Noob 220v questions

[QRDeNameland]

Let me start by saying this is my first time posting on icmag, and though I've learned a lot from lurking here over the years. However, if there's one topic I'm particularly dense about, it's electric, and I need some input on my situation, so lazyass that I am, I finally joined.

I'm in the process of setting up a grow room and want to run the lights under 220v, but don't have a ready source of 220 like a baseboard in the room. I had an electrician come in for an estimate to have a baseboard heater installed, and my only easy option would have been to tap into a 60 amp line that runs out to a sub panel in my shed. This line conveniently runs the length of the laundry room (easily accessible on the exposed ceiling) with a spiffy junction box in the area of my oil furnace, which adjoins the grow room. I've attached a rough diagram of the floor plan (25' x 38', roughly to scale), and a picture of the junction box.

The electrician's proposal was to come off the junction box and put in a second sub panel on the basement wall (adjacent the grow room and install a baseboard on the other side, plus any other circuits I might want. Now, I don't mind paying the electrician, but at the same time for obvious reasons if I could easily pull this off myself, I'd rather do that. I have a friend who I trust help with some wiring, but he's not an electrician and I don't know how comfortable he'd be setting up a sub panel. For instance I don't even know, is the sub panel necessary when coming off the 60 amp circuit, or is it possible to just branch off to a timer box at 60 amps?

So my goal is to get some advice on what options I have before asking the electrician whom I'm trying not to tip off to my true intentions.

What's the most brain-dead easy way to set this up? Obviously, I want it to be as safe as possible, but I'm not looking to draw more than 4-5kW, nor do I use much power in the shed. Please, any input would be greatly appreciated.

 

[dtfsux]

I dont know what kind of timer box you plan on using, but the intermatic hot water heater timers that alot of people use are rated at 40 amps I believe. I do not think you could run directly to one of those. And I dont know if it would accept that size wiring.

I would run to a sub panel, not hard at all. Seems like you have an easy access point. There are some DIY threads here on how to install a sub panel. Theres also a sticky up top.

 

[PharmaCan]

Are you planning on keeping power to the garage?

How much power do you use in the garage?

Are the wires for the 60 amp circuit in conduit? What size is the conduit?

What size is the wire for the 60 amp circuit?

PC

 

[QRDeNameland]

Thanks dtfsux and PharmaCan. I'm going to spend some time reading up on the sub panel threads, but I'm still a bit intimidated at the thought. Question...if I *could* locate a 60 amp timer, could I wire directly to that?

Answers to PharmaCan's questions:

>>Are you planning on keeping power to the garage?

It'd be nice if I could, but it wouldn't be a big deal to sacrifice shed power.

>>How much power do you use in the garage?

Hardly any. Lights and maybe the occasional small power tool. Nothing I couldn't substitute an extension cord from the house for, never mind anything that I would need 60 amps for.

>>Are the wires for the 60 amp circuit in conduit? What size is the conduit?

They go into a conduit right as they exit the house, I'd say 1 to 1.5 inch diameter. (In the photo above, the black wire is the one that goes to the shed.)

>>What size is the wire for the 60 amp circuit?

I don't have a wire gauge on hand, but the wire reads "AWG 6" and since the wire guide calls for #6 gauge for 60 amps, I'm going to go with that. The full markings on the wire is: "9/8/00 LL90458 CSA AWG 6 CU 3 CDRS NMD90 NYLON 300 VOLTS FT1". (This is the white wire in the photo, connects the main panel to the the junction box. The black wire appears to be the same gauge, but has no markings I can see.)

 

[PharmaCan]

How many amps do you intend to draw in the grow room? Remember that you are limited to 80% of whatever your system is rated.

A sub-panel really seems like the way to go, but that's easy for me to say because I could wire a sub-panel in my sleep.

There are actually a number of ways you could do this, but I'm not quite sure if you can legally split up the line leading to a sub-panel. You should go to the electrical sticky and ask MadPenguin about tapping into the shed line. (If it's not legal to split that line, you could just disconnect the shed and use that circuit for your grow room only.)

PC

 

[QRDeNameland]

I'm looking at using no more than 5000W total (probably more like 3000 in reality, but want to give myself some leeway), which by my math should only require 30 amps of draw. I'm confident that splitting off to a second panel is sound, as this is what the electrician suggested.

However, the more I'm reading on setting up a sub panel myself, the less confident I feel about attempting it. In the end, I need to be able to sleep at night. So I'm starting to lean back to biting the bullet and having the electrician install the sub panel and a baseboard heater and tap off that. The room really could use a heater anyway, so it's not a weird or suspicious thing to have the electrician do, plus I don't have anything going yet that I need to worry about him seeing. It's just that if there's a simple way that doesn't require bringing someone in, all the better.

I'll still take your suggestion to post on the sticky to MadPenguin, even if he has any advice on something to have the electrician do that I wouldn't even think of. Obviously, anything else you want to add is welcome as well.

Thanks for your help.

 

[PharmaCan]

It's not a matter of it will work as much as if it is legal. It's always better to keep things legal if at all possible.

Probably what I would do is replace that junction box with a sub-panel then change the shed to where it's only allowed 20 amps and your grow room gets 40 amps.

If you install a baseboard heater, the only thing you will have is a baseboard heater. Its wires and circuit won't be good for anything else.

Here's a DIY I did for a sub-panel. It's pretty basic but it gives you a pretty good idea of what it takes to install one.

PC