Cover Croppin' the Yard.

[Tactical Farmer]

No I didn't consider sheet mulching if its what it sounds like.

Like place a tarp over grass until its dead ?

Might work better for trapping in the grasses nitrogen - I got grass globs that are mainly going to dry up & lose most of the grasses N to evaporation since most didn't get covered.

Im going to have to till it again in a week or so to break up the clumps.

 

[JackTheGrower]

Selection of cover crops may include over winter varieties that actually grow green all winter and die in the spring.

I too worked the roto-tiller on my yard when I had one.. Eventually I build a screen and made rows where I screened out the glass, rocks and whatnot to make a smooth and uniform bed. Then I planted the cover crop mix from Peaceful Valley.

What is your soil like?
Do you have a half inch screen?

Anyway it's fun.. i was looking at a picture of me in my cover cropped backyard a while back and I had Hair then!

Good job with the soil!

----

French intensive style and you can mix materials like alfalfa pellets and rock dusts.
Now is the time for minerals and meals such as bone and greensand..

Ah so much you can do but while you are screening and digging the rows you can mix in materials and get a huge jump on making that yard productive.

I'll be watching to see what you decide!

 

[mad librettist]

to sheet compost on grass the best bet is WET cardboard or newspaper. compost on top, then mulch on top of that. (like hay and straw) Or you can get all lasagna about it.


CT I wouldn't discount the life already in the soil. I think a lot of people ruin a good thing when they till, even that first time. Maybe a bit more energy should go into teaching people how to spot a good thing. Really, I've been poking around with a buddy's scope, and dirt that's been neglected looks better than the cultivated part of the same property.

btw CT, if one is to till, would you agree that it's best to remove the plants and return them on top after the turning?

 

[CT Guy]

to sheet compost on grass the best bet is WET cardboard or newspaper. compost on top, then mulch on top of that. (like hay and straw) Or you can get all lasagna about it.


CT I wouldn't discount the life already in the soil. I think a lot of people ruin a good thing when they till, even that first time. Maybe a bit more energy should go into teaching people how to spot a good thing. Really, I've been poking around with a buddy's scope, and dirt that's been neglected looks better than the cultivated part of the same property.

btw CT, if one is to till, would you agree that it's best to remove the plants and return them on top after the turning?

ML is correct in regard to sheet mulching. Cardboard, burlap sacks, and other bio-degradable materials are used in conjunction with compost (if you have it) as a way of killing the grass and adding biology and organic material. This would be my choice if you have the time to allow nature to do the work for you.

In regards to tilling, the reason I recommend it if your compaction zone is really really high (like the 1-2") the tilling allows you to incorporate compost and other organic ferts, in addition to breaking up that compaction. True, you're destroying fungal hyphae that will take time to re-grow, but how can you grow well in soil that's compacted that badly anyway?

When you talk about removing the plants, are you referring to a cover crop? Most gardeners I know just till them in, but I don't have any personal experience with this. What's the advantage of returning them to the top? Sounds like a lot of extra labor....

 

[redneck shogun]

When you talk about removing the plants, are you referring to a cover crop? Most gardeners I know just till them in, but I don't have any personal experience with this. What's the advantage of returning them to the top? Sounds like a lot of extra labor....

It seems to me that if the point where the time it takes the soil life to recover to the "before till" point exceeds the time it takes for the organic matter to break the hardpan naturally, then don't till. If that makes any sense at all.

 

[CT Guy]

It seems to me that if the point where the time it takes the soil life to recover to the "before till" point exceeds the the time it takes for the organic matter to break the hardpan naturally, then don't till. If that makes any sense at all.

It takes years to significantly lower a compaction zone with nature (the biology slowly breaks through it).

With tilling you can add the biology back through incorporating compost and compost teas.

 

[mad librettist]

When you talk about removing the plants, are you referring to a cover crop? Most gardeners I know just till them in, but I don't have any personal experience with this. What's the advantage of returning them to the top? Sounds like a lot of extra labor....

My thinking is to limit the chance of the aerobic soil biology crashing due to too much active food and not enough air. Not only is the food very rich, as it decomposes it loses volume. So your volume goes down as you oxygen requirement goes up. Doh!

If you mow the crop, till in some well finished compost, then mulch all the material, can you avoid that problem while still taking your shortcut?

harm reduction I guess? I havent tried it but I might convince someone to try. You can always till again if it doesn't work out.

Again i have to point out - and I have seen this - gardeners see what they want to see. So I almost always see a subsoil in need of rescue, while others might see a need for tilling. But I am sure I have seen many till for no good reason. Especially where I live - the soil is sand and silt 45/45, and it is really very easy to breathe some life into it. The weeds do it in a season if you let them.

In fact, all those weeds with the really deep taproots seem to work incredibly fast.

 

[CT Guy]

I do agree that people are way to quick to till. I've listed the only instance I would find it acceptable. Actually, as I type this I can think of one other. If you're growing a highly bacterial plant like annuals, veggies, etc...in soil that is highly fungal. That's it though, I swear!

 

[mad librettist]

I do agree that people are way to quick to till. I've listed the only instance I would find it acceptable. Actually, as I type this I can think of one other. If you're growing a highly bacterial plant like annuals, veggies, etc...in soil that is highly fungal. That's it though, I swear!

lol don't I know it!


I've had major tension and left a group that refuses to compost on site and instead buys compost made entirely from tree leaves.

The nightshades actually do ok, but the bacteria buddies just can't produce. ah well, for those who can't garden, there is always kale.

 

[JackTheGrower]

It seems to me that if the point where the time it takes the soil life to recover to the "before till" point exceeds the time it takes for the organic matter to break the hardpan naturally, then don't till. If that makes any sense at all.

I was obtaining these huge industrial sized trash bags of bedding from a mice and snake farm three times a week.

I tilled perhaps a hundred bags of pine and paper with all the biological intact into my front yard. It took me 4 months but I raised that hard pan up 6 inches and the lawn stayed green without water while the rest of the neighbourhood's yards turned brown ( water rationing )

I was asked by the water police if I was watering even.

So yes it's disruptive but if we add organic material and rock dusts + trace elements like green sand while we do it we pay for our sins in the long run.

Besides I stabbed my foot with crab grass and bled and I was tired of avoiding the yard for fear of injury.. So even though I do not live there now I do go by once in a while to admire the lawn.

Add organic material.. Get bales of alfalfa and oat hay.. The Oat hay will germinate ..

 

[mad librettist]

yah but ernst what if we could send roots just as far and leave them. lots of them.

 

[xmobotx]

there's places i double dug, places i drug a spring tooth cultivator, and places i m doing full-on no-till

plans are to continue w/ a cover crop strategy, mulching strategy and, weed root busting strategy

beyond that, i expect to observe and note locales where the "weeds" thrive moreso than surrounding plants and take advantage of those fertile spots

i dont expect to do any tilling

@ most, i will run around w/ the spring tooth (but only where i have been using it)

 

[Tactical Farmer]

Struck the shit goldmine today, driving back from my tri-weekly 20gal spring water run, decided to stop at a farm to see whats going down.

Farmer dude was harvesting an alfalfa field & his wife gave me the grand tour.

They are fully organic self sustained farmers with over 80 goats & lots of chickens with large drip irrigated garden, greenhouse, the works.

Fully solar powered farm selling power back to the grid on sunny days.

Huge piles of aged & fresh poo - free truck full of each for me.

Bought some homemade goats milk - yogurt & cheese to show my appreciation.

Going to drop off one of my pepper plants & half tempted to leave a green devil clone too

 

[kava]

wow where where I would like a tour too Well you might not want to tell too many ears and I wouldnt want them to know either. But man that sounds awfully interesting but I will bet it is on the west coast and I am not lol just my luck. It was just a thought. I fill my raised gardens with leaves and cover them with leaves (4 to 6 inches) then cover that with old scrap plywood. We let it sit all winter long. In the spring mix in the last of the leaves and add worm castings (because I got tons) and Rich Earth = micro nutrients and let mom plant till her little hearts content. (worms eat all of the leaves and take care of the hard work) No weeding needed and ready to plant when we take off the plywood.
But thats how we do it if I am not busy when we put the beds to rest. Hope that helps any for your gardens (I am on shale here only 1/2 inch of topsoil if that.) Take care and be safe.

 

[xmobotx]

that's interesting laying boards over the "put to sleep" garden in the fall

its always been amazing to me how quickly the worms and bugs start to fill the space under something laying on the ground

in the name of "cleaning up," we have found lots of EWC and nice looking black soil under boards and rocks and concrete blocks - lol

 

[mad librettist]

that's interesting laying boards over the "put to sleep" garden in the fall

its always been amazing to me how quickly the worms and bugs start to fill the space under something laying on the ground

in the name of "cleaning up," we have found lots of EWC and nice looking black soil under boards and rocks and concrete blocks - lol

what I've come to believe is that a properly cared for garden is more like your "put to sleep" garden. With all ground covered by living or dead material, the entire area is a protected zone for critters, just like under the board. Ok, it's not as protected, since it probably shelters predators. But it's close.

 

[xmobotx]

what I've come to believe is that a properly cared for garden is more like your "put to sleep" garden. With all ground covered by living or dead material, the entire area is a protected zone for critters, just like under the board. Ok, it's not as protected, since it probably shelters predators. But it's close.

when it's leaf or grass or weed matter (compost) i like to call it 'mulch'

if its a stick or a board or some solid item (even decorations) i like to call it 'habitat'

found a frog yesterday taking down our dog pen fence and it was under a board (along w/ [of course] EWC & worms/bugs)

 

[Tactical Farmer]

wow - getting that goat poo was a real ass kicker, well worth the time & labor though.

needed some exercise & got a nice tan in the process.

the goat poo was loaded with red worms & rotted straw.

met a kinda hot agricultural hippie intern working there also.

gonna go back once I figure out a plan.

damn girls, back to dirt - the yard is a freaking rock field, probably take me all summer to get it acceptable.

there like a max of 1 inch of decent top soil where the grass was but its pretty proper where I extended it into the woods.

got alot of compost built up already so its all going to get a good top dress of that & some peat bales once the rocks get sorted out.

made a goat crap / lawn clipping lazogni pile toady & got a 60 gal worn bin setup too.

the green devil really powered me through the day- thanks Tiki



upgrading to a larger heavy duty screener pretty soon also.

 

[mad librettist]

when it's leaf or grass or weed matter (compost) i like to call it 'mulch'

if its a stick or a board or some solid item (even decorations) i like to call it 'habitat'

found a frog yesterday taking down our dog pen fence and it was under a board (along w/ [of course] EWC & worms/bugs)

what about when its a living plant?

it's too funny that ornamental gardeners figured out ground cover ages ago

 

[Tactical Farmer]

found a frog yesterday taking down our dog pen fence and it was under a board (along w/ [of course] EWC & worms/bugs)

Frog manure, the rarest super potent natural fertilizer known to man..