. i know if i could do it all over again I would have put all the plants in party cups and let them grow out under a 400 a week or two until transplant rather than straight to 2 gallon pots. however I screwed up and rushed it which ended up making matters worse. i never check ph anymore because i've had near perfect growth in the past with just ro water nova and cal mag but i shouldn't be ignorant i'll pick up some drops today and investigate. thanks for the fast responses guys.

 

[Mitch Connor]

Great strain selection you have there AJ.

First, I'd like to reference an article I picked up from these forums a while back. It has loads of very useful information on coco. Give it a thorough read, it has helped me understand a lot of coco's qwerks.

http://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?p=3650404#post3650404

Precharging coco is more of a necessity when using low-quality coco. Canna is one of the best out there; they already pre-treat their coco prior to packaging with what's needed to get started. From what I recall it's basic cal/mag, and some trichoderma mychorrizae.

You say you have never checked pH and it has worked thus far? What medium was this in? The pH of your feedings in coco should lie anywhere between 5.4 and 6.1. Lower pH does not affect the availability of nutrients as drastically as higher pH. This could explain why your soil plants are loving life at the moment. Your pH might be in the 6.5 range to allow healthy soil growth, but in coco this is a quick road to lockout.

Using 0ppm RO water means you are only feeding what the FNG has inside of it. I do not know what elements reside in this formula, but it is essential for healthy growth to contain all 17 macro and micronutrients. Good quality tap water usually contains most of these elements in desired amounts, sufficient for healthy growth.

General consensus with coco and RO water is you need to supplement additional cal/mag to allow coco's CEC (Cation Exchange Capacity) to be filled, and allow the release of these elements to the plants, as coco has a natural ability to withhold these in the fibres, along with storing excessive potassium.

To me, the main problems you are suffering at this stage may be due to:

- pH of nutrient solution. Be sure it is in the range of 5.4-6.1. It may be too high at the moment causing the lockout/stunted growth.

- Underfeeding. As far as I know, clones your size should be able to take at least a 300ppm solution without burning. I am feeding 400ppm (.5 conversion, 0.8 EC) to my 3 week old seedlings and they are very dark green with no burnt tips. They are only 4 inches tall and 4 inches wide for comparison. My strain (Mandala Speed Queen) is not a heavy feeding strain as well.

- Insufficient cal/mag due to RO water. Supplement in with your feeding regiment at a light dose. I've never needed to use cal/mag in coco. I use soft tap water/h3ads formula with GH Micro/Bloom.

Hopefully others agree with my findings, as I'd like to make sure I'm not misdiagnosing your plants. From my experience with coco, you can count on a quick turnaround once you find that sweet spot for your TDS/pH.